the "artifical sun" made by china

darth sidious

Banned Idiot
FuManChu said:
So long as I don't have a crossed wire on what this is about, there's no way that China has got anything like a proper fusion reactor working. Perhaps they got a reaction by using more energy than it produced. But this is nothing new, because JET managed that years ago.

this will put your doubt to rest

在真空和低温条件就位后,从3月13日到3月得离子体所的相关人员对纵场磁体和12个极向场磁体分别进行了260 次通电测试。最长通电时间达到5000秒,最大电流达到8200安培,相对应的装置中心场强已达到2特斯拉。总控系统、真空系统、低温系统、数据采集系统、水冷系统、电源系统、装置技术诊断系统、失超保护、真空磁位形测量系统、超导传输线、高温超导电流引线、铜电流引线以及等离子体控制系统运行正常,保证了通电测试的安全和成功。

they got more energy out of it then you think
 

coolieno99

Junior Member
The superheated plasma(millions of degree F) is confined by a magnetic field created by superconductive magnets. The superconductive magnets are cooled to cryogenic temperature(extremely cold).
 

Aerodriver

New Member
Sorry I just can not see this being true, maybe a small scale reaction that required more energy than it made. For China to have made this leap, if it was true would be Headline news. If it is they managed to make a min sun, great so have loads of other countries, if it was self sustaining.....hmmmm just can not see that to be true. You need to remember there is an international project involving The People's Republic of China, the European Union and Switzerland (represented by Euratom), India, Japan, the Republic of Korea, the Russian Federation, and the United States of America, under the auspices of the IAEA.

It is technically ready to start construction and the first plasma operation is expected in 2016, in France at a total cost of 10 bil Euro.
So to suddenly say China has done it all on its own...no way...your dreaming
.
 

darth sidious

Banned Idiot
Aerodriver said:
Sorry I just can not see this being true, maybe a small scale reaction that required more energy than it made. For China to have made this leap, if it was true would be Headline news. If it is they managed to make a min sun, great so have loads of other countries, if it was self sustaining.....hmmmm just can not see that to be true. You need to remember there is an international project involving The People's Republic of China, the European Union and Switzerland (represented by Euratom), India, Japan, the Republic of Korea, the Russian Federation, and the United States of America, under the auspices of the IAEA.

It is technically ready to start construction and the first plasma operation is expected in 2016, in France at a total cost of 10 bil Euro.
So to suddenly say China has done it all on its own...no way...your dreaming
.

so acording to you china's most importent news paper is a lie !!!! please provide evidance
 
D

Deleted member 675

Guest
Gollevainen said:
is there any change that this info came out on 1st of April???

One liner - one liner!! :D

Darth, I don't know that it is a question of lying, but Chinese newspapers have a habit of simplying publishing official reports without really investigating it themselves. It is possible that this reactor, or whatever, has performed a bit better than other ones set up so far. But if it was doing anything revolutionary, the lab owners would be filling patents world-wide and everyone would hear about it. The real development will come from the International project that China has got involved with. If that doesn't work, I doubt we'll get fusion working anytime in the foreseeable future.
 

vincelee

Junior Member
the translation is flawed, here is the official version:

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China to build thermonuclear fusion reactor
By Yu Zheng (Xinhua)
Updated: 2005-07-01 08:38


A leading Chinese plasma physicist said Thursday China might build its own thermonuclear experimental reactor, which would be expected to supply sustained electricity for the world's most populous country.

While building their own sophisticated devices in thermonuclear reaction, Chinese scientists have already participated in the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (ITER), a testing step between today's plasma physics studies and tomorrow's electricity-producing fusion power plants.

The scientist, who has access to the ITER, said to Xinhua on condition of anominity, "The ultimate goal of the Chinese scientists is to build thermonuclear experimental reactors with their own efforts."

"International cooperative endeavors like the ITER make us keepabreast of the world's most advanced technologies," He said. "We're entitled to share all top-notch know-how once we enter the global consortium."

Using deuterium, which is in seawater, as fuel for reactions, a hydrogen plasma torus operating at over 100 million Celsius degrees will produce 500 megawatts of fusion power. The ITER, which means "the way" in Latin, is based on the idea.

All the commercialized nuclear reactors in the world were designed for fission, a process contrary to the ITER's fusion, and have to consume irrecycled mineral resources such as uranium and plutonium. Waste of fission reactors is radioactive while a fusionreaction is rather environment-friendly.

Chinese scientists started to develop a fusion operation torus four decades ago in mountains southwest of inland Sichuan Province.

In the late 1980s, the United States and Japan launched the ITER, which was joined by China in 2003. Among the six partners ofthe 10 billion-euro ambitious plan, the European Union will cover 50 percent of the total budget. The remaining five, the US, Japan,Russia, the Republic of Korea and China, will pay 10 percent each.

Since 2003, the Chinese team has mandated a batch of important missions. The ITER international coordinator, Japanese physicist Yasuo Shimomura said, "The work done by the Chinese is the most impressive."

The Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS) Institute of Plasma Physics is developing an Experimental Advanced Superconducting Tokamak (EAST), one prototype of the ITER.

The EAST, which costs 200 million yuan (24 million US dollars) and is scheduled for completion late this year, could operate at over 100 million Celcius degrees and produce electricity in a consecutive 1,000 seconds, which will be a world record.

"The EAST is the only prototype nearest to the ITER and will be unbeatable in at least one decade," an official with the CAS Bureau of Basic Research said.

After fierce diplomatic manoeuvers, the six partners agreed Tuesday in Moscow to construct the first ITER at Cadarache, near Aix-en-Provence, France, overriding Japan's competition for hosting the innovative reactor.

It is ready to start ITER construction and the first plasma operation might be in 2016. But the most optimistic estimation on first commercialization of ITER said it needs at least half a century.

After the deal was clinched in Moscow, Chinese Minister of Science and Technology Xu Guanhua said, "As China is short of energy, global research endeavors for energy supply solutions meetour strategic interest."
 

Aerodriver

New Member
Darth........I live in China, if there was any truth behind this I would have seen it because it would be all over the news. I have not seen it in any of the papers I read, and I have not seen it mentioned on CCTV. So if you want proof that it’s a lie.....the proof is simply because it is not all over the media in China and if it was true it would be. As much as you would like this story to be true, please take a small reality check this discovery would be equal to the moon landings, the first atomic bomb, discovering gravity etc etc. Putting the ball back in your court, can you prove it is true?
 

Mr_C

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Aerodriver said:
Darth........I live in China, if there was any truth behind this I would have seen it because it would be all over the news. I have not seen it in any of the papers I read, and I have not seen it mentioned on CCTV. So if you want proof that it’s a lie.....the proof is simply because it is not all over the media in China and if it was true it would be. As much as you would like this story to be true, please take a small reality check this discovery would be equal to the moon landings, the first atomic bomb, discovering gravity etc etc. Putting the ball back in your court, can you prove it is true?

I heard about this bit of news abt a month before April 1st, so therefore it would not be intended to be foolish suggest by a member earlier. Well i would not call this a lie just because it is not all over the news. Because most scientific research and breakthroughs will not make it into the news until the scientist can be completely sure that it works. And most scientist do talk alot of optimism at the first sign of a breakthrough, take "a cure for cancer" for example.
To assert that China came up with this all on its own is absurbed is also very incorrect because there is no such thing as developing anything by oneself. All technology and know-how are developed from previous knowledge learnt from everywhere.
In addition i heard that this new peice of Chinese technology was taken to England for testing along with the rest of international project. Thats why it was also mentioned in the BBC as mentioned by a member earlier. And regarding the question of patent...well it will be patent as long as it works reliably. And to preceive China as incapable of inventing new technology is a truly ignorant statement. Do not underestimate their capabilities.
 

RedMercury

Junior Member
Darth, from the bit of Chinese you quoted, it isn't clear whether the 8200 amp current is output from a fusion process or the current going through the magnetic coils. The rest of the text talks about testing the various subcomponents, so I think it is probably saying that the coils were tested successfully with 8200 amps. I recall reading elsewhere that the first experiments in "using" the device will be in July~August. And I think it is correct that if they actually did achieve higher output than input, it would be all over the news. As to the Chinese media lying about this, it's probably more of a translation issue or inaccuracy in reading Chinese.
 
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