US F/A-XX and F-X 6th Gen Aircraft News Thread

[FORBIN]

Yep, Mr. Brumby is way to smart for "guys like us", but sadly in the past, all these smart ideas end up "biting us in the butt"..... like the philosophy that "we don't need an internal gun, we can do it all with AAM"

Statistics say all these things are true, but real life in NEVER, say NEVER! The F-35 is a LO end 5th Gen, that is what it was designed to be. The F-22 is a HI end 5th Gen, that is what it was designed to be. We fail to realize that all these policy wonks are politicians or statisticians, and all of these sweeping changes are put forth in order to appeal to politicians who control funding.

In the real world, the F-22 continues to beat the F-35, which continues to beat all the re-hashed fourth gens.

But F-35A/C better as F-22 for A2G missions :=)

This project from Airbus for a new fighter is right now for replaced Germans Tornado, 85 IDS/ECR modernized remains in service with Typhoon up to 2040 normaly.

In France right now planned/rumors a new variant of Rafale no F3R for 2018 one other for 2030 with CFT and pods for weapons as Advanced Super Hornet in fact low observable but no Stealth.

If you want have a Stealth you need buil a more big for host weapons bay eventualy also more fuel replacing FT and ofc more expensive.

One other South Korean KFX right now don' t have a weapons bays.

 

[Air Force Brat]

In a broad sense yes, if I were flying into heavily defended airspace, no doubt I would take the F-22, and yes it has been very effective with the J-Dams, etc, and yes it is a much more survivable airframe, and hence "MUCH BETTER"! LOL

The F-35 is obviously going to be #2.

There is at present no new super-wazoo tech that is driving the sixth gen development, I would without any reservations whatsoever, place a Raptor up-grade back into production immediately in light of the sorry present relations with our near peers. The Raptor could be improved upon, number one I rather doubt I would build the Renaissance Raptor with OVT, I like it, but??? I believe its likely you could produce more dry thrust, with more fuel and less weight without it.

I would open up the weapons magazine and likely incorporate the HMS system, but I would keep the HUD.

I am not for abandoning the 6th Gen, and there must be a sixth gen eventually, but for today, the Raptor is still numero UNO!

 

[Bernard]

In a broad sense yes, if I were flying into heavily defended airspace, no doubt I would take the F-22, and yes it has been very effective with the J-Dams, etc, and yes it is a much more survivable airframe, and hence "MUCH BETTER"! LOL

The F-35 is obviously going to be #2.

There is at present no new super-wazoo tech that is driving the sixth gen development, I would without any reservations whatsoever, place a Raptor up-grade back into production immediately in light of the sorry present relations with our near peers. The Raptor could be improved upon, number one I rather doubt I would build the Renaissance Raptor with OVT, I like it, but??? I believe its likely you could produce more dry thrust, with more fuel and less weight without it.

I would open up the weapons magazine and likely incorporate the HMS system, but I would keep the HUD.

I am not for abandoning the 6th Gen, and there must be a sixth gen eventually, but for today, the Raptor is still numero UNO!

Just from my point of view of what 6 gen should be coming from someone who loves this stuff as a hobby and no military education or experience. I think 6 gen systems of systems should be the following:

1) No new manned aircraft platforms
2) AFB idea of super raptor back into production maybe not asap with the development of upgrades and replacing 90's tech hopefully by 2025.
3) Super Raptor exportable and developable with closest allies
4) develop next generation systems to go with it a2a weapons, harp, mald-j, jammers, electronic attack, ecm, HMD, etc
5) pair it with next gen unmanned drones
6) develop naval F-22 for Navy 6th gen program.
7) Upgrade Super Raptor and F-35D with ADVENT engines (Nine years from now think it'll be developed?)
8) Develop F-22 Space Raptor pair with orbital bombardment, add lasers, invisibility (jk lol)

 

[FORBIN]

This project from Airbus for a new fighter is right now for replaced Germans Tornado, 85 IDS/ECR modernized remains in service with Typhoon up to 2040 normaly.

Airbus studying manned successor for German Tornados

Airbus Defence & Space is eyeing a potential opportunity for European industry to develop a next-generation combat aircraft to replace the German air force’s Panavia Tornado fleet post-2030.

“Some months ago, the German MoD prepared a strategic defence capability roadmap, and they are looking for something to replace capabilities to fill the gap that will come with the replacement of the Tornado,” says Alberto Gutierrez, Airbus Group’s head of Eurofighter and combat aircraft programmes. “They have asked us to investigate what potentially could be the solution.”

Airbus believes the operational environment in 2030-2040 could require the use of a combination of manned fighters and unmanned aircraft. Described by the company as “mules”, the latter could perform roles such as reconnaissance, target acquisition, electronic warfare and even air strikes.
“We are currently working with the German air force on customer needs,” Gutierrez says. “We are thinking about something that will enter into service by 2030.”

Airbus Defence & Space’s early concept involves the use of a two-seat fighter, with one crew member to be responsible for command and control and manned-unmanned teaming tasks.

Speaking at the company’s Ottobrun site near Munich on 20 June, Gutierrez said: “What we cannot afford to do is a completely start-from-scratch aircraft. We are talking about the re-use of certain [Eurofighter] components and looking at what we are doing in our development cycles, for more prototyping. We are looking at a varying portfolio of new technologies.”

Gutierrez believes a joint development activity – such as that used on the four-nation Eurofighter programme – will “bring solidarity to our countries, and also secure our defence-industrial base and encourage growth".

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[Bernard]

I love the eagerness of these Defense corporations, and other countries who say they are developing or planning on doing a 6th gen concept aircraft. But I just don't see it plausible when no country in the world has been able mass produce 5th gen air craft at affordable and sustainable rates. (U.S I'd say was unsustainable, even then that is one of minor reasons it t'was cancelled.) And with all the problems we are having with the F-35. Just my 2 half pennies.

Unless the world's brightest young, veteran F-22/F-35 engineers and aero defense corporations all come together under one roof from our closest allies. #Dream

(I am sorry about all the futuristic talk it's one of my favorite areas of my military tech hobby. My imagination let's me forget the rough week I have had with a recent death the family. )

#EDIT# Just read this part

What we cannot afford to do is a completely start-from-scratch aircraft. We are talking about the re-use of certain [Eurofighter] components and looking at what we are doing in our development cycles, for more prototyping. We are looking at a varying portfolio of new technologies.”

Gutierrez believes a joint development activity – such as that used on the four-nation Eurofighter programme – will “bring solidarity to our countries, and also secure our defense-industrial base and encourage growth".

Now go back to what I said why not have a multi country development that are all in our alliance team up and upgrade and re-use the F-35 or F-22??? But corporation's like $$$$

 

[Equation]

I love the eagerness of these Defense corporations, and other countries who say they are developing or planning on doing a 6th gen concept aircraft. But I just don't see it plausible when no country in the world has been able mass produce 5th gen air craft at affordable and sustainable rates. (U.S I'd say was unsustainable, even then that is one of minor reasons it t'was cancelled.) And with all the problems we are having with the F-35. Just my 2 half pennies.

Unless the world's brightest young, veteran F-22/F-35 engineers and aero defense corporations all come together under one roof from our closest allies. #Dream

(I am sorry about all the futuristic talk it's one of my favorite areas of my military tech hobby. My imagination let's me forget the rough week I have had with a recent death the family. )

#EDIT# Just read this part


Now go back to what I said why not have a multi country development that are all in our alliance team up and upgrade and re-use the F-35 or F-22??? But corporation's like $$$$

ONLY when aliens from outer space arrives will we see a 6th gen in mass production.

This is from the Independence Day 2 trailer.

 

[Brumby]

System of systems air warfare

 

[SamuraiBlue]

System of systems air warfare

Basically this is the same swarm concept that was proposed in the i3 fighter proposal by TDRI of Japan dubbed "TACOM" a New Air-Launched Multi-Purpose (Assault Scout, Electronic Warfare, Unmanned Combat Air Vehicle, Target Drone, etc...) Stealth Unmanned Air Vehicles (UAV) and had already started testing the first stage.

 

[Air Force Brat]

Just from my point of view of what 6 gen should be coming from someone who loves this stuff as a hobby and no military education or experience. I think 6 gen systems of systems should be the following:

1) No new manned aircraft platforms
2) AFB idea of super raptor back into production maybe not asap with the development of upgrades and replacing 90's tech hopefully by 2025.
3) Super Raptor exportable and developable with closest allies
4) develop next generation systems to go with it a2a weapons, harp, mald-j, jammers, electronic attack, ecm, HMD, etc
5) pair it with next gen unmanned drones
6) develop naval F-22 for Navy 6th gen program.
7) Upgrade Super Raptor and F-35D with ADVENT engines (Nine years from now think it'll be developed?)
8) Develop F-22 Space Raptor pair with orbital bombardment, add lasers, invisibility (jk lol)

Good ideas except for number one, the "MAN" in the cockpit is still the vital part of the equation, now if you are saying the Raptor is unlikely to be matched by any of the new aircraft on the drawing board, you may well be right.

Unmanned, Tailless aircraft will always be a "step down" in the near future, and one that is a distraction, the clear vision of "air superiority" must be maintained by those who understand the challenges!

We are still crashing a large number of RPV's doing very mundane things?? and the Iranians likely were able to "sabotage" our stealthy rpv that they captured, so unmanned is NOT the answer, it just isn't.

So, lets not throw the baby out with the bath-water, we need to plan for a manned very high performance fighter aircraft, and it is helpful to call it a sixth gen, aviation is just barely into its second century, no need to rush the future or throw away the past.

 

[Jura The idiot]

hey Brumby got something for your

System of systems air warfare

Combat Air Patrol of the Red Force:

Anti-Radiation Missiles of the Red Force:

LOL