Chinese Political Discussion Thread

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Deleted member 15887

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If mods are okay with me posting this, I wanted to start a dedicated Chinese political discussion thread (partly as a way to keep politics out of other threads). I'll start with @Bltizo 's excellent Reddit post on Xi Jinping's possible presidency past 2022-23: https://www.reddit.com/r/geopolitics/comments/daxrqp
I personally find Xi's motivations for a third-term, granted if it does happen, to be quite compelling and justified. 2 years ago, I, like many others, became worried that Xi might truly be "emperor for life". Looking at this piece, I now recognize my view then was too zero-sum and lacking nuance, to say the least.

I predict Xi will indeed step down by 2027-28 having successfully navigated through the vast majority of challenges posed to China this decade, as well as successfully oversee China overtaking the US economically (now predicted to happen 2026-27).

Then again, the term "2035" is getting thrown around a lot these days, so perhaps Xi might pursue a 4th term at maximum to maintain the direction and oversee the drafting of the 16th 5-Year Plan? I think if Xi tries to seek a 5th term, there will be severe internal opposition from the party as well as public opposition to that, so I consider Xi ruling past 2032-33 extremely unlikely. Then again, I am by no means an insider or expert. What do you guys think about this?
 

Aniah

Senior Member
Registered Member
If mods are okay with me posting this, I wanted to start a dedicated Chinese political discussion thread (partly as a way to keep politics out of other threads). I'll start with @Bltizo 's excellent Reddit post on Xi Jinping's possible presidency past 2022-23: https://www.reddit.com/r/geopolitics/comments/daxrqp
I personally find Xi's motivations for a third-term, granted if it does happen, to be quite compelling and justified. 2 years ago, I, like many others, became worried that Xi might truly be "emperor for life". Looking at this piece, I now recognize my view then was too zero-sum and lacking nuance, to say the least.

I predict Xi will indeed step down by 2027-28 having successfully navigated through the vast majority of challenges posed to China this decade, as well as successfully oversee China overtaking the US economically (now predicted to happen 2026-27).

Then again, the term "2035" is getting thrown around a lot these days, so perhaps Xi might pursue a 4th term at maximum to maintain the direction and oversee the drafting of the 16th 5-Year Plan? I think if Xi tries to seek a 5th term, there will be severe internal opposition from the party as well as public opposition to that, so I consider Xi ruling past 2032-33 extremely unlikely. Then again, I am by no means an insider or expert. What do you guys think about this?
I quite like him. True to meritocracy, I think people will keep him on as long as he proves he is what China needs.
 

Nobonita Barua

Senior Member
Registered Member
If mods are okay with me posting this, I wanted to start a dedicated Chinese political discussion thread (partly as a way to keep politics out of other threads). I'll start with @Bltizo 's excellent Reddit post on Xi Jinping's possible presidency past 2022-23: https://www.reddit.com/r/geopolitics/comments/daxrqp
I personally find Xi's motivations for a third-term, granted if it does happen, to be quite compelling and justified. 2 years ago, I, like many others, became worried that Xi might truly be "emperor for life". Looking at this piece, I now recognize my view then was too zero-sum and lacking nuance, to say the least.

I predict Xi will indeed step down by 2027-28 having successfully navigated through the vast majority of challenges posed to China this decade, as well as successfully oversee China overtaking the US economically (now predicted to happen 2026-27).

Then again, the term "2035" is getting thrown around a lot these days, so perhaps Xi might pursue a 4th term at maximum to maintain the direction and oversee the drafting of the 16th 5-Year Plan? I think if Xi tries to seek a 5th term, there will be severe internal opposition from the party as well as public opposition to that, so I consider Xi ruling past 2032-33 extremely unlikely. Then again, I am by no means an insider or expert. What do you guys think about this?
Balanced view.

In my opinion Xi shouldn't be bound by limits because of 2 things. Experience & education.

As the post mentioned, power sake of power leads to disaster. However, the dodocracy loving people like to use it without any technical understanding of a system. They never explain why they like to keep the voting power , which is according them, the ultimate power , for life time in their hand.

As long as a leader is productive for country, he should be in helm. Time barrier shouldn't be a problem there. Conversely, if he isn't productive, removal of him shouldn't wait until time limit arrives.
 
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Deleted member 15887

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Balanced view.

In my opinion Xi shouldn't be bound by limits because of 2 things. Experience & education.

As the post mentioned, power sake of power leads to disaster. However, the dodocracy loving people like to use it without any technical understanding of a system. They never explain why they like to keep the voting power , which is according them, the ultimate power , for life time in their hand.

As long as a leader is productive for country, he should be in helm. Time barrier shouldn't be a problem there. Conversely, if he isn't productive, removal of him shouldn't wait until time limit arrives.
During February last year, it looked to me at least temporarily, Xi was in his most tenuous position yet. Apparently, he was disappeared from public view for weeks amid the crisis, probably was letting Zhong Nanshan lead the public coordination of pandemic response measures (unlike Trump) at the most critical time, or was being forced by other Party leaders to undergo self-criticism/rectification sessions.

If Xi's lockdown measures failed, I do not think he would last to the end of the year, as it might be quite likely the Politburo removes him from power. If he did, I don't think a third-term for him would be possible. But now, having successfully overseen the pandemic response, I think Xi's political position is stronger than ever, and the chance he's allowed to continue on to a third term is greater than 60-70% now.
 

OppositeDay

Senior Member
Registered Member
Too much attention was paid to the removal of presidential term limit from the PRC Constitution. The PRC Constitution was never China's most important safeguard from lifetime leaders, as the state president has no real power anyway. The most important safeguard had always been the 1982 CCP Constitution, which is still in force with minor changes. Article 38 of CCP Constitution reads (in Xinhua's English translation):

Article 38: Party members in leadership positions at every level, whether elected through democratic procedures or appointed by a leading body, do not hold posts for life and can be transferred from or relieved of their posts.
Officials whose age and health make them unfit to continue working should retire according to state regulations.

There has never been state regulations on retirement age for national leaders, but the informal limit was 70. The revision of the PRC Constitution doesn't change this. Also note that unlike Hu Jintao, who was 70 when he retired as CCP General Secretary, Xi will only be 69 when the new Politburo will be formed. Since Politburo Standing Committee members don't retire during their terms, strictly speaking the 70 informal retirement age doesn't prevent Xi from starting and serving another term as CCP General Secretary.
 
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Deleted member 15887

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Too much attention was paid to the removal of presidential term limit from the PRC Constitution. The PRC Constitution was never China's most important safeguard from lifetime leaders, as the state president has no real power anyway. The most important safeguard had always been the 1982 CCP Constitution, which is still in force with minor changes. Article 38 of CCP Constitution reads (in Xinhua's English translation):



There has never been state regulations on retirement age for national leaders, but the informal limit was 70. The revision of the PRC Constitution doesn't change this. Also note that unlike Hu Jintao, who was 70 when he retired as CCP General Secretary, Xi will only be 69 when the new Politburo will be formed. Since Politburo Standing Committee members don't retire during their terms, strictly speaking the 70 informal retirement age doesn't prevent Xi from starting and serving another term as CCP General Secretary.
True, and beyond that, Xi even ruled out that he would serve for life (and at least implied he may even step down after his two terms)
Never forget that FT did a piece on this:
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PAYWALL BYPASS:
Chinese President Xi Jinping has said that he is “personally opposed” to life-long rule, adding that foreign observers have “misinterpreted” a recent constitutional amendment that revoked the two-term limit on the presidency. Mr Xi expressed his views at three recent meetings with foreign dignitaries and Chinese officials, according to people who either attended the meetings or were briefed on the discussions. They added that Mr Xi justified the decision in terms of needing to align the country’s three top government and Communist party jobs. Mr Xi’s two more powerful posts — party general secretary and chairmanship of the party’s Central Military Commission — are not subject to term limits. Two people said Mr Xi had surprised his guests by raising the issue himself.

“President Xi said he was ‘personally opposed’ to [lifetime rule] and the outside world had ‘misinterpreted’ the amendment,” one of the people said. Mr Xi did not say at the meetings whether he intended to serve as president, party general secretary and CMC chairman for three or more terms. On February 25, the official Xinhua news agency announced that the Communist party’s Central Committee had recommended scrapping the two-term limit on China’s presidency, paving the way for Mr Xi to remain president for life if he wishes.

The Central Committee’s “recommendation” to revoke the presidential term limit was taken at a closed-door meeting in mid-January but kept secret for more than a month. The amendment has stirred unease among many urban elites, including college graduates, intellectuals and civil servants, who worry about a return to the excesses of one-man rule that tarnished Mao Zedong’s 27-year reign. Mao’s successor, Deng Xiaoping, had term limits written into China’s constitution in an effort to bring more predictability to leadership transitions in the world’s most populous country.

“The amendment sends a terrible signal about institutional rule,” said one former Chinese government official. A senior executive at a large listed Chinese state-owned enterprise added that he had been forced to answer awkward questions from investors ever since the amendment was announced. “Investors have been asking lots of questions about it,” the executive said. “It doesn’t look good.” The amendment was formally passed in March by China’s rubber-stamp parliament, the National People’s Congress, with 2,958 votes in favour and just two opposed. Mr Xi was then unanimously re-elected to a second five-year term as state president.


Defenders of the amendment argue that streamlining the technically separate party and government administrative structures will help Mr Xi tackle difficult financial and economic reforms on which his administration made little headway during his first term in office.
“There isn’t really a line between the party and government,” said one Chinese government official. “That separation was always very superficial and unnecessary.” After the amendment was first announced in February, a commentary in the People’s Daily newspaper argued that it did not mean Mr Xi would rule for life, as party leaders would still have to step down if incapacitated by illness or advanced age. But Mr Xi himself has not commented publicly on the issue.

Mr Xi also remains genuinely popular across China because of the success of his anti-corruption campaign and nationalist foreign policies, with many people welcoming the prospect of him remaining in office for three or more terms. Yanmei Xie, an analyst at Gavekal Dragonomics in Beijing, said that one Chinese business contact angrily dismissed overseas criticism that Mr Xi’s power grab was similar to Vladimir Putin’s machinations in Russia. “These foreigners don’t understand that China needs a strong ruler,” Ms Xie quoted the businessman as saying. “Xi isn’t Putin, he’s Peter the Great.”

In addition to Mr Xi’s grip on both the party and presidency, two other members of the party’s most powerful body — the seven-man Politburo Standing Committee — simultaneously serve as state premier and NPC chairman. In 2004 one of Mr Xi’s predecessors, Jiang Zemin, said that the Chinese party-state’s “trinity-style leadership structure is not only necessary but also appropriate for a big party and country like ours”. But Mr Jiang, who succeeded Deng in 1989, is the only Chinese “paramount leader” since then to have fractured this trinity. He stayed on as CMC chairman, giving him control over China’s armed forces, for the first two years of Hu Jintao’s tenure as party general secretary and state president.
 
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Deleted member 15887

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In Part 2 of this series that looks ahead to the 20th Chinese Communist Party (CCP) National Congress in 2022, I examine key personnel changes in central Party agencies and State Council ministries over the past year.

As in Part 1 on
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, I use career trajectory and demographic data from “
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” to analyze recently promoted politicians. This series shows the importance of political networks for these rising stars, which we will analyze further as 2022 approaches.

The Party Center

Provincial leadership is the surest path to national leadership positions, but outstanding Party-State administrators can still advance. All seven of the ministerial-level politicians promoted in Party agencies last year will be younger than the mandatory retirement age of 65 in 2022, making them likely to feature in the next Central Committee (see Table 1).

Table 1. Ministerial-Level Promotions in Central Party Agencies since January 2020
fig1 - Eye on 2022 (Part 2): Rising Stars in Beijing
Note: Blue shading shows a promotion from deputy provincial-ministerial level to full provincial-ministerial level. Others listed had already reached full provincial-ministerial level.

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.

Perhaps the most significant promotion was of Meng Xiangfeng, who previously worked under Xi allies Cai Qi and Chen Xi in the Hangzhou and Liaoning governments, respectively. Meng’s ascension to Executive Deputy Director of the General Office—the executive office for Party leaders—suggests that he
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current director Ding Xuexiang as Xi’s chief of staff, if Ding is promoted further in 2022. Should that happen, Meng would likely secure a seat on the elite 25-member Politburo, following in the footsteps of Ding and Li Zhanshu.

The elevation of Jiang Jinquan to head the Central Policy Research Office (CPRO) and the coterminous Central Comprehensively Deepening Reforms Commission Office is also noteworthy. The former agency is the Party’s top policy shop, and the latter is the vehicle that coordinates Xi’s reform agenda—where “top-level design” gets implemented.

Jiang
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, the Party’s influential ideology czar and his longtime CPRO boss, indicating that Jiang is a policy wonk trusted by top leaders. It’s unclear why Wang handed over the reins last October, but given his age and his other positions, Wang ought to remain an important member of the Party leadership beyond 2022.

As for Li Shulei and Liang Yanshun, their promotions were likely influenced by having served under Xi when he headed the Central Party School from 2007-2012. Their trajectories reflect the emphasis Xi has placed on ideological campaigns and cadre education as tools
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Party discipline
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“self-confidence” in the political system.

The State Council

The political currency of state leadership roles has diminished under Xi. Only three members of the 19th Politburo (2017-2022) had worked as State Council ministers, compared to five in the 18th Politburo (2012-2017). Nonetheless, standout performers in the State bureaucracy, particularly those whom Xi believes he can trust, are still candidates for further promotion.

Nine of the 26 cabinet-level departments of the State Council have recently received a new head—a turnover rate of 35% (see Table 2). Three non-cabinet State Council agencies gained new chiefs, and three ministerial-level deputies were appointed.

Table 2. Ministerial-Level Promotions in the State Council since January 2020
fig2 2 - Eye on 2022 (Part 2): Rising Stars in Beijing
Notes: Blue shading shows a promotion from deputy provincial-ministerial level to full provincial-ministerial level. Others listed had already reached full provincial-ministerial level. An asterisk indicates a person who leads a ministerial-level agency that is under the State Council but is not part of the cabinet. This list omits the unusual reshuffle of many older politicians into Hong Kong-related positions in early 2020. Yu Jianhua and Li Guoying were promoted in 2021.
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.

With the exceptions of Huang Runqiu and He Ping, everyone on the above list is both a CCP member and will be younger than 65 in 2022, qualifying them for the next Central Committee. But it’s the politicians with close ties to Xi who
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to enter higher office.

Of interest is the successor to Politburo member Guo Shengkun, head of the Party’s Political and Legal Affairs Commission (PLAC), who should retire in 2022. His replacement will probably be a current PLAC member, implying a three-way race between new Minister of Justice Tang Yijun, PLAC Secretary-General Chen Yixin, and Minister of State Security Chen Wenqing.

Chen Yixin is
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, but Tang also seems a serious contender. Both men worked under Xi during his tenure as Zhejiang Party Secretary (2002-2007). But compared to Chen, Tang sits on more policy leading groups, has provincial leadership experience, and holds a ministerial portfolio (like previous PLAC heads).

The two youngest new hires served under Xi during his brief stint as Shanghai Party Secretary in 2007. Tang Dengjie was a Vice Mayor from 2003-2011 and Wang Wentao was the head of Huangpu District. Tang, a former executive in state-owned armaments and auto companies, could well
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as Chair of the National Development and Reform Commission.

Even if many rising stars have not
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, they appear to have enjoyed the political patronage of Xi’s allies on the Politburo. Both Chen Xiaojiang and Hou Kai proved themselves in anti-corruption agencies, working under Wang Qishan, Yang Xiaodu, and Zhao Leji. Tang Renjian was twice Liu He’s deputy in the general office of the Central Financial and Economic Affairs Commission. Yin Hejun and Zhang Gong served concurrently as Vice Mayors to Cai Qi in Beijing. Hu Heping was a protégé of Chen Xi in the Tsinghua University administration.

All told, six of the nine new cabinet ministers either worked with Xi or one of his Politburo associates. Proximity to Xi now seems to hold more explanatory power for personnel shifts in Chinese elite politics than factional competition.
 

solarz

Brigadier
Xi Jinping being the "most powerful leader side Deng" doesn't really mean much, considering that he's one of only three such leaders, the others being Jiang Zemin and Hu Jintao.

Jiang served under the shadow of Deng, and didn't come into his own until Deng's death. Hu served under the shadow of Jiang, and never came into his own at all.

Xi is the first leader since then to break that unhealthy cycle of shadow leaders.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
Xi Jinping being the "most powerful leader side Deng" doesn't really mean much, considering that he's one of only three such leaders, the others being Jiang Zemin and Hu Jintao.

Jiang served under the shadow of Deng, and didn't come into his own until Deng's death. Hu served under the shadow of Jiang, and never came into his own at all.

Xi is the first leader since then to break that unhealthy cycle of shadow leaders.
@solarz do you think he will do the same to his successor? From outside looking in we have no news of possible candidate and with the cold war heating up between the US, I think he will stay behind the scene to act as a stabilizing force inside the CCP.
 

gadgetcool5

Senior Member
Registered Member
Xi Jinping is methodically destroying the Chinese nation.

First, he devastated China's foreign relations and ravaged China's reputation abroad.
Second, he collapsed China's demographic future and squeezed the very existence of it's young population.
Third, he morally stained the Chinese nation like never before with his pointless genocide of our Uyghur brothers.
Now, he is systematically destroying the value of China's tech economy with his never-ending crackdowns.

I don't see how any single person can look at him and think what he's doing makes sense. The idea that he is entitled to so much power is ridiculous. Deng had power because he was a long marcher, he brought China back from the Great Leap Forward, he survived the cultural revolution, and initiated reform and opening which was the greatest thing to happen to the Chinese people in thousands of years. Mao had power because he took a peasant army that was outnumbered 10-to-1 and finally rejuvenated the Chinese nation, united the country, ended the century of humiliation, and founded the People's Republic. What did the criminal Xi Jinping do to deserve power? Nothing. To compare Xi to Deng and Mao who made superhuman accomplishments is the biggest insult in history.
 
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