Sino-India conflict

Indianfighter said:

I meant that the CPC and its members do not interest me. When CDF was in Ezboard, I had devoted an entire thread criticizing the CPC and its brutal and ruthless policies.Old members may remember that thread (it was lost after a server malfunction).

I disapprove of the CPC and its founding father, Mao, who backstabbed India on the Panchsheel treaty, that led to the 1962 war. It can be imagined that if Mao had not usurped Tibet illegally, then today Tibet would have been an independent nation, and relations between India and China would have been much better than they are today.

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And India has no shame of its' own, your imbalance view on one side only make your arguement pathetic. I would want to say Most chinese do know who and what MAO and CCP were, but they might have different perspective. Yes, I know many indians want to take Tibet to be part of India, funny they could call themselves have a higher moral ground.

ff

Gollevainen said:

I can sure you that we wont aim harmony and consensus, but proffesionalism and cutting out all imaturity. All those who trespas these ideas will pay the prize, so don't worry if you wont see any imidiate results, we mods often work undercover.

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Here's the way I look at it. Objectivity is maintained in two ways. One way is a free-for-all, in which you let loose both sides. Obviously that is against the forum rules and therefore, should not be allowed.

The second one is a tightly controlled objectivity. If both sides get over the line, both get the hammer. That's the more feasible thing to do here.

Here's another observation: every one who responded to Indianfighter had responded with some sort of "proof." Obviously, we can debate the legitimacy of such proofs, nevertheless, people generally backed up their arguments. The exception of which is Indianfighter, who not only did not back up his so called points, but also put his own credibility at risk with his "China's IT minister" and "India did not recognize Tibet as part of China" lines.

The of course, is his pathetic beliefs on Tibet, which I might say, is none of his business, nor is it directly the topic of this thread. When you have both the above (which can more or less be summarized as a case of one person spreading lies and the other responding), can you blame others for having nothing more than contempt for him?

Not to mention that I haven't seen many people cross the line here, with the one that first initiated personal attacks being Indianfighter. So you will have to excuse me for not believing that objectivity is maintained.

And don't mind me, I'm ever the cynic...

Indianfighter said:

I meant that the CPC and its members do not interest me. When CDF was in Ezboard, I had devoted an entire thread criticizing the CPC and its brutal and ruthless policies.Old members may remember that thread (it was lost after a server malfunction).

I disapprove of the CPC and its founding father, Mao, who backstabbed India on the Panchsheel treaty, that led to the 1962 war. It can be imagined that if Mao had not usurped Tibet illegally, then today Tibet would have been an independent nation, and relations between India and China would have been much better than they are today.

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There has never been any crap that people can't toss aside in two seconds proving that Mao illegally usurped Tibet. The "China backstabbing India" tidbit is controversial at best, if not outright against India. But then again, I could hardly expect more from you.

mindreader said:

Here's the way I look at it. Objectivity is maintained in two ways. One way is a free-for-all, in which you let loose both sides. Obviously that is against the forum rules and therefore, should not be allowed.

The second one is a tightly controlled objectivity. If both sides get over the line, both get the hammer. That's the more feasible thing to do here.

Here's another observation: every one who responded to Indianfighter had responded with some sort of "proof." Obviously, we can debate the legitimacy of such proofs, nevertheless, people generally backed up their arguments. The exception of which is Indianfighter, who not only did not back up his so called points, but also put his own credibility at risk with his "China's IT minister" and "India did not recognize Tibet as part of China" lines.

The of course, is his pathetic beliefs on Tibet, which I might say, is none of his business, nor is it directly the topic of this thread. When you have both the above (which can more or less be summarized as a case of one person spreading lies and the other responding), can you blame others for having nothing more than contempt for him?

Not to mention that I haven't seen many people cross the line here, with the one that first initiated personal attacks being Indianfighter. So you will have to excuse me for not believing that objectivity is maintained.

And don't mind me, I'm ever the cynic...

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I agree your point in to some extent, but remind you again and all for that matter, you need to express yourself maturely. Calling someone moron and curryfighter ect. isen't exactly mature is it? If you feel that he talk utter BS, then say so, but you can do it with far more better manners. This is a forum where everyone is allowed to express their obinion (in the line of the rules) and we don't take actions against members if they just talk without knowing properly. We jump in if you behaive badly, meaning when you show us that you are incapaple of handling other obinions in mature ways. It's other members task to try and discuss the matter so that the facts are being inturpered properly and your own wiev is let out. We mods just control that you do it by playing the rules. We don't try to push some commonly accepted obinion as undenyable truht in which everyone must agree.

So if you think that someone is trolling and trying to deliparetly couse trouple, then just ignore it. Don't be a fish. The trolling is succes if everyone goes of ballistic over it and takes the bait. We mods cannot intervene untill rules are broken and unfortunetly trolling (in this case, luring people to trouplebaits) can be done secretly and in the ways of that we cannot intervene untill something real happens. But in many cases the fear that someone is trolling deliparetly is overestimation and in this particular case it might be so. But then again I've getting tierd of this constant troupleissue so if it continues, someone is going to get hurt...

But can we now try and focus on the thread, or what is left of it. COs if this offtopic discussion continues, i have no change than to close this thread.

In an effort to get away from personal attacks can we ask the question.

What equipment could India have sent to the border to win the battle
and how could China have responded ?

India could've sent in some fighter bombers, and China would respond with a lot of anti air equipment. But the war was very brief, so I don't think either side will have a chance to bring up their heavier weapons before the war ended.

The PLA was an expert in fighting at night, as seen from the Chinese Civil War and the Korean War. Chinese troops could've used night raids on enemy posts, that'd minimize casualties and give China a lot more POW's. I wonder why they didn't do that...

Gollevainen said:

So if you think that someone is trolling and trying to deliparetly couse trouple, then just ignore it. Don't be a fish. The trolling is succes if everyone goes of ballistic over it and takes the bait. We mods cannot intervene untill rules are broken and unfortunetly trolling (in this case, luring people to trouplebaits) can be done secretly and in the ways of that we cannot intervene untill something real happens. But in many cases the fear that someone is trolling deliparetly is overestimation and in this particular case it might be so. But then again I've getting tierd of this constant troupleissue so if it continues, someone is going to get hurt...

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I agree with both Golly and Mindreader in most extent, but I would want to point out that sometime ignore is not the solution. I have been to too many forums for years, and I mostly ignore trolling. But lately I have change my opinion somewhat, if you tell a lie one thousands times it will become true. And that is what happenning in many forums, many false informations are being accept as facts. And when Chinese question about these facts, they will be call as nationalists. It also OK to label chinese, and nobody seems it is wrong. Such as the Italians prime minister which say Mao boiled babies. Such as these terms as Chicom, brainwashed, dictatorships etc etc. That is all I want to say.

mindreader said:

There has never been any crap that people can't toss aside in two seconds proving that Mao illegally usurped Tibet. The "China backstabbing India" tidbit is controversial at best, if not outright against India. But then again, I could hardly expect more from you.

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The Aksai Chin area was granted to British India, by Independent Tibet. After China usurped Tibet illegally, China refused to recognize the Aksai Chin area of Kashmir, as a part of India. In the ensuing war, China captured it.
Before the war, Mao had signed the Panchsheel (5-point) treaty with India, one of whose clauses were that neither India nor China would try to capture territory that belonged to each other.
India regarded this as a violation of the agreement.

I am not a "troll". I have always defended India, its history and defence products....since the past 11 months.

I always accept my mistakes (like the case in which India DID recognize TAR as a part of China, whereas I claimed otherwise). This must be appreciated, but it is criticized.
I also admired the J-10 and the FT-2000 missile of China, and questioned why didnt the Americans get such a brilliant idea.

Remember, I have always criticized Mao, CCP, and all the other comrades in PRC since the Ezboard days of sinodefence. It must now be accepted by members, that I mean no offence to Chinese culture, or its illustrious people.
The 1962 war took place because of the communist dictatorship in China, that was led by a brutal leader, Mao.

I repeat that I am not a troll.

I agree with both Golly and Mindreader in most extent, but I would want to point out that sometime ignore is not the solution. I have been to too many forums for years, and I mostly ignore trolling. But lately I have change my opinion somewhat, if you tell a lie one thousands times it will become true. And that is what happenning in many forums, many false informations are being accept as facts. And when Chinese question about these facts, they will be call as nationalists. It also OK to label chinese, and nobody seems it is wrong. Such as the Italians prime minister which say Mao boiled babies. Such as these terms as Chicom, brainwashed, dictatorships etc etc. That is all I want to say

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You got it right. I personaly take all information gained from any forum with little sceptism...not totaly bash it but not buying it without any doupt...

But I think this thread has died as it seems that none (including me) doesen't seem to remember wht were we fighting for...So it is going to be closed. I think after a while you can start a new topic about the matter, i don't advice you to do so right now...lets all just cool down first.

PS. No need to mind about the saying of Italian Prime minister...he is complete....well you know what