Could HEWS of Aselsan be integrated into JF-17 ?
because
because
Me too. I'd like to know what EW suite is JF-17 Block 3 is having.
JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread
- Thread starter johnqh
- Start date
Guys ... final warning!! Especially @Tam with yet another reply.
Wait this EW discussion is directly relevant for the JF-17, we need to know if it will be able to integrate DRFM based EW Suite.
That depends on who is manufacturing them.
Yes, found a source:
"A January 2019 U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) report assessing Chinese military air, land and sea power noted that the J-20 features sophisticated electronic warfare suites with advanced DRFM jammers and electrical optical defensive systems."
This also takes care of that (allegedly) 'Denel engineer's' claim that Chinese EW is a decade behind. That clearly is not true.
So if the Block III gets DRFM EW, it will likely be from China, because as far as I can find, Turkey does not produce DRFM jammers for its fighter aircraft, but only for its landbased systems and helicopters. For its fighters, it acquires DRFM jammers from Raytheon, most likely because of US restrictions forbidding it to integrate local suite on its vipers.
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I've read that it might be the blk 2 that has been photographed with Aselsan EW pods? Or am I misremembering this and it was targeting pods.
There's obviously a lot of enthusiastic talk about Turkish equipment on blk 3. I understand the excitement and loaded discussions on PDF on this topic but do you happen to know if there's truth behind the Turkish equipment and specifics?
Personally I don't consider PAF going with non-Chinese equipment to be reflective of Chinese military equipment. There are obvious areas where Chinese equipment are lacking when compared to western ones but whenever a country decides to go with non-Chinese subsystems or rid their inventory, many use it to make some outrageous sweeping conclusions which also triggers the Chinese chauvinists to get aggressive. Pakistan has made it clear wrt Greece and Libya that it is getting very close to Erdogan's Turkey. Cooperating on subsystems and talk of partnering in 5th gen programs is just a beginning. Would imagine some of these procurement decisions will not have everything to do with immediate capability but also consider the long-term mutual development of Pakistani and Turkish defence industries.
AFAIK we only have ASELPOD for targeting. I dont know of any official confirmation of EW cooperation with Turkey yet. And by the way, Turkey does not manufactures any EW pods for fighter aircraft (DRFM or not.) It only manufactures an Internal EW system (SPEWS-II) for its Vipers, but that is not DRFM capable. I added some more info in my last post about this.
I'm not on PDF and I don't even visit it, so I have no idea what 'talk' is happening there on this topic. When something real comes out, it will be revealed through better channels. In the meantime, all rumors should be disregarded until there is some official confirmation or a reliable report coming from a credible source.
It's a good thing that the decision makers in Pakistan/China/Turkey are nothing like the chauvinists on the internet lolz. That's why I found that debate on this thread to be ridiculous. I'm expecting that cooperation between China and Turkey and will increase, and I think Pakistan should help and facilitate that. It's not about "China versus Turkey", that's a false dichotomy.
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Dizasta1
Senior Member
I highly doubt that Pakistan Air Force will go for any "comprehensive" Turkish option for avionics or electronic warfare suite. The Chinese integrated EW Suite will prove to be far superior to any foreign option. I believe Pakistan Air Force is more than satisfied with Block-llls and is gearing up for these aircraft to be inducted into it's fighter fleet.
Since I'm one of those Chinese chauvinists you referred to (hell, I'm the arch-chauvinist), I'll weigh in on this. First though, I have to say that I'm pleasantly surprised this whole topic is still going strong in this thread. I gave Turkey the verbal smack 10 pages ago
https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/jf-17-fc-1-fighter-aircraft-thread.t5634/page-482#post-583157
and it's touched off a firestorm that's still going strong. That's what I love about SDF - you guys will take a topic and strip it to the bone. It also tells me that there's a real hunger for political debate (along with all the jostling it entails) around here. People here hold PDF in disdain, but for all its faults it's a much freer and more open forum than this one.
Chinese military technology is certainly behind
Middle Eastern geopolitics is one of my favourite topics; it's the irl Game of Thrones. There's a new schism forming in the Muslim world - in addition to the classic Sunni-Shiite split everyone's familiar with - with Arabs on one side and Turkey on the other. Libya is the victim country in which this conflict is playing out, with Turkey supporting the UN-recognized Government of National Accord (you can promptly forget the name, it's not going to last long anyway) and Saudi/UAE/Egypt supporting general Khalifa Haftar (you don't need to remember his name either, he's just another of those Arab rulers known by their first name, "General"). Incidentally, Chinese drones are doing quite a lot of work in that war on Haftar's behalf.
I brought all this up to put Pakistan's policies into context. I don't think Pakistan is getting close to Erdogan's Turkey; just recently there was a summit held in Malaysia that was understood to be a show of support for Turkey that Saudi Arabia pressured Pakistan to snub
I never thought I'd say this, but I think China should align closer to Saudi Arabia. MBS is trying to strangle Wahhabism and move his country toward some form of modernity, China should wish him well and help him however it can. Erdogan's neo-Ottoman ambition - perhaps even Turkey's existence as a unified state - is a threat to China. I believe the most prudent policy is for China to put its thumb on the scales in the Arabs' favour through closer economic engagement and cooperation so that they can build the necessary capacity to contain Turkey.
1) There is nothing "new" about the schism between the Turks and Arabs, it has been going on for centuries. Turks and Arabs have massive grudges against each other, leftovers from the Ottoman rule of Arab lands, and consequent rebellion of the Arabs. Pakistan is doing everything it can to repair this 'schism,' including the other schism between the Saudis and Iranians (Sunni/Shia issue.)
2) Your claim that Pakistan's absence from the Malaysia summit signals problems in the Pak-Turkey relations is also incorrect. This is evident from the statements that came out of all camps. Turkey blamed the Saudis immediately, without saying anything negative about Pakistan. Also, Malaysia followed up by criticizing India (for the protests) also signalling that its relations with Pakistan are solid. The fact of the matter is that the Malaysia summit was dead in the water from the moment the Saudis refused to attend.
I can go into details of the reasoning of all the major players involved, but I rather not get into it, because this drama has a level of complexity far beyond 'Game of Thrones'... plus it is completely off-topic for this thread.
I hope you start a new thread on the topic, I'm very interested in reading your thoughts about it.
Oh man, that's very long discussion which will take too much time here lolz
But I can recommend a couple of books as a primer if you're interested:
- A Peace to End All Peace: The fall of the Ottoman empire and the creation of the modern middle east
- A Brutal Friendship: The West and the Arab Elite
If you have any specific questions though feel free to PM me.