Listing RMB as $USYou've just gotten very opinionated about this. I see the essence of your argument as "the OICW didn't work out, the K-11 didn't work out, therefore it follows that the QTS-11 didn't work out.
The QTS-11 is supposed to weigh about 11 pounds loaded, with rangefinder and computer FCS, but without optics, roughly the same as the weight of the XM5 assault rifle.
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As to shotgun rounds:
There's also claims of armor-piercing rounds (anti-vehicle). With that in mind, do you see my point about how the QTS-11, even if it fails, isn't in the same direction as the OICW?
In Chinese, it's a "strategic firearm", insofar as it drastically expands the capabilities of light infantry.
A lot of the information concerning the QTS-11, I think, is from Western sources who are half jealous and half skeptical of the QTS-11. For instance, somehow there's a claim that the QTS-11 costs around 75,000 USD a piece. The original OICW was supposed to cost 10,000 USD, so how the hell did a Chinese clone / knock-off exceed that price? And our original numbers were 5 kg, but somewhere the weight rose to 14 lbs.
QTS-11 OICW. 5.8 mm Heavy and 20 mm Air Burst.
- Thread starter tanlixiang28776
- Start date
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
XM25 did that but it was still semi automatic the loaded package came to 14 pounds.
For clarification the XM5 rifle without optics but with suppressor is 9.85 lbs.
The problem with such is although the carbine weight would be removed from the rifle.
But Your soldier will add that weight back on as now they will need to carry a second weapon. That’s why they build these as over under weapons configuration. This was one of the issues with the XM25. Where in units issued for field trials found that it became an encumbrance as they still needed to carry an M4A1.
Woozle effect- Named for a Winy the Poo story. Where in Poo and Piglet follow a series of tracks they believe to be a Woozle. Later Christopher Robbin talks with Poo and investigates determined that Poo and Piglet were in fact following their own tracks.
The Woozle effect is where A clam is “backed” by a citation of a citation that has a weak provenance. This is sometimes referred to as a Woozle.
This leads to confirmation bias. A common occurrence in the modern era as the Media will often cite each other.
This is why using forum claims is often frowned upon. As statements made may be made based on Woozles like Wikipedia, off hand comments, outright propaganda and uninformed so called Experts.
This is why I am calling “Sus” on much of this latest conversation.
You're not registered on CDF; you can look up the original thread. And it was Blitzo who did the CDF blog write-up on the then ZH-05, and there's discussions involving Tony Williams of on the weapon.
If we're going to get around poo-pooing the QTS-11, here are the clear facts:
--The OICW failed. The descendant XM25 project failed as well. So did the K11.
--The QTS-11 is not certain to have failed yet, given that we've seen plenty of exploration of its employment, including what seems to be all-QTS-11 reconnaissance / special operations squads.
--The QTS-11 has different characteristics than the OICW / XM25.
---The point I originally intended to make was that the QTS-11 has a lower rate of fire than both the OICW / XM25. Trying to divert my claim to the erroneous claim that the XM29 or K11 were semiautomatic is strawmanning; the essential claim is that the QTS-11 is bolt-action, magazineless, and consequently has a longer firing cycle.
---The lower weight of the QTS-11 suggests its role is best as a primary armament, not as a squad support weapon as with the K11 or OICW. The QTS-11 saves at least a pound of weight simply by not having a magazine; i.e, the magazine has heft, so do the additional grenades. Dropping to a single-shot bolt-action moves a considerable part of this heft away from the weapon, keeping it wieldy.
---As mentioned before, you can simply reference the Blitzo article for reference to the existence of a shotgun round: