That picture must have 783 behind 782, and 781 is already off to somewhere. I guess three of this particular class. 233 is a catamaran that also does ocean surveillance but is a different class.
PLAN ASW Capability
- Thread starter shen
- Start date
That picture must have 783 behind 782, and 781 is already off to somewhere. I guess three of this particular class. 233 is a catamaran that also does ocean surveillance but is a different class.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Interesting article by Lyle Goldstein dated Nov 2019 but still relevant His thesis is China is planning to use UAV as anti sub platform based on recent article in Chinese naval research institute. Remarkably they foresee this anti sub UAV operated from Carrier!
But the most remarkable part of this particular discussion is the recognition that these UAVs might well operate from Chinese aircraft carriers. That is a rather bold call given that China has yet to demonstrate success in operating UAVs from aircraft carriers, but it does neatly illustrate Beijing’s priority on protecting its new capital ships, as noted in this paper’s introduction
It is a collaborative research project between the Naval Command College in Nanjing and the Naval Aeronautical University in Yantai. The research focuses on the potential for UAVs to support an MPA in the “cooperative use of sono-buoys for the purposes of conducting a submarine search.”
The recent rumor of emal installation on type 76 and the sighting of UAH Heli mockup on type 75LHD could support this contention. Instead of fancy UAV darksword they might just use CH5 as ASW platform just like the American trial of MQ9 maritime. check this excellent animation of how to use UAV for ASW
American Submarines Are in the Crosshairs of China
China will deploy a force of aerial drones to stalk American submarines in the Western Pacific.
by
China has been steadily improving its anti-submarine warfare (ASW) capabilities to cope with a perceived, major asymmetry in undersea warfare capabilities. Additionally, when Beijing began filling out its navy with major surface combatants, including aircraft carriers, cruisers and now large amphibious attack ships, there has been a rather visible and understandable uptick in Chinese attempts to protect these new investments from submarine attack.
Some of these developments in Chinese ASW over the last decade have included building a formidable force of light frigates that are equipped with towed sonar arrays, a vertically launched “rocket torpedo” as a standard weapon in its fleet, a new maritime patrol aircraft (MPA) that is optimized for ASW and ocean bottom sensor networks in and around its key naval bases. Some coming attractions in this area will include a new of Chinese ASW helicopters (both Z-18 and Z-20), as well as a system of unmanned undersea (UUVs) that will perform various missions, including especially surveillance and laying sea-mines, at least at the outset.
Now, a new threat to the dominance of the U.S. submarine force in the Western Pacific lies over the horizon. A series of recent articles published in China implies that the PLA Navy is hard at work on developing unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) that will take up the ASW mission. That could eventually pose a major problem for the undersea forces of the United States and also for the forces of its allies.
One article, in the Chinese journal Fire Control & Command [火力与指挥控制] in mid-July, is a collaborative research project between the Naval Command College in Nanjing and the Naval Aeronautical University in Yantai. The research focuses on the potential for UAVs to support an MPA in the “cooperative use of sono-buoys for the purposes of conducting a submarine search.” The article explains that sono-buoys are one of the main tools for hunting submarines, especially over a large sea area. These authors project that “Given the wide array of possibilities to employ UAVs, it’s quite possible that they will play a large role in the future of anti-submarine warfare [随着无人机的广泛运用在未来反潜作战中很可能发挥重要角色].”
This analysis begins by discussing various advantages and disadvantages of manned MPAs for ASW, such as the U.S. Navy’s vaunted P-8 Poseidon. Not only can that aircraft carry 120 sono-buoys, but it is capable of monitoring 60 of these buoys simultaneously, according to this Chinese rendering. Such aircraft are capable of “independent” missions against submarines, as they can conduct search, track, and attack functions. However, there is a fly in the ointment, of course, and this analysis emphasizes that such lumbering aircraft themselves have minimal self-defense capability and thus “may very easily become targets of attack [很容易被作为攻击目标]” by enemy interceptors. Another problem is that the length of the missions can be exceedingly taxing for the crews, so that the overall submarine search efficiency of the aircraft may decrease.
The argument is made in this Chinese analysis that unmanned aircraft can be of considerable assistance in such circumstances. It is said that UAVs frequently fly for more than forty hours but are capable of flights that last over days or even weeks. While generally not fast moving, they are still considerably faster than surface ships that are also employed for the ASW mission. It is projected, moreover, that they may sometimes be able to fly over air defenses. But the biggest selling point for UAVs in this role is that they are so much cheaper than both submarine-hunting large MPAs, and quite obviously also their quarry, the submarines. In other words, such economical approaches to the undersea rivalry in the Western Pacific could put Beijing on the right end of a “cost-imposition” strategy.
This Chinese analysis, moreover, implies that unmanned aircraft need not accomplish all aspects of the ASW mission. They could play the reasonably simple role of information relay platforms. They could also help to reduce the complexity of the daunting tasks that currently confront MPA crews. Of course, they could also take greater risks by entering “situations of contested airspace [敌空中威胁情况].” Lower costs, naturally enough, also mean that many airframes, coordinating together, could be deployed for any given search operation. Mathematical modeling of ASW operations in this piece yields the conclusion that UAVs do significantly increase the efficiency of submarine hunting.
A second article, from a late 2018 of Chinese Journal of Ship Research [中国舰船研究], endeavors to explore the “search/attack submarine integration [搜攻潜一体化]” functions of a fixed-wing UAV for ASW by studying the issue of optimizing payloads. This author, from the Jiangsu Automation Research Institute, asserts that “all navies are reforming ASW models.” He contends that there is an “urgent need for greater range, larger search areas, longer search periods, as well as cheaper methods of sensing, detection, tracking, and prosecuting submarines.” The paper discusses some foreign designs, including the U.S military’s UAV.
Owing mostly to the cost issue, this analysis also holds that UAVs for ASW have “obvious advantages” over manned aircraft. Interestingly, this Chinese study asserts that “weaponization is the basic trend for fixed-wing unmanned ASW aircraft [武器化是固定翼反潜无人机的基本特点].” But the most remarkable part of this particular discussion is the recognition that these UAVs might well operate from Chinese aircraft carriers. That is a rather bold call given that China has yet to demonstrate success in operating UAVs from aircraft carriers, but it does neatly illustrate Beijing’s priority on protecting its new capital ships, as noted in this paper’s introduction. Reviewing sample flight profiles, this analysis sees an ASW UAV that is capable of a patrol radius of six hundred kilometers for its land-based variant and perhaps three hundred kilometers for its carrier-based variant.
The above articles offer a glimpse of yet more coming attractions from the Chinese Navy. Indeed, the naval air arm of the PLA Navy is now starting to make rapid progress in line with its subsurface and surface forces. This news is quite disturbing as it fits a developing pattern of Beijing employing its new prowess in artificial intelligence to solve difficult battlefield dilemmas. What’s still more troubling is that if Chinese missiles and aircraft succeed in destroying U.S. and allied airbases in the Western Pacific during the initial phase of any military contingency, whether over Taiwan or the South China Sea, that might well leave myriad Chinese drone aircraft the freedom to roam and aggressively stalk previously nearly invulnerable American submarines.
Lyle J. Goldstein is Research Professor in the China Maritime Studies Institute (CMSI) at the United States Naval War College in Newport, RI. In addition to Chinese, he also speaks Russian and he is also an affiliate of the new Russia Maritime Studies Institute (RMSI) at Naval War College. You can reach him at [email protected]. The opinions in his columns are entirely his own and do not reflect the official assessments of the U.S. Navy or any other agency of the U.S. government.
But the most remarkable part of this particular discussion is the recognition that these UAVs might well operate from Chinese aircraft carriers. That is a rather bold call given that China has yet to demonstrate success in operating UAVs from aircraft carriers, but it does neatly illustrate Beijing’s priority on protecting its new capital ships, as noted in this paper’s introduction
It is a collaborative research project between the Naval Command College in Nanjing and the Naval Aeronautical University in Yantai. The research focuses on the potential for UAVs to support an MPA in the “cooperative use of sono-buoys for the purposes of conducting a submarine search.”
The recent rumor of emal installation on type 76 and the sighting of UAH Heli mockup on type 75LHD could support this contention. Instead of fancy UAV darksword they might just use CH5 as ASW platform just like the American trial of MQ9 maritime. check this excellent animation of how to use UAV for ASW
American Submarines Are in the Crosshairs of China
China will deploy a force of aerial drones to stalk American submarines in the Western Pacific.
by
China has been steadily improving its anti-submarine warfare (ASW) capabilities to cope with a perceived, major asymmetry in undersea warfare capabilities. Additionally, when Beijing began filling out its navy with major surface combatants, including aircraft carriers, cruisers and now large amphibious attack ships, there has been a rather visible and understandable uptick in Chinese attempts to protect these new investments from submarine attack.
Some of these developments in Chinese ASW over the last decade have included building a formidable force of light frigates that are equipped with towed sonar arrays, a vertically launched “rocket torpedo” as a standard weapon in its fleet, a new maritime patrol aircraft (MPA) that is optimized for ASW and ocean bottom sensor networks in and around its key naval bases. Some coming attractions in this area will include a new of Chinese ASW helicopters (both Z-18 and Z-20), as well as a system of unmanned undersea (UUVs) that will perform various missions, including especially surveillance and laying sea-mines, at least at the outset.
Now, a new threat to the dominance of the U.S. submarine force in the Western Pacific lies over the horizon. A series of recent articles published in China implies that the PLA Navy is hard at work on developing unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) that will take up the ASW mission. That could eventually pose a major problem for the undersea forces of the United States and also for the forces of its allies.
One article, in the Chinese journal Fire Control & Command [火力与指挥控制] in mid-July, is a collaborative research project between the Naval Command College in Nanjing and the Naval Aeronautical University in Yantai. The research focuses on the potential for UAVs to support an MPA in the “cooperative use of sono-buoys for the purposes of conducting a submarine search.” The article explains that sono-buoys are one of the main tools for hunting submarines, especially over a large sea area. These authors project that “Given the wide array of possibilities to employ UAVs, it’s quite possible that they will play a large role in the future of anti-submarine warfare [随着无人机的广泛运用在未来反潜作战中很可能发挥重要角色].”
This analysis begins by discussing various advantages and disadvantages of manned MPAs for ASW, such as the U.S. Navy’s vaunted P-8 Poseidon. Not only can that aircraft carry 120 sono-buoys, but it is capable of monitoring 60 of these buoys simultaneously, according to this Chinese rendering. Such aircraft are capable of “independent” missions against submarines, as they can conduct search, track, and attack functions. However, there is a fly in the ointment, of course, and this analysis emphasizes that such lumbering aircraft themselves have minimal self-defense capability and thus “may very easily become targets of attack [很容易被作为攻击目标]” by enemy interceptors. Another problem is that the length of the missions can be exceedingly taxing for the crews, so that the overall submarine search efficiency of the aircraft may decrease.
The argument is made in this Chinese analysis that unmanned aircraft can be of considerable assistance in such circumstances. It is said that UAVs frequently fly for more than forty hours but are capable of flights that last over days or even weeks. While generally not fast moving, they are still considerably faster than surface ships that are also employed for the ASW mission. It is projected, moreover, that they may sometimes be able to fly over air defenses. But the biggest selling point for UAVs in this role is that they are so much cheaper than both submarine-hunting large MPAs, and quite obviously also their quarry, the submarines. In other words, such economical approaches to the undersea rivalry in the Western Pacific could put Beijing on the right end of a “cost-imposition” strategy.
This Chinese analysis, moreover, implies that unmanned aircraft need not accomplish all aspects of the ASW mission. They could play the reasonably simple role of information relay platforms. They could also help to reduce the complexity of the daunting tasks that currently confront MPA crews. Of course, they could also take greater risks by entering “situations of contested airspace [敌空中威胁情况].” Lower costs, naturally enough, also mean that many airframes, coordinating together, could be deployed for any given search operation. Mathematical modeling of ASW operations in this piece yields the conclusion that UAVs do significantly increase the efficiency of submarine hunting.
A second article, from a late 2018 of Chinese Journal of Ship Research [中国舰船研究], endeavors to explore the “search/attack submarine integration [搜攻潜一体化]” functions of a fixed-wing UAV for ASW by studying the issue of optimizing payloads. This author, from the Jiangsu Automation Research Institute, asserts that “all navies are reforming ASW models.” He contends that there is an “urgent need for greater range, larger search areas, longer search periods, as well as cheaper methods of sensing, detection, tracking, and prosecuting submarines.” The paper discusses some foreign designs, including the U.S military’s UAV.
Owing mostly to the cost issue, this analysis also holds that UAVs for ASW have “obvious advantages” over manned aircraft. Interestingly, this Chinese study asserts that “weaponization is the basic trend for fixed-wing unmanned ASW aircraft [武器化是固定翼反潜无人机的基本特点].” But the most remarkable part of this particular discussion is the recognition that these UAVs might well operate from Chinese aircraft carriers. That is a rather bold call given that China has yet to demonstrate success in operating UAVs from aircraft carriers, but it does neatly illustrate Beijing’s priority on protecting its new capital ships, as noted in this paper’s introduction. Reviewing sample flight profiles, this analysis sees an ASW UAV that is capable of a patrol radius of six hundred kilometers for its land-based variant and perhaps three hundred kilometers for its carrier-based variant.
The above articles offer a glimpse of yet more coming attractions from the Chinese Navy. Indeed, the naval air arm of the PLA Navy is now starting to make rapid progress in line with its subsurface and surface forces. This news is quite disturbing as it fits a developing pattern of Beijing employing its new prowess in artificial intelligence to solve difficult battlefield dilemmas. What’s still more troubling is that if Chinese missiles and aircraft succeed in destroying U.S. and allied airbases in the Western Pacific during the initial phase of any military contingency, whether over Taiwan or the South China Sea, that might well leave myriad Chinese drone aircraft the freedom to roam and aggressively stalk previously nearly invulnerable American submarines.
Lyle J. Goldstein is Research Professor in the China Maritime Studies Institute (CMSI) at the United States Naval War College in Newport, RI. In addition to Chinese, he also speaks Russian and he is also an affiliate of the new Russia Maritime Studies Institute (RMSI) at Naval War College. You can reach him at [email protected]. The opinions in his columns are entirely his own and do not reflect the official assessments of the U.S. Navy or any other agency of the U.S. government.
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Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
From Henri K blog
The crew of an ASW Y-8Q patroller from the Eastern Fleet, Chinese Navy, pass their live ammunition assessment against targets at sea and on the ground. We can see the loading of ammunition in one of the holds of the aircraft.
l'appareil.
The crew of an ASW Y-8Q patroller from the Eastern Fleet, Chinese Navy, pass their live ammunition assessment against targets at sea and on the ground. We can see the loading of ammunition in one of the holds of the aircraft.
l'appareil.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
From Henri K blog
a few days ago. You can see, at least part of, the new Chinese depth charge which has a self-steering head and which would be developed by the 710 Institute of the CSIC.
a few days ago. You can see, at least part of, the new Chinese depth charge which has a self-steering head and which would be developed by the 710 Institute of the CSIC.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
China know they are being watched from Guangdong TV click CC for translation
Guangdong Radio and Television Station and the International Department of Xinhua News Agency. It is a weekly in-depth report on international news. The program breaks through the routine, by sorting out the context of major international news of the week, conducting live online interviews through reporters from Xinhua News
Guangdong Radio and Television Station and the International Department of Xinhua News Agency. It is a weekly in-depth report on international news. The program breaks through the routine, by sorting out the context of major international news of the week, conducting live online interviews through reporters from Xinhua News
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Via JSch and LKJ 86 China UAH AR500B first flight designed to operate from ship and withstand harsh sea environment. But their spec is too light weight mission load only 70kg, 4hr operation, 100 km range
It is only good for surveillance
AR-500B ship-based UAV made its maiden flight on November 27, 2020
AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter successfully made its first flight
来自
【AR-500B舰载型无人直升机成功首飞】11月27日，航空工业研制的AR-500B舰载型无人直升机在鄱阳试飞基地首飞成功，该型号的成功研制填补了我国轻小型舰载无人直升机领域的空白。AR-500B舰载型无人直升机最大起飞重量500kg，任务载荷 70kg，最大续航时间4h；控制半径100km，最大平飞速度140km/h，巡航速度120km/h，使用升限4000m，可以广泛用于执行海面广域监视与识别任务。
为适应舰载无人直升机停放空间小、工作环境恶劣、起降过程风险大、电磁环境复杂等不利因素，直升机所设计团队在原型机的基础上换装重油发动机，对燃油、结构、电气、飞控系统进行适应性改装设计。
针对无人直升机的海上使用需求，直升机所设计团队开展了小型电动助降装置、着舰引导系统和自动着舰控制律等设计研制；针对海上使用环境，开展了“三防”（防湿热、防霉菌、防盐雾）环境试验，使AR-500B舰载型无人直升机能够基本适应海上及船上环境。
China Ocean Shipping Magazine
11 minutes ago from Haiqiangguo Road Chaohua
[AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter successfully made its first flight]
On November 27, the AR-500B carrier-based unmanned helicopter developed by the AVIC successfully flew for the first time at the Poyang test flight base. The successful development of this model has filled the gap in the field of light and small ship-borne unmanned helicopters in China. AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter has a maximum take-off weight of 500kg, a mission load of 70kg, and a maximum endurance of 4h; a control radius of 100km, a maximum level flight speed of 140km/h, a cruising speed of 120km/h, and a service ceiling of 4000m. It can be widely used to perform wide-area surveillance and identification tasks at sea.
In order to adapt to difficult factors such as small parking space of the shipborne and harsh working environment, the high risk of take-off and landing, and the complicated electromagnetic environment, the helicopter design team replaced the original prototype with heavy oil engine and design adaptive modification on the fuel, structure, electrical and flight control system.
In response to the needs of unmanned helicopters at sea, the design team of the Helicopter Institute has carried out the design and development of small electrical landing assistance devices, landing guidance systems and control rules for automatic landing. Specifically against the maritime environment, the "Three Preventions" (anti-humidity, anti-mold, anti-salt spray) environmental test has been carried out, such that the AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter could basically adapt to the marine and shipborne environment.
It is only good for surveillance
AR-500B ship-based UAV made its maiden flight on November 27, 2020
AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter successfully made its first flight
来自
【AR-500B舰载型无人直升机成功首飞】11月27日，航空工业研制的AR-500B舰载型无人直升机在鄱阳试飞基地首飞成功，该型号的成功研制填补了我国轻小型舰载无人直升机领域的空白。AR-500B舰载型无人直升机最大起飞重量500kg，任务载荷 70kg，最大续航时间4h；控制半径100km，最大平飞速度140km/h，巡航速度120km/h，使用升限4000m，可以广泛用于执行海面广域监视与识别任务。
为适应舰载无人直升机停放空间小、工作环境恶劣、起降过程风险大、电磁环境复杂等不利因素，直升机所设计团队在原型机的基础上换装重油发动机，对燃油、结构、电气、飞控系统进行适应性改装设计。
针对无人直升机的海上使用需求，直升机所设计团队开展了小型电动助降装置、着舰引导系统和自动着舰控制律等设计研制；针对海上使用环境，开展了“三防”（防湿热、防霉菌、防盐雾）环境试验，使AR-500B舰载型无人直升机能够基本适应海上及船上环境。
China Ocean Shipping Magazine
11 minutes ago from Haiqiangguo Road Chaohua
[AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter successfully made its first flight]
On November 27, the AR-500B carrier-based unmanned helicopter developed by the AVIC successfully flew for the first time at the Poyang test flight base. The successful development of this model has filled the gap in the field of light and small ship-borne unmanned helicopters in China. AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter has a maximum take-off weight of 500kg, a mission load of 70kg, and a maximum endurance of 4h; a control radius of 100km, a maximum level flight speed of 140km/h, a cruising speed of 120km/h, and a service ceiling of 4000m. It can be widely used to perform wide-area surveillance and identification tasks at sea.
In order to adapt to difficult factors such as small parking space of the shipborne and harsh working environment, the high risk of take-off and landing, and the complicated electromagnetic environment, the helicopter design team replaced the original prototype with heavy oil engine and design adaptive modification on the fuel, structure, electrical and flight control system.
In response to the needs of unmanned helicopters at sea, the design team of the Helicopter Institute has carried out the design and development of small electrical landing assistance devices, landing guidance systems and control rules for automatic landing. Specifically against the maritime environment, the "Three Preventions" (anti-humidity, anti-mold, anti-salt spray) environmental test has been carried out, such that the AR-500B ship-based unmanned helicopter could basically adapt to the marine and shipborne environment.
Last edited: