Potential PLANAF Carrier Aviation Alternatives
- Thread starter crobato
- Start date
In Varyag case, it would be hopless attempt. The STOBAR configuration needs good STOL cabability in order to take off using the ski-jump and JH-7 just simply doesen't have the required performance. The biggest lag is the needed thrust. Like it's western counterpart Tornado IDS, it's engines (Spey MK. 202) provides just enough thrust needed for interdiction work. Taking off from the Ski-jump of Varyag needs pretty much thrust-to weight ratio being over 1 so with the JH-7 could only take off without any armament and only limited fuel...not exactly usefull for military purposes...
Can someone tell me why has the kuznetsov class been designed in such a way that planes start their take off relatively close to bow of the ship? Wouldn't their max take off weight figure go up if they had a longer run before hitting the ski jump? Sure, it'd probably prevent simultaneous take off and landing procedures but added range/weapons on planes would be more than worth it, no?
Well there is a third takeoff spot in Kuznetsov, which is ment for heavier load aircrafts. It's located were the blue rounder indicates in this following pic:
Now remember that the Kuznetsov had it's skijump intended for the VSTOL use only, the conventional Su-33s and MiG-29Ks became in to the picture later on. The STOBAR in generally is just russian excuse for the current situation. Kuznetsov was never intended to use it's Skijump as a main launcher for non-VSTOL planes, only the cirqumstances made it possiple. As the concept works (someways) they are now marketing it as a cheap alternative to CATOBAR. However it's suitability to non-VSTOL planes is very limited and it will force the planes using it to sacrifice their playload in order to just get airbrone. There is no need to specualte wheter this plane or that plane could be added to the PLANs future carrierwings becouse frankly only very hihg performance modern 4th generation fighters like Su-33 can use the STOBAR system even adeqautly usefully and even so it have to make sacrifices which it wouldn't have to make with CATOBAR.
Now remember that the Kuznetsov had it's skijump intended for the VSTOL use only, the conventional Su-33s and MiG-29Ks became in to the picture later on. The STOBAR in generally is just russian excuse for the current situation. Kuznetsov was never intended to use it's Skijump as a main launcher for non-VSTOL planes, only the cirqumstances made it possiple. As the concept works (someways) they are now marketing it as a cheap alternative to CATOBAR. However it's suitability to non-VSTOL planes is very limited and it will force the planes using it to sacrifice their playload in order to just get airbrone. There is no need to specualte wheter this plane or that plane could be added to the PLANs future carrierwings becouse frankly only very hihg performance modern 4th generation fighters like Su-33 can use the STOBAR system even adeqautly usefully and even so it have to make sacrifices which it wouldn't have to make with CATOBAR.
China intends to buy Russia's Su-33 fighters
01/11/2006 13:15 ZHUHAI (China), November 1 (RIA Novosti) -
China intends to purchase Su-33 Naval Flanker ship-borne fighters from Russia, but negotiations on this issue are still at the preliminary stage, a government official said Wednesday at China's largest air show.
Alexander Denisov, a high-ranking military and technical official, is heading Russia's delegation at Airshow China 2006. The huge five-day exhibition which began Tuesday at Zhuhai, near Hong Kong, has attracted aircraft makers from 18 countries, seeking lucrative contracts on the booming Chinese market.
Denisov said, "Each party has the right to purchase what it needs to protect its national interests, and the Chinese side intends to buy Su-33 aircraft; but negotiations are still at the preliminary stage." "Russia is ready to supply all armaments and hardware its enterprises are developing, and will hold negotiations, if the Chinese side expresses such a wish," Denisov said.
However, the official denied media reports claiming that Russia has sold, or intends to sell, Su-27 Flanker fighters to Taiwan.
More than 50 Russian defense companies, including Sukhoi and MiG, are presenting fighter planes, helicopters, and military technology at the air show in China, along with civilian aircraft makers. Aircraft maker Tupolev said it expects to sell two cargo planes to China this year and three next year, while Ilyushin said it plans to deliver at least three planes at the end of 2008.
Alexander Denisov said Russia is ready to help China design an aircraft carrier if asked. "Such a request would not contradict any international agreements or rules. Such cooperation is possible," he said. Chinese media have previously discussed building an aircraft carrier, claiming that China could use the former Soviet carrier Varyag, which was sold to China in the late 1990s, as a basis to design its own model. However, China's military have repeatedly denied the country's plans to build an aircraft carrier
01/11/2006 13:15 ZHUHAI (China), November 1 (RIA Novosti) -
China intends to purchase Su-33 Naval Flanker ship-borne fighters from Russia, but negotiations on this issue are still at the preliminary stage, a government official said Wednesday at China's largest air show.
Alexander Denisov, a high-ranking military and technical official, is heading Russia's delegation at Airshow China 2006. The huge five-day exhibition which began Tuesday at Zhuhai, near Hong Kong, has attracted aircraft makers from 18 countries, seeking lucrative contracts on the booming Chinese market.
Denisov said, "Each party has the right to purchase what it needs to protect its national interests, and the Chinese side intends to buy Su-33 aircraft; but negotiations are still at the preliminary stage." "Russia is ready to supply all armaments and hardware its enterprises are developing, and will hold negotiations, if the Chinese side expresses such a wish," Denisov said.
However, the official denied media reports claiming that Russia has sold, or intends to sell, Su-27 Flanker fighters to Taiwan.
More than 50 Russian defense companies, including Sukhoi and MiG, are presenting fighter planes, helicopters, and military technology at the air show in China, along with civilian aircraft makers. Aircraft maker Tupolev said it expects to sell two cargo planes to China this year and three next year, while Ilyushin said it plans to deliver at least three planes at the end of 2008.
Alexander Denisov said Russia is ready to help China design an aircraft carrier if asked. "Such a request would not contradict any international agreements or rules. Such cooperation is possible," he said. Chinese media have previously discussed building an aircraft carrier, claiming that China could use the former Soviet carrier Varyag, which was sold to China in the late 1990s, as a basis to design its own model. However, China's military have repeatedly denied the country's plans to build an aircraft carrier
the L-15 looks very similiar to russians Yak-130,
- see posting of tphuang at http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/showthread.php?t=495&page=3, postet 04-02-2006
variants of the Yak-130 being considered include a navalised carrier-based trainer aircraft, a lightweight reconnaissance aircraft and an unmanned strike aircraft.
- see
so I become more and more the feeling, that L-15 will be the first PLAN trainer to be used by future carrier pilots
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Yak-130_2006031410594220233600.jpg -
L-15-200644705260ky.jpg
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Yes, I know this is the third attempt with the same question, but as here are more guys, which are more familiar with Chinese carrier developments and projects I try it here again ! 
Any idea what's that .... just a modeller's dream or a real long-dead project ??? (found at the secret-projects page posted by rousseau) !! … it clearly shows a tail-hook and folding wings !
Another one here:
Besides, at the Key-forum "TinWing" mentioned:
Another idea was a lightweight fighter concept maybe from Shenyang (maybe developed out of the original J-11 Mirage F1-look-alike, but as it had quite a different design and regarding the PL-8 on it's fin I'm not sure if this has to be a later design !
Regarding "No carrier fighter design" it clearly shows a tail-hook and folding wings !
Thanks in advance, Deino
Any idea what's that
.... just a modeller's dream or a real long-dead project ??? (found at the secret-projects page posted by rousseau) !! … it clearly shows a tail-hook and folding wings !
Another one here:
Besides, at the Key-forum "TinWing" mentioned:
Another idea was a lightweight fighter concept maybe from Shenyang (maybe developed out of the original J-11 Mirage F1-look-alike, but as it had quite a different design and regarding the PL-8 on it's fin I'm not sure if this has to be a later design !
Regarding "No carrier fighter design" it clearly shows a tail-hook and folding wings !
Thanks in advance, Deino