PLA bomber/strike doctrine force+composition discussion (non H-20)

I apologize in advance for off topic, but i didn't know where to ask, so this is most logical thread for that IMO.

There were talks few years ago about acquiring new, modernized Tu-22 bomber, is by some case maybe that idea active again, anybody knows anything about that? In my opinion there is logic in that, it could be useful for China for many roles, even after new stealth bomber is developed.

Thank you in advance.

AF-1 said:

I apologize in advance for off topic, but i didn't know where to ask, so this is most logical thread for that IMO.

There were talks few years ago about acquiring new, modernized Tu-22 bomber, is by some case maybe that idea active again, anybody knows anything about that? In my opinion there is logic in that, it could be useful for China for many roles, even after new stealth bomber is developed.

Thank you in advance.

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Honestly I don't know why these stupid claims pop up now and even more why they are now posted again after being already debunked long ago?

No, it was then many years ago maybe a reasonable idea, but not now.

AF-1 said:

I apologize in advance for off topic, but i didn't know where to ask, so this is most logical thread for that IMO.

There were talks few years ago about acquiring new, modernized Tu-22 bomber, is by some case maybe that idea active again, anybody knows anything about that? In my opinion there is logic in that, it could be useful for China for many roles, even after new stealth bomber is developed.

Thank you in advance.

Click to expand...

nope, definitely not now ... TU-22 is definitely more modern than original TU-16, but not with H-6K. H-6K is way more modern than TU-22 and also is 100% locally made

China may want TU-22 in the early 2000 and Russia really missed that opportunity, from my memory at that time a bit flip-flop

antiterror13 said:

nope, definitely not now ... TU-22 is definitely more modern than original TU-16, but not with H-6K. H-6K is way more modern than TU-22 and also is 100% locally made

China may want TU-22 in the early 2000 and Russia really missed that opportunity, from my memory at that time a bit flip-flop

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TU-22M and H-6K are two totally different things. TU-22M is a supersonic bomber. Its supersonic flight capability is used for penetrating enemy air defense at supersonic speed, this is a cold-war era doctrine. What we have learned since then, was that the development of air defense capability significantly outpaced the development for faster bombers. So the idea of using a faster speed bomber to penetrate enemy air defense system is outdated, and pretty much discarded. What replaced that is a doctrine of lowering the detectability of manned bomber platform, instead of striving for a faster speed. Thus the US put into commission the B-2 and the F-117.
However, today's global political climate and international relations has changed. Today's world is much more complex. Back in the cold war era, the two side only care about winning a potential real war. But today, you might need to develop equipment no to win a real all-out war, but to win a war of propaganda instead. Therefore old platforms like TU-22M or the B-1B might be vulnerable to a modern air defense cluster in a real war. But, in a propaganda war, these equipment can do a low more to intimidate, disturb, subvert, and bully an opponent.
So, in my opinion, today's China might be in more of need for a TU-22M type of platform: fast, long-range, not stealthy, rugged. This coupled with H-6K and the H-20 would be a very nice triad.

Most of us realised and claimed it was not happening then and definitely isn't going to become a real purchase. There were some doubters then but now it becomes more obvious that H-20 and whatever JH-xx reaching service will make a PLA owned Tu-22 very out of place. H-6K are good enough missile lobbers. They don't require that much sophistication outside of electronics.

H6K is a poor mans bomber

Superpowers have stealth bombers with ultra long range giving global strike

H20 gives global strike and also nuclear triad

massive step up in capability from China

its like going from a hand gun to a 155mm howitzer

H20 should send shivers down the spine of many countries

I hope we see it soon

The unseen revolution is so-called "fourth generation" nuclear weapons. They've been playing around with the destructive capabilities for a while now and neutron bombs are old news. Of course delivery systems matter more and it appears the US and Russia both have high quality delivery systems in high quantities. Something China needs to immediately address by mass producing DF-41 and JL-3 at its earliest convenience for the real enemies of China are in the US, western Europe, and Middle East, not India or Japan.

ougoah said:

The unseen revolution is so-called "fourth generation" nuclear weapons. They've been playing around with the destructive capabilities for a while now and neutron bombs are old news. Of course delivery systems matter more and it appears the US and Russia both have high quality delivery systems in high quantities. Something China needs to immediately address by mass producing DF-41 and JL-3 at its earliest convenience for the real enemies of China are in the US, western Europe, and Middle East, not India or Japan.

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Why Middle East is China’s real enemy?

stannislas said:

Why Middle East is China’s real enemy?

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Real enemies are *in*... as in region. One would be a fool to believe the enemy of Chinese people around the world do not also reside in Israel. Now this is not to say Americans, Europeans, and Israelis or Jewish people are enemies at all. I hope that is more than obvious to everyone. Only the elites who control the geopolitical policies in the west have all their infrastructure in these regions of the world. What use are nuclear deterrence if you can't cover every inch of these regions?

asif iqbal said:

H6K is a poor mans bomber

Superpowers have stealth bombers with ultra long range giving global strike

H20 gives global strike and also nuclear triad

massive step up in capability from China

its like going from a hand gun to a 155mm howitzer

H20 should send shivers down the spine of many countries

I hope we see it soon

Click to expand...

Other than the US, who else has stealth bombers at present or in the near future?

It’s funny you say the H6K is a ‘poor man’ bomber, other than the US and Russia, which other countries still even can afford to have bombers?

I would also not classify the different between stealth bombers and legacy as akin of a howitzer vs sidearm.

Stealth bombers are much more limited in terms of munitions if they want to retain their stealth, whereas the H6 can carry far bigger weapons.

So while stealth bombers brings things to the table that conventional bombers could not possibly match, there will continue to be an important place for conventional bombers within the PLAAF even long after the H20 come online, just as the USAF continues to rely primarily on the B52 and B1 despite having the B2.

I view the relationship between the H20 and H6 more like getting a top of the line suppressed 300 blackout sniper rifle to supplement your 50 cal heavy machine gun.

Having the suppressed sniper gives you options you did not previously have, and makes it much harder for the enemy to comprehensively defend against you, but other times, you still just need a heavy machine gun.