The Growth and Modernization of the PLAN since 2003

Preux

Junior Member
The 051Cs also have an important backup function - they are China's bargain sea-based S-300 ABM, and their job was to sit in the Gulf of Bohai and swat down North Korea missiles (because that really is the only missiles in the region that are both short range enough and primitive enough for the S-300 system to have a decent chance - the South Koreans and the Japanese didn't have SRBMs then, and US missiles are either too long range or in the case of depressed trajectory SLBM launches, far too hard to intercept), if and when... They also closed an important IADS gap in the area (there were two S-300 batteries plus multiple HQ-9 batteries, but a gap between the two peninsula - this has since lost most relevance but it doesn't hurt). The relevance of that function has since receded but it still serves an important link in the chain around the capital area.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
The 051Cs also have an important backup function - they are China's bargain sea-based S-300 ABM, and their job was to sit in the Gulf of Bohai and swat down North Korea missiles (because that really is the only missiles in the region that are both short range enough and primitive enough for the S-300 system to have a decent chance - the South Koreans and the Japanese didn't have SRBMs then, and US missiles are either too long range or in the case of depressed trajectory SLBM launches, far too hard to intercept), if and when... They also closed an important IADS gap in the area (there were two S-300 batteries plus multiple HQ-9 batteries, but a gap between the two peninsula - this has since lost most relevance but it doesn't hurt). The relevance of that function has since receded but it still serves an important link in the chain around the capital area.
I also believe that the two Type 051C were the PLAN's backup plan regarding the Type 052C vessels.

They could have been built in more numbers for long range, area anti-air coveraage for PLAN carrier and other groups if the Type 052Cs had not worked out.

But they did...and they did so well that not only did the PLAN ultimately build six of them (the Type 052Cs), but at the same time they came up with an improved design (the Type 052D) that the PLAN even feels better about and is building in large numbers. 12 of which are already launched, and IMHO, the total number will be 24 or higher.

I believe the Type 052D will, in essence be the PLAN Arliegh Burke Flight IIA destroyer.

While the new and even better Type 055 DDG will be the PLAN Ticonderoga cruiser,.
Anyhow, that's how it is shaping up to me.

And the Type 051C vessels are still there...and are very decent and capable destroyers which can add additional capability to any group they sail with.
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
I also believe that the two Type 051C were the PLAN's backup plan regarding the Type 052C vessels.

They could have been built in more numbers for long range, area anti-air coveraage for PLAN carrier and other groups if the Type 052Cs had not worked out.

But they did...and they did so well that not only did the PLAN ultimately build six of them (the Type 052Cs), but at the same time they came up with an improved design (the Type 052D) that the PLAN even feels better about and is building in large numbers. 12 of which are already launched, and IMHO, the total number will be 24 or higher.

I believe the Type 052D will, in essence be the PLAN Arliegh Burke Flight IIA destroyer.

While the new and even better Type 055 DDG will be the PLAN Ticonderoga cruiser,.
Anyhow, that's how it is shaping up to me.

And the Type 051C vessels are still there...and are very decent and capable destroyers which can add additional capability to any group they sail with.
Given their lack of AESA radars, I suspect the 051Cs will probably get downgraded to quadruple HHQ-16-style VLS modules at the B position during their midlife overhaul and spend the rest of their useful lives as (upgraded) 051Bs, perhaps even with reintroduction of dual hangars in the back once they remove all the Rif-M launchers.
 

schenkus

Junior Member
Registered Member
Given their lack of AESA radars, I suspect the 051Cs will probably get downgraded to quadruple HHQ-16-style VLS modules at the B position during their midlife overhaul and spend the rest of their useful lives as (upgraded) 051Bs, perhaps even with reintroduction of dual hangars in the back once they remove all the Rif-M launchers.

What would be the reason for the PLAN to pay for an expensive refit that downgrades the capabilities of the ships instead of just keeping them as they are ?

I would understand it if they could not get spare parts to keep the systems operational, but as the PLA is operating a number of S-300 batteries and relations with Russia are reasonably good I would assume that not to be a big problem.
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
What would be the reason for the PLAN to pay for an expensive refit that downgrades the capabilities of the ships instead of just keeping them as they are ?

I would understand it if they could not get spare parts to keep the systems operational, but as the PLA is operating a number of S-300 batteries and relations with Russia are reasonably good I would assume that not to be a big problem.
Ask those who refitted the Sovs why they gutted those ships and made everything indigenous (allegedly). I'm sure they could get the spare parts for Sovs from the Russians too. In any case the Rif-M as an air defense system is not very good on critical examination. It has a single Tombstone FCR which can only cover a single 90 degree arc at a time, which means it is exquisitely vulnerable to multi-axis saturation attacks. The Rif-M's minimum engagement altitude is only 25m which means every modern sea-skimming ASCM is going to get through totally unchallenged, leaving ECM and CIWS as the only defenses left standing, or it has to be escorted by ships that can provide SAMs to cover its multiple blind spots. China's proliferation of the 052C/D class means that long range air defense is no longer a critical problem for the PLAN as it was when the 051Cs were commissioned. For me all of this adds up to the 051C getting its Rif-M replaced by HHQ-16s during its overhaul, and you will have three 051B/Cs operating in the same fleet in the same manner (medium range air defense + ASW). I also suspect the Sovs and the 052Bs will end up the same way with similar missile/sensor outfits and missions after their refits.
 
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