US F/A-XX and F-X 6th Gen Aircraft News Thread

[Nilou]

There isn't much need to worry about NGAD for China in my opinion. Date of entry into service isn't too important, as there will only be a few fighters produced by that point. By then, there will be hundreds of J-20s which will be more than enough to secure air dominance. The main reason why the NGAD is so important for America is not performance, but rather range. They need a fighter like the J-20 with range to actually pursue the offensive missions they imagine.
The F-35 and F-22 are not ideal for the US in Asia. Their range and endurance are totally inadequate for the Pacific theatre.

 

[TK3600]

I think long range will not be limited to US 6th gen. Chinese 6th gen will also be long range. China lacking in oversea basd will want expand its influence. US has the base but they are too close too vulnerable.

 

[Nilou]

I think long range will not be limited to US 6th gen. Chinese 6th gen will also be long range. China lacking in oversea basd will want expand its influence. US has the base but they are too close too vulnerable.

The main thing is that J-20 has already had long range from the beginning. In this respect, China has actually leapfrogged the US in terms of air capabilties in the Pacific. The United States are ironically the ones that need to catch up in the air domain now.

 

[SlothmanAllen]

Posted in the US Military News thread, but figured will post here as well. The US Air Force expects to award the contract for NGAD in 2024.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1659244156730867719

 

[gelgoog]

Are there any news on when the fly off will happen? From what I understand thus far they have only flown the equivalent of early X-planes for NGAD.

 

[SlothmanAllen]

Are there any news on when the fly off will happen? From what I understand thus far they have only flown the equivalent of early X-planes for NGAD.

My understanding is the EMD means you like have had or are in the process of the fly off between the selected competitors. So if that is to happen in the next 12 months, I would think the competition phase might be underway or already concluded.

 

[anzha]

My understanding is the EMD means you like have had or are in the process of the fly off between the selected competitors. So if that is to happen in the next 12 months, I would think the competition phase might be underway or already concluded.

Or they could have just had sufficient prototypes/X-planes to verify. There are rumors the B-21 program had almost full scale demonstrators flown by BoLock and NorthGrum, but ones that were not quite the real bird.

 

[SlothmanAllen]

Or they could have just had sufficient prototypes/X-planes to verify. There are rumors the B-21 program had almost full scale demonstrators flown by BoLock and NorthGrum, but ones that were not quite the real bird.

Agreed! I was going to mention something along those lines. I guess we really don't know how NGAD will progress in relation to past programs. I suspect that they want to reduce risk as much as possible, so I am not sure this will be as big of a leap as from F-15 to F-22.

I think NGAD will be based around a relatively large airframe that focuses on range and stealth. I think it will be in the 48,000lb+ (e.g. F-111 or Su-34) empty weight class. Which may bring it more in line with a fighter/bomber as opposed to just a strict fighter. I suspect, dual seat versions will be on the way as well, especially when the Air Force is openly calling them to be mixed with Loyal Wingman (drones).

 

[anzha]

Agreed! I was going to mention something along those lines. I guess we really don't know how NGAD will progress in relation to past programs. I suspect that they want to reduce risk as much as possible, so I am not sure this will be as big of a leap as from F-15 to F-22.

IDK what to expect. However, much earlier in the thread, I predicted based on budgetary analysis of the trends around 2021 or 2022, there would be a selection. That was pre Covid though. The budget numbers when adjusted for the idea this was a fighter than a bomber tracked the B-21 spending trends.

I think NGAD will be based around a relatively large airframe that focuses on range and stealth. I think it will be in the 48,000lb+ (e.g. F-111 or Su-34) empty weight class.

F-111 to B-58 size. Very long range: refueling around Guam for missions on the Chinese coast type range. All aspect stealth. Perhaps clever work with IR and optical signatures. DEW. Very deep magazine: more than the number of missiles currently carried, but internally. Variable cycle engines. I doubt it will able to pull even 6 Gs. Crew of 2 to 4. Loyal wingmen. Lots of them.

My bets at least.

 

[antiterror13]

Looks like 6th gen still hasn't selected a vendor yet.

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I do find it surprising it's taken them this long. Both F-22 and F-35 took about a year from first X plane taking off to selection. This is taking at least 2 years. F-22/F-35 took about 5 to 6 years from selecting vendor to first prototype flight. In both cases, it took another 8 to 10 years from different variants to go from first flight to IOC. Even if they are faster than F-22/F-35 for both stages, but more than F-15 ( 3 and 4 years for the 2 phases) Let's say 4 years and 6 years. It would still not be delivered for evaluation until very end of this decade and achieve IOC until 2033. I find the 2030 projection to be a little too optimistic for a complicated new design like this.

China might beat the US to fly 6th Gen jet fighter ... I do hope so .... probably with interim engine WS-15x