New Chinese Military (export) vehicles thread


TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Guys really you want to go there?
The US isn’t going to fight for an independent Kurdistan neither is China or Syria or Europe or Russia. That call was a rock and a hard place. Who do you back the Kurdish fighters? Or Your Treaty ally?
Oh dear my the State department bad mouthed Chinese made arms.... get over it.
 

t2contra

Major
Guys really you want to go there?
The US isn’t going to fight for an independent Kurdistan neither is China or Syria or Europe or Russia. That call was a rock and a hard place. Who do you back the Kurdish fighters? Or Your Treaty ally?
Oh dear my the State department bad mouthed Chinese made arms.... get over it.
I'm sure it's not a biggie to the Kurds. After all, it's not the first time.

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Dfangsaur

Junior Member
Registered Member
Guys really you want to go there?
The US isn’t going to fight for an independent Kurdistan neither is China or Syria or Europe or Russia. That call was a rock and a hard place. Who do you back the Kurdish fighters? Or Your Treaty ally?
Oh dear my the State department bad mouthed Chinese made arms.... get over it.
I agree that Syria was a 4 way (at least) free for all, and the only winning move was to not play. But what US did to Kurds was making them dismantle the fortifications and withdrawing forces after promising them protection, and then withdrawing that promise later, so now they have no protection by US or by themselves. I don't root for YPG, Turkey or US, but that is horrible, really throws their "friendship" claim in the trash. Not to mention US didn't even withdraw they are just occupying the Syrian oil fields now with US National Guard, talk about All-Under-Heaven.

More importantly, I take problems with his statement wrt ch-4b and vn-4. Iraq had problems with maintenance of CH-4b, same thing with their ScanEagles. I imagine Jordan probably had similar problems. High tech equipment like these just require the kind of maintenance that these countries are unable to provide, and it says nothing about the product itself. VN-4 was never rated for IED and RPGs, and it was never advertised as such. Kenyan Army's inappropriate use of these equipment also says nothing about the product itself. On the other hand CS/VP2 which is a MRAP rated for IED has served its customers just fine and work as advertised. The Nigerian Army CS/VP2 had multiple encounters with IEDs and CS/VP2 has always done its job protecting the passengers.

These over the top statement coming from a State Department employee is very undiplomatic, and that just makes him sound like a salesman for American arms industries, the terrible kind that slanders the competitors.
 
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Biscuits

Junior Member
Registered Member
As usual, USA officials are projecting. It’s their own country that uses aggressive pricing and pushing to force others to buy. They use mass discounts and loans to make others pay attention to their produce, and resort to using threats and sanctions if the carrot of cheap aid subsidies are not enough.

FACT: none of the countries that purchased from China did it because China offered any special aid packages or threatened to hurt them and/or kick them out of alliances if they didn’t buy. They ALL did it because they saw the specs and went after the weapons with most lethality.

That’s why Saudi Arabia, despite being a close US ally, sidelined USA made drones and artillery in favor of Chinese systems when it came to battle. One set of substandard weapons to buy a political marriage with the USA, another set of weapons to do the heavy lifting.

Too bad Saudis have not yet been able to acquire Chinese air defense systems, or they might not have lost billions from that houthi drone attack.

Buying a FD-2000 might have been more expensive than claiming USA’s Patriot packages, but it sure won’t have been more expensive than rebuilding multiple oil fields.
 

MwRYum

Captain
That’s why Saudi Arabia, despite being a close US ally, sidelined USA made drones and artillery in favor of Chinese systems when it came to battle. One set of substandard weapons to buy a political marriage with the USA, another set of weapons to do the heavy lifting.

Too bad Saudis have not yet been able to acquire Chinese air defense systems, or they might not have lost billions from that houthi drone attack.

Buying a FD-2000 might have been more expensive than claiming USA’s Patriot packages, but it sure won’t have been more expensive than rebuilding multiple oil fields.
For the drones, I remember it was because the US won't sell their products so the Saudis go knock China's door. As for the DF-3 IRBMs, it was due to the fact that it was not something that you'd find anyone would put onto their catalogue, but since China isn't a signatory of the MTCR, they sold them.

Now, if and when Saudi desire to plug their air defense hole with new systems, I believe they'd go for the US-led solutions for political reasons - Trump Administration shows what US$100b can buy.
 
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Biscuits

Junior Member
Registered Member
For the drones, I remember it was because the US won't sell their products so the Saudis go knock China's door. As for the DF-3 IRBMs, it was due to the fact that it was not something that you'd find anyone would put onto their catalogue, but since China isn't a signatory of the MTCR, they sold them.

Now, if and when Saudi desire to plug their air defense hole with new systems, I believe they'd go for the US-led solutions for political reasons - Trump Administration shows what US$100b can buy.
If Saudi wanted they could pressure US to give them drones, they already have some of them, but stopped buying new ones.

I’m not talking about about DF-3 but PLZ-45.

China never pressured or used cut throat tactics to make any country buy arms, especially not a close US ally like Saudi Arabia.

Trump can probably give them new weapons for cheap, but I would not bank on those discounted arms being any more useful than the Patriots used by Saudi before...
 

MwRYum

Captain
If Saudi wanted they could pressure US to give them drones, they already have some of them, but stopped buying new ones.

I’m not talking about about DF-3 but PLZ-45.

China never pressured or used cut throat tactics to make any country buy arms, especially not a close US ally like Saudi Arabia.

Trump can probably give them new weapons for cheap, but I would not bank on those discounted arms being any more useful than the Patriots used by Saudi before...
I know that, China's strategy is working the "niche market", especially the "when the US and EU won't sell you those stuff" one.
 

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