Russia Vs Georgia..a widening crisis!

Discussion in 'World Armed Forces' started by Finn McCool, Aug 8, 2008.

  1. Player 0
    Offline

    Player 0 Junior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2006
    Messages:
    450
    Likes Received:
    114
    ^That was CNN, and only after mass Chinese protests in China and overseas.
     
  2. adeptitus
    Offline

    adeptitus Captain
    VIP Professional

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    2,166
    Likes Received:
    73
    Bumped into this article today, not sure how authentic it is however.

    http://english.pravda.ru/russia/politics/17-12-2008/106842-unmanned_aircraft-0

    Russia intends to purchase Israeli arms, particularly unmanned aircraft. The decision is based on Russia’s recent experience in South Ossetia, when the Russian army was left without reconnaissance planes. Nevertheless, the Russian defense industry has very good spy planes at its disposal, and they are not worse than those of Israel. The purchase of Israeli planes may lead to the fact that the countries of the East will refuse to purchase the products of the Russian defense industry.

    Russia is ready to purchase foreign-made arms to the detriment of its own defense industry. A delegation of Russia’s defense ministry visited Israel at the end of November 2008 and conducted negotiations regarding the purchase of Israeli unmanned planes.

    Nikolai Makarov, the chief of the Russian military’s General Staff, said that Russia would purchase spy planes from Israel if the Russian defense industry proves to be unable to make the planes that Russia needs. To put it in a nutshell, the official virtually questioned the capabilities of the Russian defense industry.

    Spokespeople for the Russian-Israeli committee for military and technical cooperation neither confirmed nor rejected the information. The explanation followed from journalists of the Haaretz newspaper. Not only did they confirm the opportunity, they provided detailed information about the imminent deal. The contract is likely to be evaluated at $20 million. Thus, Russia may purchase from three to ten of such aircraft.

    Russia’s top military officials paid attention to Israel’s Hermes-450 unmanned aircraft (made by Elbit Systems) during the five-day war with Georgia. The Israeli aircraft, which the Georgian army had, gave the country a great advantage in terms of obtaining the information about the enemy’s actions. Unlike Georgia, Russia was “blind” during the entire conflict and had to use old Tu-22 bombers for the same purpose. The problem would have most likely never surfaced if Georgia had not downed one of those bombers.

    Alexander Khramchikhin, a specialist of the Institute of the Military and Political Analysis, believes that Russia lags far behind Israel in terms of unmanned aircraft technologies. “There is a large technological gap between Russia and Israel at this point. We have just a few of the outdated spy planes,” he told Pravda.ru.

    Konstantin Sivkov, the first vice president of the Academy of Geopolitical Problems said: “Russia must purchase Russian arms, no matter what the chief of the General Staff says. It is not about the higher price of the Israeli analogues of the Israeli defense technology. If the Russian defense industry has some problems it means that we must help the industry handle and solve those problems. Furthermore, the use of foreign arms can be restricted with special programs which exclude any possibility for the use of the weapons against this or that country. Russia may find itself eventually unarmed.”

    On the other hand, the Israeli spy planes have a different data transmission system. In case Russia buys the planes, specialists will have to conduct a great amount of work to adapt the nation’s system to Israeli technologies.

    Anatoly Tsyganok, a specialist from the Institute of Military and Political Analysis, believes that Russia will have to give up its GLONASS satellite navigation system because Israeli unmanned planes operate on the GPS system.

    Russia has its own reconnaissance planes – Strizh, Reis and Pchela-1 – made by Tupolev and Yakovlev design bureaus. Other aircraft-building enterprises, including the world-famous MiG, develop their own unmanned technologies too. However, the Russian military administration believes that the country has no such technologies. It is worthy of note that Istrinsky Experimental Work conducted successful tests of its Istra-010 unmanned aircraft in December of 2008. The aircraft weighs only 4 kilos. Belarus has already purchased several of such spy planes. The company will test a new version (60 kilos) of the spy plane next year.

    If Russia purchases Israeli spy planes, the deal may negatively affect the country’s possible contracts with Arab and Iranian partners.
     
  3. Pointblank
    Offline

    Pointblank Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    1,775
    Likes Received:
    2
    Is anyone going to bet that the Americans will pull some strings to halt such sales?
     
  4. TerraN_EmpirE
    Offline

    TerraN_EmpirE Tyrant King

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,360
    Likes Received:
    10,697
    depends on who's sitting in 1600 bush could try. Obama's any one's guess.
     
  5. Scratch
    Offline

    Scratch Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    2,116
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    Russia is increasing it's military presence on the Georgian border, 40km to Tiblisi, again. In a time when Georgia is potentially instable with all those protests going on. And also just 2weeks prior a military exercise involving some NATO nations.
    The russian black sea fleet has also deployed a few days ago, with I think up to 22 ships, including amphibs with Marines.
    It seems the russians want to show off their muscels a bit in the region.

    =========================================================

    russia forces tbilisi - Google News

    Russia moves troops closer to Georgia's capital

    By LYNN BERRY – 19 hours ago

    AKHMAJI, Georgia (AP) — At a military checkpoint between Georgia and its breakaway region of South Ossetia, the word "Russia" is hand-painted in pink on a concrete security barrier.

    "It will be Russia," said a Russian army lieutenant as the Ossetian soldiers under his command nodded.

    "And Georgia used to be Russian, too," said the young freckle-faced lieutenant, who would give only his first name, Sergei. Three armored personnel carriers and a tank were dug in around the checkpoint.

    Russia has troops just 25 miles (40 kilometers) from the Georgian capital, in violation of the European Union-brokered cease-fire that ended last year's brief war. And in recent weeks, it has put even more soldiers and armored vehicles within striking distance of the city ahead of street protests against Georgia's president.

    The protests, which began April 9, drew about 10,000 people Tuesday, and opposition leaders said they would continue daily until President Mikhail Saakashvili resigned.

    The demonstrations have been fed by public anger over Georgia's humiliating defeat in the August war, which left Russian troops on previously Georgian-controlled territory and drove tens of thousands of Georgians from their homes.

    By reinforcing its military presence at a time of potential political instability, Russia appears determined to maintain pressure on Saakashvili, whom Moscow has openly said must be replaced before relations can be repaired.

    Georgia's Western-leaning government accuses the Kremlin of hoping to capitalize on political unrest to restore its influence over the former Soviet republic, which for almost 200 years was ruled by Moscow.

    The presence of the Russian troops poses a dilemma for Washington as it aims to improve relations with Moscow. Georgia worries the Obama administration will be reluctant to pressure Russia to comply with the cease-fire while seeking its cooperation on priority issues like the war in Afghanistan and North Korea's nuclear weapons program.

    Tensions over Georgia also complicate efforts to restore ties between Russia and NATO, which broke off contacts following the war. Russia has strongly objected to NATO military exercises scheduled to begin May 6 in Georgia and has warned the U.S. against helping Georgia rebuild its army.

    The military checkpoint near Akhmaji enforces a new boundary between Georgia and South Ossetia, the Russian-supported region that was at the center of the fighting. After routing the Georgian army, Russian troops took over entire districts of South Ossetia that had long been under Georgian control.

    Russian forces also occupied a new swath of territory in a second breakaway republic, Abkhazia, along the Black Sea coast.

    The European Union and United States consider Russia in violation of the cease-fire signed by President Dmitry Medvedev, which called for troops to pull back to positions held before the war began.

    Russia says the cease-fire has been superseded by separate agreements it signed with South Ossetia and Abkhazia, which Moscow now recognizes as independent states.

    The actions by Russia reflect both its military strength and its willingness to challenge the West to reclaim a dominant role in Georgia and elsewhere in its former sphere of influence.

    Georgia's government sees Russia as determined to prevent the West from considering Georgia a reliable transit country for oil and natural gas, contending that was Russia's main objective in the war.

    The pipelines that cross Georgian territory are among the few that bypass Russia in supplying Europe with energy from the Caspian Sea and Central Asia. During the war, Russia bombed areas near the pipelines.

    "Russia wants to be the monopoly supplier," said political analyst Shalva Pichkhadze.

    Russia's Foreign Ministry confirmed the Kremlin has sent reinforcements to the boundary lines. It was responding to fears the Georgian government would provoke clashes to distract from the opposition protests, ministry spokesman Andrei Nesterenko said.

    Georgia's Interior Ministry said Russia has 15,000 soldiers in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, which would be far more than in past months. Since the beginning of April, Russia has moved 130 armored vehicles toward the boundary line from elsewhere in South Ossetia and 70 more have entered South Ossetia from Russia, ministry spokesman Shota Utiashvili said.

    Russia's Defense Ministry refused to comment on the composition of its forces, and Georgia's claims could not be independently verified. European monitors who patrol the boundary lines are not allowed into South Ossetia or Abkhazia, and journalists also are stopped at Russian checkpoints.

    Peter Semneby, the EU special representative for the South Caucasus, said the Russian military presence is clearly "significantly larger" than it was.

    From a Georgian police checkpoint just 100 yards (meters) from a Russian roadblock controlling access to the village of Akhmaji, a half dozen Russian tanks and other armored vehicles can be seen in the valley.

    Local police chief Timur Burduli said the vehicles appeared during the first week of April and are the Russian forces closest to Tbilisi, the Georgian capital. "A tank needs only 40 minutes," he said.

    Along the highway to Tbilisi, a freshly dug anti-tank trench stretches across a long field. Steve Bird, spokesman for the EU monitors, said the Georgians have been building such defenses in recent weeks.
     
  6. sinojosh123
    Offline

    sinojosh123 New Member
    Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  7. Mightypeon
    Offline

    Mightypeon Junior Member
    VIP Professional

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2006
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    As a slight update, the EU report clearly states that Georgia started the war by shelling the South Ossetian capitial.
     
  8. Scratch
    Offline

    Scratch Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    2,116
    Likes Received:
    1,091
    Going back to this conflict in the Caucasus, Russia seems to consolidate the state of Abkhazia and South Osetia by strongly bolstering their defenses.
    There's a S-300 missiles in Abkhazia now, and Georgia claims these systems are also in South Osetia already, wich Russia denies at this point.

     
  9. ccL1
    Offline

    ccL1 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    0
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but does Georgia have a reason to fear the S-300? It's not an offensive weapons system. It's a defensive system.
     
  10. rhino123
    Offline

    rhino123 Pencil Pusher
    VIP Professional

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2006
    Messages:
    1,937
    Likes Received:
    179
    I believe if S-300 had been set up around Georgia, it could deny the country flying space, and Russia was able to shoot down any aircrafts of any types at practically anytime at will, without the need of deploying fighters.

    Sometime this is a type of strategy used to force a country to submission. As we all know the most direct way and sometime the fastest way of forcing a nation to bow was to use very strong offensive force to knock the nation into submission. But in this way, you would create huge infrastructure damages and the people will never really be submissive, which will give rise to many aftermath problems.

    Another way, a more subtle way of doing things was to deploy huge number of 'defensive' weaponries around the target country. And these 'defensive' weapons will form an effective net whereby you could choose and pick which aircraft would be allowed to leave the airspace, and which to not. And if the relationship went a bit more sour, you could deny total airspace to and from the country. And for a country that was basically not self reliance and needed imports of foreign goods and aids, this would force them to go dry as nothing can go to them, and they cannot go out too. This would most certain create panicks and soon downfall of the government.

    And this way would also most certainly bring a small nation down to its knee without any damage to the infrastructure and other installation within the country and so you could still make use of these infrastructures if you so decided to go in and 'stay'.
     
    #520 rhino123, Aug 26, 2010
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2010
Loading...

Share This Page