Is the US shooting itself in the foot by banning Huawei?

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gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
Micron and Intel can be replaced with other vendors. Micron isn't even in the top three in terms of memory products. A company like Toshiba has better products let alone other companies like Samsung or Hynix. For server side products where you own the software source code you can basically use any chip which has the required performance and recompile the software to run on it. You don't "need" to use Intel products and in fact several clients are moving away from those.

If it wasn't for historical difficulties with the Chinese/Japan relationship the Chinese could easily get all the requisite technologies from Japan including lithographic equipment. Still it does show the problem I talked about before, the Chinese industry is vulnerable to attacks on its suppliers like this. Where the US might have failed is that if they started this 2 years from now China would already be manufacturing many of these products themselves. So the Chinese are close to manufacturing alternative products already. The sanctions and tariffs the US is imposing right now also targets products by revenue. This means to a large degree Chinese companies are still capable of continuing their push for self-reliance with the added motivation provided by the tariffs. The sanctions are that poorly targeted. Even if it takes a decade to produce alternates I doubt the Chinese will forget this.

About previous comments, from what I understand FPGAs aren't that hard of a technology to develop. The reason for there being so few main vendors is because to dominate the market you need to be able to produce the FPGAs at a leading edge semiconductor factory, China has lagged in that area. But FPGAs are typically a quick-fix scheme to solve a problem and don't have the performance of a dedicated ASIC. The only reason they gained adoption is because having enough electronic engineers to design ASICs is expensive for most companies. But China has no shortage of engineers. Also in several applications GPUs can replace ASICs and there are several vendors for those in China as well as off the shelf products to license like ARM's Mali.

I think the Chinese government should more directly financially support Chinese enterprises efforts in import substitution instead of just generally financing semiconductors in general.
 
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Would it be possible for China to threaten to cut off rare earth and tungsten to US bases firms and their supply chains in a similar manner? Perhaps suggest or allude to the possibility indirectly, in a manner not as forward and direct as Trump's threats. Just a mere suggestion will spark absolute terror in US tech sector and Wall Street.
 
now noticed the tweet
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China firmly opposes unilateral sanctions imposed by any country on Chinese entities in accordance with its own domestic law, a FM spokesperson told a press briefing while commenting on the US'
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ban.
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Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. You should read up and learn how mechanically complex these systems actually are.

And you don't know hwo advance is Chinese semiconductor equipment manufacturer are Go read it I already posted so many of them
For every semiconductor equipment manufacturer China has analoque. There are thousand of Chinese engineer who worked for the like of Applied material, Lam research, ASML, KLA tensor who come back to China and started their own bussiness.

Add to that there are thousands of retire Japanese, Korean and Taiwan engineer who work in China

It is pontless to debate. Here is the bet comeback next year see if Huawei is istill standing and prosper I bet they will

First here were Cocom then Iter none of them slop Chinese defense industries It take them longer but
They get there WS10 in mass production
 
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now I read
17:48, 16-May-2019
U.S. bans Huawei: National security or geopolitical insecurity?
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A concerted U.S. campaign is to target Huawei, the telecom giant which promises to transform lives through technological advancements.

Hours after the U.S. President signed an executive order effectively banning American companies from using Huawei's 5G network, Huawei issued a statement, calling the restrictions unreasonable, and infringing upon its rights. It asserted that Trump's decision would only hinder the development of fifth generation of mobile networks or 5G technology in the U.S.

Earlier, the company had also discounted fears of any adverse impact on its revenue.

Huawei's Executive Director David Wang said earlier that Huawei's position in this regard is "consistent." In addition, he pointed out that any change in one country has little impact on Huawei's global business.

The U.S. and a few other nations believe that Huawei poses a security threat, a charge which many experts say is not supported by evidence.

M.I.T. Media Lab founder Nicholas Negroponte has also questioned these accusations, calling Trump administration's Huawei policy a geopolitical move.

But the company is still willing to address all concerns of foreign governments by offering to sign a no-spy agreement, while vehemently denying that its work poses risks of espionage.

In the mobile phone arena, Huawei is currently the largest Chinese vendor by volume and the No. 2 worldwide by sales, just behind Samsung. They produce some of the most advanced chips in the world, including those in mobile phones and artificial intelligence (AI) processors.

On Wednesday, it unveiled a domestic AI database named
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which combines data and intelligence and embeds AI capabilities in distributed databases.

But the jewel in the Huawei's crown seems to be the company's pre-eminence in 5G technology.

In January, the company launched the world's first core chip specifically designed for 5G base stations.

Huawei says the chipset, called Tiangang, will support simplified 5G networks and large-scale network deployment around the globe.

It also launched its first 5G Modem known as Balong 5000, which it claims is the world's most powerful modem.

As the U.S. attempts to block Huawei's rise, the company has secured over 30 foreign commercial 5G contracts, shipping over 25,000 5G base stations globally.

According to tech experts, 5G is indispensable to developing the technology of the future. So a blocking campaign is bound to fail.
 

Icmer

Junior Member
Registered Member
Would it be possible for China to threaten to cut off rare earth and tungsten to US bases firms and their supply chains in a similar manner? Perhaps suggest or allude to the possibility indirectly, in a manner not as forward and direct as Trump's threats. Just a mere suggestion will spark absolute terror in US tech sector and Wall Street.

It clearly didn't work in 2010, though it may not have been intentional, official retaliation.
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China lost the WTO case over this and reversed its export quotas
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And other countries managed to find alternatives
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now I read
Why Washington cannot contain Huawei
Source:Global Times Published: 2019/5/16 21:53:40
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US President Donald Trump signed an executive order on Wednesday to declare a national emergency over threats against American technology. The US Commerce Department then added Huawei and its 70 affiliates to its "Entity List." Their real purpose was to completely ban Huawei devices in the US and to restrict Huawei from purchasing US-produced components. The US suppression of Huawei is escalating regardless of morality and business rules.

But it's impossible for the US to tear down the manufacturer that leads the 5G network. First of all, Huawei did not violate business rules or US laws. This enables it to use legal means to resist the US government's unfair decisions and to protect its own rights.

Huawei is indisputably leading 5G network technology. Mastering a large number of technical patents for communication networks, it is now cross-purchasing technologies with US companies. Harm caused by cutting ties between Huawei and US enterprises will be two-way. Huawei will never allow itself to be trampled upon by the US government.

In recent years, the US has not stopped spitefully threatening Huawei. Huawei has been developing itself in an international environment way worse than that of Western companies. But special crisis awareness has thus been fostered. Huawei puts a high value on independent research and development of key technologies and attaches great importance to supply chain backups of components and parts. Hence Huawei cannot be shocked if the US cuts off key component supply.

Huawei doesn't sell a lot of devices in the US. Its main business is helping some non-central areas of the US build their communications network. These areas will suffer economic losses if they abandon Huawei equipment. The networks there will operate at a poorer quality and cost more.

The US has publicly mobilized national power and resources to contain Huawei. This is unprecedented. However, the crackdown isn't going smoothly. It remains to be seen to what extent Washington can persuade its allies to exclude Huawei from their 5G construction.

The US, as the most powerful country in the world and a leader of the West, has spared no efforts in suppressing a private company but yielded little results.

First, that's because the US actions are immoral and against the logic of the market. Huawei's leading role in 5G technology has caused a strong sense of crisis in the US. Washington, instead of promoting its own companies' technological advancement, has taken hooligan actions to deal with Huawei. However, the alleged Huawei threats, fabricated and infinitely magnified by the US, failed to outweigh various countries' demands for Huawei equipment, thus putting Washington in a passive position.

The second reason is that Huawei has unchallengeable technology and quality management to withstand a crisis. The company's technological advancement capabilities, internal management level and ability to respond to crises have proven to be among the best in the world. Chinese society should fully support Huawei, including offering it moral encouragement and supporting Huawei products. China should also use diplomatic resources to hedge against US suppression of Huawei. The US cannot strangle Huawei, nor will it be able to contain the development of China and deprive the 1.4 billion Chinese people of their development rights.
 
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