New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) in China

Tyler

Captain
Registered Member
I dont blame them. SpaceX is pretty incredible and it his biggest achievement to date.

Instead of the other billionaires, looking at you Jack Ma and other Chinese rich people, storing their money on the bank and doing it nothing with them, Elon invests on his dreams ans he is building innovative companies.

So these Chinese who sit and play with their money should start doing something worthwile by building innovative companies too. They are already openly mocked for trying to squeeze poor micro-sellers and not doing real R&D
Chinese billionaires are very innovative. They are creating more innovative companies all the time. Just look at all the new companies that are getting listed on the stock exchanges.
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
Teslas success is more to do with Elon Musk than their vehicles. The guy has cultivated a Tony Stark image and has a cult like following across the world. People are investing in Him rather than his company per se.

Tesla is also the trend setter and the leading innovator in plenty of EV departments, especially when they started out. It is still one dominant technology developer in the EV field albeit having lost plenty of ground to increasing number of competitors. They led UI/UX and still doing decently although I think Chinese EVs are actually getting ahead here with much better integrated narrow AI assistants. They also still lead autonomous driving although competitors should be gaining ground since they are in catch up and it's all easy cheap hardware along with software which is one of China's strong points since it doesn't require decades of experience and collected, passed down knowledge.

There is definitely more to Tesla than Elon's iron man cult of personality thing lol but that Romanticism actually does help foster the "right" kind of enthusiasm and community. It's the exact thing thoroughly lacking in Chinese tech fields from China Academy of Science to research institutions to labs and universities. Americans like to culturally propel a sense of wonder and adventure while PRC (new China) at least previously depended on the whole socialist spiel which is honestly commendable and respectable BUT doesn't work for everyone. That whole American dream, being the leader venturing into the unknown is far more powerful a motivator than "to serve the people"... for most humans. China brute forces a lot while the Americans do have a culture of innovation that Chinese culture stifles somewhat in its people. This is why Tesla was the trend setter and Chinese state and companies realised AFTER the fact that EV is actually going to be the basis of a lot of the "stuff" in the 21st century. At least China recognises lessons to learn and learns them I suppose.

I dont blame them. SpaceX is pretty incredible and it his biggest achievement to date.

Instead of the other billionaires, looking at you Jack Ma and other Chinese rich people, storing their money on the bank and doing it nothing with them, Elon invests on his dreams ans he is building innovative companies.

So these Chinese who sit and play with their money should start doing something worthwile by building innovative companies too. They are already openly mocked for trying to squeeze poor micro-sellers and not doing real R&D

It's a cultural attitude. Play it safe. Make money, be comfortable etc. It's the remaining vestige of the previous generation who grew up in poverty and slaved their asses off for a brighter future. They are worthy of respect and love but not some sort of emulation. A smart younger generation is what I observe. I think they understand what to appreciate and what to change. Like all generations, the important fundamental realisations are first understood (national identity NOT Supremacy or Exceptionalism or grand delusion), real threats, real world, real circumstances... the rest works out perfectly.

I doubt younger Chinese billionaires will ever sit idle. I have encountered ONLY the exact opposite well not billionaires haha but exceptional talents paving entire future industries. Intelligent ones realise how to understand and use excess money. The stupid ones are good only to spend it stupidly. Fool and money easily parted etc so all's good there. For every disappointing LV Gucci fangirl, there is someone else who at least leads a frugal life, then there is someone actually making something out of that money. Jack Ma and the older billionaires lived in a time when the entire nation did not have the wealth they currently do. It's not fair to judge their attitudes by western standards where people have long left subsistence farming and threat of poverty. Well most western nations anyway. The US is an ironic exception here.
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
Chinese billionaires are very innovative. They are creating more innovative companies all the time. Just look at all the new companies that are getting listed on the stock exchanges.

Quite true actually for many of them. I've often been surprised at how businesses in China innovate financial and business operations alone. Xiaomi was and still is a decent example. They set that trend but benefited from understanding reality. Rule number 1 of life. Do not self delude. Know yourself and know your enemy. Xiaomi saw how the global supply chain and engineering of consumer products was almost entirely done wholesale in parts of China, and then mainly shenzhen for the types of products they wanted to get into. They realised that western brands do badge engineering and entire lines are actually engineered and designed in supplier centres with MINIMAL input from western brands just shit like make this x failure rate and change this colour... change this font for western consumer... correct this current to this instead etc.

It's just one example of a clever way to innovate in only how you run a business. Worthy of MBA case studies if people dare "celebrate and glorify" a Chinese company lol.

I think the hyper competitve space in China helps this. The amount of choices and the amount of small to large varieties are about as distant now as the gap was between US and the USSR 50 years ago. China constantly challenges even my own preconceptions of it. Of course there's still plenty to improve and do better but I'm glad they have constantly worked at this struggle even without much more motivation than simply acquiring wealth (political and economic power) and "serving the people". Particularly interesting is how China is showing the way for a third system or at least a departure from the accepted dogmatic structures. Play by no rules except those of nature and your own even if you want to call it an ironically hilarious name - xyz with Chinese characteristics.
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
BTW know yourself and know your enemy isn't literal. It's about understanding reality under no delusion. Knowing your enemy is understanding the problem. The first step towards doing something is properly understanding the problem. Most students of mathematics and the sciences realise what this truly means all too well. Most people go about life without the awareness of the true nature of problems. The enemy are the circumstances that limit you. If you can't control the wind, you can at least steer the sails sort of thing. The enemy is to be conquered through an application of methods you use to solve the problem you now understand with no delusions of your own capabilities and resources.

I think this is partly why east asian cultures flourish so quickly (relative) and develop with haste. If Japan wasn't knee capped by the Americans in the 1980s to 1990s and "tiger economies" weren't robbed blind by the capitalists of the west, they would be even further along today than they currently are. East Asians have a cultural disdain for self delusion. It's almost shamed and condemned and so ingrained. It's also partly why we are culturally less adventurous and daring compared to students of western culture.

In this field of EVs Chinese companies are followers still. While great innovation in battery tech and business practices like NIO's battery change stations and the way they commodified the nature of battery ownership, we have only seen predictable planning and development. These will include centralised control and directing of EVs traveling within a city with fully optimised routes planned as an integrated collective. It will probably involve sharing the vehicle and converting into a public only good unless good exceptions. These are all predictable stuff waiting for certain things to mature and become developed.
 
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AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
BTW know yourself and know your enemy isn't literal. It's about understanding reality under no delusion. Knowing your enemy is understanding the problem. The first step towards doing something is properly understanding the problem. Most students of mathematics and the sciences realise what this truly means all too well. Most people go about life without the awareness of the true nature of problems. The enemy are the circumstances that limit you. If you can't control the wind, you can at least steer the sails sort of thing. The enemy is to be conquered through an application of methods you use to solve the problem you now understand with no delusions of your own capabilities and resources.

I think this is partly why east asian cultures flourish so quickly (relative) and develop with haste. If Japan wasn't knee capped by the Americans in the 1980s to 1990s and "tiger economies" weren't robbed blind by the capitalists of the west, they would be even further along today than they currently are. East Asians have a cultural disdain for self delusion. It's almost shamed and condemned and so ingrained. It's also partly why we are culturally less adventurous and daring compared to students of western culture.

In this field of EVs Chinese companies are followers still. While great innovation in battery tech and business practices like NIO's battery change stations and the way they commodified the nature of battery ownership, we have only seen predictable planning and development. These will include centralised control and directing of EVs traveling within a city with fully optimised routes planned as an integrated collective. It will probably involve sharing the vehicle and converting into a public only good unless good exceptions. These are all predictable stuff waiting for certain things to mature and become developed.

Also consider how many previous innovations didn't arise in the USA.

But US companies were previously the fastest to adopt those innovations AND to use these on a scale that their smaller competitors in developed Europe and Asia couldn't match.

In comparison, China can match or exceed the US for speed. Plus China also works to a larger scale than the USA.
 
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Japan's Sagawa to buy 7,200 low-priced EVs made in China​

Guangxi Automobile to make Japan-designed commercial minivans on OEM basis
https%253A%252F%252Fs3-ap-northeast-1.amazonaws.com%252Fpsh-ex-ftnikkei-3937bb4%252Fimages%252F0%252F7%252F1%252F6%252F33586170-4-eng-GB%252FCropped-1618303713photo_SXM2021041300005376.jpg

A prototype of the Sagawa-designed small electric commercial van (Photo by Kosuke Imamura).
Nikkei staff writers April 13, 2021 18:55 JST
TOKYO -- Sagawa Express, a subsidiary of Japan's SG Holdings, has decided to purchase 7,200 low-priced electric minivans which will be made in China, Nikkei has learned. Sagawa, a major transport company, will use those EVs to deliver goods mostly over short distances.

China's Guangxi Automobile Group will manufacture small electric commercial vans designed by a Japanese startup on an Original Equipment Manufacturer basis. This will be the first example of a Chinese-made EV making a large-scale landing in Japan.

The van will have a cruising range of more than 200 km. Specifications will be finalized in August, and the Chinese automaker, based in the Guangxi Zhuang Autonomous Region in southern China, will start mass production as early as in September, with deliveries expected in September 2022.

Sagawa, a major transport company, will use those EVs to deliver goods mostly over short distances.
 
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