Jura The idiot
General
after a quick search, I'm guessing you're referring to
Oct 15, 2015
(and probably some previous posts)
052C/052D Class Destroyers
- Thread starter Jeff Head
- Start date
Oct 15, 2015
A probably stupid question: would it be possible to use this crane to rearm a ship in a vertrep ?
First transferring the crane and after the crane is installed transferring some crates of missiles and later dismounting the crane and transferring it back to the supply ship (or the next destroyer to be "filled up").
I guess this would take quite some time and would need near perfect conditions, but might it make sense if a supply ship is part of the task group ?
The USN installed cranes that folded up in their VLS in their Ticos and first two flights of Burkes for the purposes of underway VLS rearming, but they abandoned the practice when they found it too cumbersome and impractical.
What you described is even many times even more cumbersome than having an internal VLS crane.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Henri K did some research on this subject and his iron cload conclusion is that the crane is of removable type
In May 2015, spotters from Shanghai, who were leaving on a ferry to photograph the military ships under construction at the Changxing Jiangnan shipyard, were surprised by the presence of a crane near a vertical launching system ( Vertical Launching System , VLS) of a Type 052D destroyer .
Given the height of the bridge and the angle of view of these first photos, no one was able to say with any certainty whether the crane was on the silos or whether it was installed next to it, not to mention Its functions.
Clearly, do we have the same type of crane that can be integrated in some of the older versions (Mod 0 to 2) of the American VLS Mk 41 , which is used to recharge silos at sea, or is simply a removable crane By the shipyard to advance the arming of the ship?
The crane appeared on a Type 052D destroyer in May 2015 (Photos: MSM)
The new photos that appeared a few months later seem to have at least suggested one thing - the crane in question would be used to recharge the VLS silos on ships.
Indeed, we can see the same crane on the VLS at the front and at the back of the destroyer being armed, along with a supposed silo tube of the CCL ( Concentric Canister Launcher) type , which allows No longer have the common flame exhaust pipe per VLS module, and makes each silo compatible with cold and hot type launch at a time.
The crane and a CCL tube on the VLS located at the bow
Another crane and a CCL tube on the VLS at the rear
In May 2015, spotters from Shanghai, who were leaving on a ferry to photograph the military ships under construction at the Changxing Jiangnan shipyard, were surprised by the presence of a crane near a vertical launching system ( Vertical Launching System , VLS) of a Type 052D destroyer .
Given the height of the bridge and the angle of view of these first photos, no one was able to say with any certainty whether the crane was on the silos or whether it was installed next to it, not to mention Its functions.
Clearly, do we have the same type of crane that can be integrated in some of the older versions (Mod 0 to 2) of the American VLS Mk 41 , which is used to recharge silos at sea, or is simply a removable crane By the shipyard to advance the arming of the ship?
The crane appeared on a Type 052D destroyer in May 2015 (Photos: MSM)
The new photos that appeared a few months later seem to have at least suggested one thing - the crane in question would be used to recharge the VLS silos on ships.
Indeed, we can see the same crane on the VLS at the front and at the back of the destroyer being armed, along with a supposed silo tube of the CCL ( Concentric Canister Launcher) type , which allows No longer have the common flame exhaust pipe per VLS module, and makes each silo compatible with cold and hot type launch at a time.
The crane and a CCL tube on the VLS located at the bow
Another crane and a CCL tube on the VLS at the rear
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
(cont 1)
But this new revelation does not solve the real question that follows: Is this crane that actually helps recharge the VLS integrate in the latter, in which case it will occupy the place of a few silos which makes them unusable and thus reduces The number of silos dedicated to armaments? Or if the crane is removable and therefore a type 052D destroyer has indeed all its 64 silos available for the different missiles, ditto for which has the same model of universal VLS?
Until then, we are only certain about the following three points:
1- The Chinese chose to set up an integrated crane on their H / AJK-03 "circular" VLS , which equips the six Type 052C destroyers , despite the negative feedback from the US Navy On the usefulness and effectiveness of this type of gear.
The built-in, retracted crane of the Type 052C destroyer VLS H / AJK-03
The crane moved
The integrated VLS crane on a Type 052C destroyer being loaded
2- This new crane photographed on the Type 052D destroyers is positioned either on the top of the VLS or on the side. In both cases, it must be firmly secured in one way or another in order to carry out its functions and lift up to two tons of load.
3- The few images of the Type 052D VLS with all the large open silos show that there are no "fused" silos like the old Mk 41 Mod 0 to Mod 2, which provide the space needed to accommodate The integrated crane.
The US in silos crane The integrated crane of the American VLS Mk 41
But this new revelation does not solve the real question that follows: Is this crane that actually helps recharge the VLS integrate in the latter, in which case it will occupy the place of a few silos which makes them unusable and thus reduces The number of silos dedicated to armaments? Or if the crane is removable and therefore a type 052D destroyer has indeed all its 64 silos available for the different missiles, ditto for which has the same model of universal VLS?
Until then, we are only certain about the following three points:
1- The Chinese chose to set up an integrated crane on their H / AJK-03 "circular" VLS , which equips the six Type 052C destroyers , despite the negative feedback from the US Navy On the usefulness and effectiveness of this type of gear.
The built-in, retracted crane of the Type 052C destroyer VLS H / AJK-03
The crane moved
The integrated VLS crane on a Type 052C destroyer being loaded
2- This new crane photographed on the Type 052D destroyers is positioned either on the top of the VLS or on the side. In both cases, it must be firmly secured in one way or another in order to carry out its functions and lift up to two tons of load.
3- The few images of the Type 052D VLS with all the large open silos show that there are no "fused" silos like the old Mk 41 Mod 0 to Mod 2, which provide the space needed to accommodate The integrated crane.
The US in silos crane The integrated crane of the American VLS Mk 41
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
(cont2)
If point 1 tells us that the Chinese navy has already had an "antecedent" to implement this type of gear on the BSVs of their warships, point 3 indicates that it is technically impossible to Retractable crane with telescopic boom in one silo.
This last point does not constitute an argument by "negation" to confirm that the new universal VLS does not benefit from an integrated crane, only the clear answer to the tip 2 allows to loop the loop.
After long hours of research, no trace has been found of this famous crane, nor of its origin, nor of its manner of functioning or of being fixed.
And when we are at a standstill, we go back to the starting point - If the crane is designed to support this new SLV, then it seems logical that both were developed by the same organization. The VLS being more "visible", it would be easier to find elements on it and then extend to our target.
But who developed this universal VLS for the new Type 052D and Type 055 destroyers?
In fact, this new VLS without common flame exhaust is designed by the 713 Institute of the Chinese Naval Group CSIC, the same engineering firm that developed the H / AJK-16 model VLS , installed today On about 20 Type 054A frigates .
And by limiting our research on the development of this institute during the last 10 years, we finally managed to get hold of some interesting documents, .
It is a removable assembly, which is " stored near the dock " in normal times so as not to unnecessarily occupy space on ships, and ready to assemble and " fix on specific anchor points On board ".
The base of the crane in question
These fastening points should each have a round top opening, and square-shaped openings at the sides. The base of the crane is then attached to eight different points.
And by closely observing the VLS of a Type 052D destroyer, we can notice the presence of several metallic ends, with round openings over and square on the sides.
The mystery of the Type 052D destroyer crane appears to be finally resolved - the crane's square base is secured over four silos of an eight-cell. It allows to reload the silos of the new universal VLS, but is not integrated in it.
These destroyers of the Chinese navy are not able to reload at sea their 2 × 32 silos, but in return they have all their silos for armaments, including the anti-ship missiles YJ-18A of new generation which do not Can be installed at the eight silos at the front of the vessel near the CIWS H / PJ-12 platform .
If we should leave ourselves now with a very last question - a "small" one - is why the Jiangnan shipyard uses two different methods to handle the launch tubes?
Indeed, photographs show that in addition to the crane that we have studied here at length, they have also deployed a kind of large portal crane to transport CCL tubes to ships.
Is the handling of the tubes done in two stages, the first is to first place the tubes on the deck, then leave the "onboard" crane to complete the insertion? Or both methods are used depending on the case?
The insertion of a launch tube into the universal VLS by the on-board crane
If point 1 tells us that the Chinese navy has already had an "antecedent" to implement this type of gear on the BSVs of their warships, point 3 indicates that it is technically impossible to Retractable crane with telescopic boom in one silo.
This last point does not constitute an argument by "negation" to confirm that the new universal VLS does not benefit from an integrated crane, only the clear answer to the tip 2 allows to loop the loop.
After long hours of research, no trace has been found of this famous crane, nor of its origin, nor of its manner of functioning or of being fixed.
And when we are at a standstill, we go back to the starting point - If the crane is designed to support this new SLV, then it seems logical that both were developed by the same organization. The VLS being more "visible", it would be easier to find elements on it and then extend to our target.
But who developed this universal VLS for the new Type 052D and Type 055 destroyers?
In fact, this new VLS without common flame exhaust is designed by the 713 Institute of the Chinese Naval Group CSIC, the same engineering firm that developed the H / AJK-16 model VLS , installed today On about 20 Type 054A frigates .
And by limiting our research on the development of this institute during the last 10 years, we finally managed to get hold of some interesting documents, .
It is a removable assembly, which is " stored near the dock " in normal times so as not to unnecessarily occupy space on ships, and ready to assemble and " fix on specific anchor points On board ".
The base of the crane in question
These fastening points should each have a round top opening, and square-shaped openings at the sides. The base of the crane is then attached to eight different points.
And by closely observing the VLS of a Type 052D destroyer, we can notice the presence of several metallic ends, with round openings over and square on the sides.
The mystery of the Type 052D destroyer crane appears to be finally resolved - the crane's square base is secured over four silos of an eight-cell. It allows to reload the silos of the new universal VLS, but is not integrated in it.
These destroyers of the Chinese navy are not able to reload at sea their 2 × 32 silos, but in return they have all their silos for armaments, including the anti-ship missiles YJ-18A of new generation which do not Can be installed at the eight silos at the front of the vessel near the CIWS H / PJ-12 platform .
If we should leave ourselves now with a very last question - a "small" one - is why the Jiangnan shipyard uses two different methods to handle the launch tubes?
Indeed, photographs show that in addition to the crane that we have studied here at length, they have also deployed a kind of large portal crane to transport CCL tubes to ships.
Is the handling of the tubes done in two stages, the first is to first place the tubes on the deck, then leave the "onboard" crane to complete the insertion? Or both methods are used depending on the case?
The insertion of a launch tube into the universal VLS by the on-board crane
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
(cont3)
The insertion of a launch tube into the universal VLS by the on-board crane
Another method of transporting a tube to its ship by the large crane on the quay.
It should be noted that, during our research on the subject, we came across studies that were both strange and exciting.
For example, the Naval Equipment Department and the Beijing Institute of Space System Engineering jointly studied under the Basic Research Program 863 a robotic arm capable of rapidly charging or recharging a VLS module 80 silos, whereas a standard module of the major majorities of VLS in the world has only eight.
This academic paper published in October 2014 also suggests that projects to improve a new, denser VLS system would be underway. But the study of the robotic arm itself remains very summary, which should still be in the evaluation stage of the opportunities.
The module of 80 silos of a VLS associated with the study of a robotic loading arm
This density of silos in a single module allows us nevertheless to reconcile with the hypothetical project of the Asenal ship semi-submersible in China, which we spoke recently in the file " ".
Who said that a simple crane does not hide great stories behind?
Henri K.
The insertion of a launch tube into the universal VLS by the on-board crane
Another method of transporting a tube to its ship by the large crane on the quay.
It should be noted that, during our research on the subject, we came across studies that were both strange and exciting.
For example, the Naval Equipment Department and the Beijing Institute of Space System Engineering jointly studied under the Basic Research Program 863 a robotic arm capable of rapidly charging or recharging a VLS module 80 silos, whereas a standard module of the major majorities of VLS in the world has only eight.
This academic paper published in October 2014 also suggests that projects to improve a new, denser VLS system would be underway. But the study of the robotic arm itself remains very summary, which should still be in the evaluation stage of the opportunities.
The module of 80 silos of a VLS associated with the study of a robotic loading arm
This density of silos in a single module allows us nevertheless to reconcile with the hypothetical project of the Asenal ship semi-submersible in China, which we spoke recently in the file " ".
Who said that a simple crane does not hide great stories behind?
Henri K.
I'm not sure how this crane would ever have even been considered to be a permanent fixture on the 052D, not only because of its awkward placement but also the complete lack of any photographic evidence on at-sea 052Ds that show this crane on the deck.