Hong-Kong Protests

KYli

Brigadier
It was only until the British knew they had to hand Hong Kong back to China was when they released their stranglehold on Hong Kong more than they ever did. Even they granted their faux democracy when before there was none and it became the financial city it has become. Before, Hong Kong was no different from the reputation of Shenzhen a decade ago. All those rich people that fled the communist to Hong Kong were no different from the Hos of Macau. Rich by corruption. They were no different from the warlords that served whichever colonial master that was in control at the time. They were only rich because the British allowed them to be rich or they fled somewhere else.

Here in the US Americans are free to say their racist beliefs about Asians because they don't fear any repercussions. Over in Hong Kong, the colonialists are the minority. Things can turn south very quickly and that's why they allowed some Chinese to be rich just as along as they served British interests and not work against them.

That I do agree. I just think Hong Kong became a financial city is more to do with the opening up of China in 1978 than the British relaxing the stranglehold.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
That I do agree. I just think Hong Kong became a financial city is more to do with the opening up of China in 1978 than the British relaxing the stranglehold.

Official talks were right around the corner. The British were thinking of violating the rule of law and breaking the treaty by keeping Hong Kong because it was right after the Falklands War and they were being cocky. And then Deng told Thatcher that the Chinese were moving in with or without their okay. I'm sure that offended the British. That's nearly two decades to lay the seeds of sabotage before the handover. Like I said, poor people are easier to control than wealthy ones. They don't want it that easy for the Chinese. And people forget today the British's legacy of denying human rights and democracy to which letting Hong Kong get rich and not just a few like before was designed to do.
 
let me see how HK has been doing over like sixty years ...:

Clipboard594.jpg

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plus skimmed over
Hong Kong
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***
now I go check how it's on the ground
 
... what caught my interest was the praise of Macao by
  • Glob. Times
    HK turmoil 'a warning shot' for Macao SAR: incoming chief
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    and by
  • Xinhua
    Spotlight: Macao shows charm of hospitality to world tourists
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by the way didn't know down there the GDP
• Per capita
11px-Increase2.svg.png
$81,728
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(
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) according to wiki -- wondering how much is courtesy of gamblers hahaha

and what also caught my interest was the bounty:
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Nutrient

Junior Member
Registered Member
20 000 thousand person is more than enough to make extreme damage to a 5-10 million city, if they receive supply from a bigger country.

Not if the people no longer support the rebels. Currently, the rioters have some support from the Hong Kong population (but nowhere near a majority as some people here are claiming). This support, as small as it is now, would plunge to nearly zero if the island started suffering seriously.

And HK's economy would be heavily hit if the mainland started inspecting incoming ships on suspicion of weapons smuggling -- before the ships got close to Hong Kong. I think most people here would agree that the mainland would have the legal right to do this (every country does). And the mainland is strong enough militarily to enforce the inspections. Shipping would slow down drastically, and this would seriously hurt Hong Kong; its port is already having trouble with strong competitors like Shanghai, Singapore, and even nearby Shenzhen.

With its economy suffering grievously, I think that Hong Kong's government, police, and justice system would quite quickly terminate the rebellion.
 

KYli

Brigadier
Not all my previous arguments were based on noting recent drops in protester numbers. I have always questioned your position that a majority of the Hong Kong population is supporting the thugs. For example, I have questioned your assertion that the election validates the cockroaches.
But you haven't provided anything to backup your arguments except your "observation".



How have I been proven wrong? The 12/8 demonstration was actually smaller than some previous protests. As I have been saying, lots of people are NOT showing up any more.
Not biggest rally but still one of the biggest rallies which proved you are wrong.



How does it make me look bad? The police estimated that 183,000 people showed up. If this estimate is closer to the truth than the very likely inflated figure of 800,000. can you deny that 97% of Hong Kong's population did NOT participate in the Dec 8 demonstration? If you think that the 3% who did show up can somehow represent a majority of the Hong Kong population, you are spreading cockroach propaganda.

(Even the inflated figure of 800,000 means that 89% of the population didn't participate on Dec 8. How is that anywhere close to a majority?)

I am not going to hide my head in the sand and pretend that the pan-Dems camp and the rioters don't have popular support. For too many years, many of pro-Beijing supporters believed that those Hong Kongers who advocate for independent is just a fringe group. That there is a silent majority. The truth is the pan-Dems Camp has slowly taken control of the media and education system and was able to brainwash two generations of youngsters. If people continue to hide in the sand and refuse to acknowledge the strong supports these rioters enjoy, then nothing would be done to fix the problems in education, media, and judicial etc. And the future of HK is bleak. The election result is a wake up call for me and for many people.

So you think the 97% who didn't participate on Dec 8, meaning the 97% don't support the rioters. I have not much to say but good luck with this new "observation".
 

Nutrient

Junior Member
Registered Member
let me see how HK has been doing over like sixty years ...:

Clipboard594.jpg

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)

Perhaps you wanted to say that Hong Kong is just fine economically. Your graph shows the island growing nicely; the graph ends in 2018, with 5.40% growth that year, and that is pretty good. So HK is doing fine, and will be fine despite the riots, right?

Wrong! As even Western media is beginning to realize,
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.

Hong Kong has plunged into deep recession after its economy was hit by a double whammy of violent street protests and the US-China trade war.

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in the three months to September as a loss of exports was compounded by a collapse in consumer spending and a loss of revenue from tourists.
 

Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
Recession in HK haven’t negatively affected growth on the mainland. If anything, it leads to capital movement there. Remeber HK doesn’t pay central government tax, so anything bad that happens to their economy would only affect them.

Going ahead, if the local government wants to keep allowing America shilling policies, they’ll just be locked out of any important decision making processes and free to run their city into the ground economically like Detroit.

Well armed terrorism would never happen, because it’s almost impossible to get weapons into China in any meaningful amount, especially w/o a land border.

China’s most important defense in HK is not the military base on land but the navy. If a heavily armed terror group arises, the navy could park ships into the Bay Area and there’s nothing anyone can do to dislodge them.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
China was a man unparalleled track record when it comes to counter insurgency.

Let’s not forget that it managed to utterly eradicate all ROC and western attempts at fermenting civil unrest and rebellion.

The only instances where foreign agitators could gain any sort of traction is when Beijing grants special freedoms and privileges to regions, Tibet, Xinjiang and HK being examples in point.

However, as soon as any credible insurrectionist/terrorist movement forms, Beijing has both the political will and military power to put that down and put that down hard. Tibet and Xinjiang again being examples in point.

HK has only been spared so far because the riots have not yet cross the line into lethal terrorism; and for political reasons already gone over at length previously.

But the point is that the CIA knows from its own long and sorry first hand experiences with trying to ferment armed rebellions in China that such movements are utterly ineffective and would be crushed with laughable easy by Beijing.

That is why they have kept the rioting at a sub-fatal level and has not done anything to try to push it into armed terrorism/open rebellion. Because as soon as the rioters cross that red line, Beijing would deploy the PAP to utterly crush them in short order, and the America would not be able to use that as leverage to pressure the EU into joining its losing trade war against China, since the EU would think sending in the PAP would be a reasonable response under those circumstances.
 
Perhaps you wanted to say that Hong Kong is just fine economically. Your graph shows the island growing nicely; the graph ends in 2018, with 5.40% growth that year, and that is pretty good. So HK is doing fine, and will be fine despite the riots, right?

Wrong! As even Western media is beginning to realize,
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.
oh I was aware of the recession (that is obviously not shown in the chart I posted Today at 8:09 AM as it doesn't cover 2019)
:
Dec 2, 2019
Hong Kong anti-government protests bring biggest retail slump on record, as finance minister Paul Chan reveals cost to overall economy
  • City’s finance chief says months of social unrest have caused economic losses of about 2 per cent of GDP
  • Government reveals it is on course for first budget deficit in 15 years
basically the article describes the current HK recession; follow the link
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if interested


EDIT linking what Glob. Times had to say:
HK set to report first budget deficit in 15 years
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Dec 3, 2019
Yesterday at 7:41 PM
followup:
Hong Kong to roll out more relief measures amid economic recession
Xinhua| 2019-12-03 22:18:01
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inside seeing "over 1,000 more restaurants may not survive the current crisis by February" makes me wonder how many restaurants are there in HK


wow, from googlefu:
Number of restaurants in HK?
According to Food & Environmental Hygiene Department, total number of restaurants in HK has slightly increased to 15,524 by late July 2019 but remained quite stable around this figure over the year.
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