CV-18 Fujian/003 CATOBAR carrier thread

antiterror13

Brigadier
I think the powerplant of a CVN is such a hurdle itself that I consider that singular aspect of moving from 003 to a proper CVN to be a significant difficulty, probably more difficult than the development of EM cats needed for transition from CV-17 to 003.

I don't expect initial work on a PLAN CVN to begin until after the mid 2020s (let's say 2027/8) -- so the question is what they're going to do between now and then. I personally expect them to go for additional 003 pattern carriers, but I don't think we've had anything concrete and decisive from the grapevine saying "yes, expect modules for additional 003 carriers to appear in XYZ timespan"... The most number of additional 003 pattern carriers I can see them putting in the water between now and 2030 is three 003s. The smallest number of additional 003 pattern carriers I can see them putting out in the water is zero.

My personal prediction range is that the PLAN may have anywhere between 3 carriers in service/in the water by 2030 (CV-16, CV-17, 003 no. 1 that we see now), or up to 6 carriers in service/in the water by 2030 (CV-16, CV-17, up to four 003 pattern carriers including no. 1 that we see now). I don't expect the first CVN to be launched until after 2030.

subject to change ofc with new info.

Please educate me why developing CVN is significantly more difficult than EM Cats? China has has SSN for a very longtime, since 1974, almost 50 yrs ago. I thought Nuclear reactor on subs is significantly more difficult than on CVN and also currently China is one of the world leaders in Nuclear power plant technology

Please educate me. Thanks
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Please educate me why developing CVN is significantly more difficult than EM Cats?

Because the sheer output that a CVNs nuclear reactor must be capable of, as well as its reliability, and its role in a CVN (providing propulsion for movement, providing electricity for all of the ship's subsystems) is far more demanding and central to virtually every aspect of a ship's function than EM catapults are.


China has has SSN for a very longtime, since 1974, almost 50 yrs ago.

So what?
Look at the output and characteristics of something like A1B or A4W and compare it with those of submarine reactors from 50 years ago.

Not to mention China's experience with submarine nuclear propulsion hasn't exactly been smooth or cutting edge either. Sure, China would have made advancements.

But that's like saying just because China put its first satellite in orbit in 1970, that it can produce super heavy rockets without considering it to be a challenge.


I thought Nuclear reactor on subs is significantly more difficult than on CVN

Not necessarily.
Besides, it's not like all nuclear reactors for submarines are made equal.
Just because they have experience with nuclear submarine powerplants doesn't mean it's "easy" or "smooth" to develop a nuclear reactor for a carrier. As I wrote before, the scale of output, the need to test its reliability, is vastly different.
What it means is that we can dare to entertain the idea that they might be able to pull it off in the first place.


and also currently China is one of the world leaders in Nuclear power plant technology

China's nuclear industry is okay, sure.
But that doesn't mean developing a nuclear reactor for a 100k ton carrier is easy.

Even for the US, developing a new reactor for the Ford class was a significant undertaking.

China is essentially trying to approach a powerplant similar to Ford (or at least Nimitz) class in one go, without ever having developed a naval shipborne nuclear reactor of similar scale before, with minimal room for error.
It's doable, but it is also a massive challenge.



To answer your question in a simple way:
China's nuclear experience doesn't mean developing a nuclear reactor for a carrier isn't still a massive challenge.
The centrality of a nuclear reactor to every aspect of a CVNs function (from the mundane to the mission essential) and the sheer output needed from such a reactor, and the demands for its reliability, makes it more of a technological challenge than EM catapults were for China at the respective times.

You are a PLA watcher.
Don't underestimate the challenges of developing capable and reliable powerplants, no matter the domain or platform.
 

Gloire_bb

Captain
Registered Member
China is essentially trying to approach a powerplant similar to Ford (or at least Nimitz) class in one go, without ever having developed a naval shipborne nuclear reactor of similar scale before, with minimal room for error.
It's doable, but it is also a massive challenge.
While I don't think we'll see it out in the open anytime soon (a very serious subject), I don't think it'll have to be done completely alone.
There is one nation besides the US with equally extensive experience, and it happens to be quite friendly.
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
While I don't think we'll see it out in the open anytime soon (a very serious subject), I don't think it'll have to be done completely alone.
There is one nation besides the US with equally extensive experience, and it happens to be quite friendly.
One would have expected said quite friendly nation to assist China's SSN/SSBN programs - areas in which it truly has equally extensive experience as the US - but that doesn't seem to have been the case. I don't see why this would be any different.
 

Gloire_bb

Captain
Registered Member
One would have expected said quite friendly nation to assist China's SSN/SSBN programs - areas in which it truly has equally extensive experience as the US - but that doesn't seem to have been the case. I don't see why this would be any different.
Who knows, may very well be happening.
Recently announced assistance with early warning&nuclear c&c is a pretty darn big sign of things.
 

BagPiper

New Member
Registered Member
I don't know where to put this very interesting article by Rick Joe aka our lovely moderator @Bltizo , please feel free to move it to more suitable thread

Part 1 :
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Part 2 :
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I was really surprised to discover that it's actually quite objective. Not that common for reports coming out of India.
 

BagPiper

New Member
Registered Member
Not sure it this has been discussed previously in this thread, is 003 purely IEP as in main engine/s only generate electricity or partially IEP?
 
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