Type 055 DDG Large Destroyer Thread


Bltizo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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Unless the ship is a test vehicle then there really is no point in limiting the potential of the VLS. The "universal" aspect of its weapons is arguably the greatest change imparted to the ship's capabilities.
We call it universal, but who are we to know which missiles have been or will be integrated? SYLVER too is multirole yet few countries have decided to use its full potential. Costs and politics may similarly limit 052Ds VLS — or at the very least the threat of it means we shouldn't jump to tr conclusion that the VLS is immediately going to be fitted with every type of missile once it enters service
 

MwRYum

Captain
Truth to be told we don't know if the new VLS is indeed "that" universal, but if it is so, for the first PLAN has a surface combatant that has a sizeable offensive punch potential, one that beyond against naval targets but to land targets up to hundreds of klicks inland.
 

Bltizo

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The word universal is misleading i think. Rather, "having the software and hardware design flexibility to include new weapons as they emerge" is a better term. In this way I think mk-41, SYLVER, mk 57, 052Ds CCL VLS are all equally universal. Now the real challenge is whether the VLS is designed with enough physical space and venting to provide larger new generation missiles to be hot launched. That is a big reason why mk-57 was developed, to accommodate newer missiles with bigger exhausts that mk-41 can't handle

The CCL VLS gets around this by having both a hot and cold launch option. The benefit of cold launch is that the booster only ignites once its driven out of the cell by a piston, meaning bigger missiles with bigger and hotter exhausts can be fitted compared with hot launch VLS with smaller exhausts
 

SinoSoldier

Colonel
¦^��: Type 055 DDG - PLAN's Next Generation Destroyer Thread

Possibly the YJ18 or HQ26. Might be a canted launcher though.
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i.e.

Senior Member
The word universal is misleading i think. Rather, "having the software and hardware design flexibility to include new weapons as they emerge" is a better term. In this way I think mk-41, SYLVER, mk 57, 052Ds CCL VLS are all equally universal. Now the real challenge is whether the VLS is designed with enough physical space and venting to provide larger new generation missiles to be hot launched. That is a big reason why mk-57 was developed, to accommodate newer missiles with bigger exhausts that mk-41 can't handle

The CCL VLS gets around this by having both a hot and cold launch option. The benefit of cold launch is that the booster only ignites once its driven out of the cell by a piston, meaning bigger missiles with bigger and hotter exhausts can be fitted compared with hot launch VLS with smaller exhausts
Venting is less of an issue with cold launch.

one could design a cold launch system where the gas generator is nothing but a slower burning pyro charge., after ignition the gas expands and push the missile out via a ejector base. the problem is sometimes the vls slot is not strong enough to take the pressure of ignition. one could theoritically design a sleeve for the missile such as a bullet cartridge but that takes valuable space out of VLS.

cold launch also pose issues for the missile itself. at least the Guidiance navigation and control part. where essentially missile system itself is starting not from rigid platform but from a suspended mid air position where its attitude can vary considerably. complicated but not impossible.

in the old days where the SAM are pretty dumb. it has to align itself with the direction of the beam (radio beam riders) or lined up pretty nicely with the returns on the radar illuminator (SARH). or else it would just fly into the ocean. then comes the autopilot but that requires you align the gyro and warm up the electronics nicely before let it fly.

This day and age the missile designers are spoiled. they can essentially buy ready built solid state INS systems size of a watch and get reasonable performance out them, and write everything in C++,

n the olden days you actually has to design the software via vaccum tubes!...I digress...
 

i.e.

Senior Member
We call it universal, but who are we to know which missiles have been or will be integrated? SYLVER too is multirole yet few countries have decided to use its full potential. Costs and politics may similarly limit 052Ds VLS — or at the very least the threat of it means we shouldn't jump to tr conclusion that the VLS is immediately going to be fitted with every type of missile once it enters service
more likely every type of missile from now onward is "required" to fit into the the new VLS slot.

from physics and kinetics, unless PLAN requires a missile from a ship to hit a geostationary target... the current dimensions are good enough for the foreseeable future. remember solid propellant and scram jet technology is evolving rapidly too. which would grow the range and lessen the volume.

the real size stretcher would be LACMs. a 2000 km range LACM?
 

MwRYum

Captain
more likely every type of missile from now onward is "required" to fit into the the new VLS slot.

from physics and kinetics, unless PLAN requires a missile from a ship to hit a geostationary target... the current dimensions are good enough for the foreseeable future. remember solid propellant and scram jet technology is evolving rapidly too. which would grow the range and lessen the volume.

the real size stretcher would be LACMs. a 2000 km range LACM?
There has yet been solid confirmation of Chinese cruise missile have naval (surface or submarine) launch variant, only ground and air-launch variants, however if and when naval launch variant is introduced it'd not just be a logical evolution, but giving PLAN major naval combatants true offensive capability that, to this day, only available to so few nations; if it has nuclear warhead variant then it'd be even more ground-shaking, because from that day onwards, any PLAN 052D DDG or its successor that set sail could be carrying LACM into the fray. Even nations with modern air defence network won't take LACM strike scenario likely.
 

FarkTypeSoldier

Junior Member
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So right now the PLAN's surface combantant could only hit sea targets but not land targets? Or is it limited capabilities of hitting land targets far away?
 
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i.e.

Senior Member
So right now the PLAN's surface combantant could only hit sea targets but not land targets? Or is it limited capabilities of hitting land targets far away?
They can just use those C803 containers and load them up with equivalent round with GPS and INS guidance (may be an IR at end) and delete the seeker.
 

MwRYum

Captain
So right now the PLAN's surface combantant could only hit sea targets but not land targets? Or is it limited capabilities of hitting land targets far away?
That's a no, in terms of land attack it'd be the deck guns but as you'd realise, it won't have reach beyond the shoreline. Also, by today's standard frigates and destroyers don't do shore bombardment duty anymore, since most cases the defenders can muster considerable direct and indirect firepower to shore targets.

Once PLAN can bring LACM, it'd be the first time the Chinese navy have such offensive reach towards inland targets, more so bring in with relative precision. With LACM potential, major players in the region will really have to give serious consideration towards any PLAN vessel that has the new common VLS system.
 

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