ISIS/ISIL conflict in Syria/Iraq (No OpEd, No Politics)

ohan_qwe

Junior Member
If Russia deploys S400 Turkey has missiles they can launch from a safe distance to take them out if they harass turkish Air Force

And russians have missiles that can take out turkeys airbases they harass russian Air Force. (Not taking sides, just pointing out that this kind of reasoning can be dangerus.)

If you think that the brief passing in turkeys airspace is a reason for shooting down a plane then every turkish figther that BOMBS in syria would definitly be a legitimate target for syria/russia.
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Turkey is a professional and responsible power

I have to question that assumption. While the state may be professional or responsible, the turkmans certainly weren't. Executing a pilot post ejection is anything but professional or responsible. Even worse if they shot him while he was still in the air descending.
This goes against UCMJ articles and the Geneva convention. Letting emotions getting the better of you is not an excuse to execute potential POWs etc.
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
I have to question that assumption. While the state may be professional or responsible, the turkmans certainly weren't. Executing a pilot post ejection is anything but professional or responsible. Even worse if they shot him while he was still in the air descending.
This goes against UCMJ articles and the Geneva convention. Letting emotions getting the better of you is not an excuse to execute potential POWs etc.

Correct but I am referring to the Turkish Air Force not the Turkmen fighting in Syria
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
The Pakistani in him has always propped up Turkey on here regardless how closely connected the country is with ISIS. If everyone behaved the childish way Turkey did, the USSR and the US would have nuked each other 100 times already during the cold war. The Turks would have shit in their pants by shooting down a Russian bomber if they weren't part of NATO.

During Cold War USA and USSR clashed many times in much bigger scenarios and theatres I assume you have never heard of them

Turkey has said it's nothing more than protecting it's air space no beef with Russia or Russian people

So Russia is either backs down or risks more losses the choice is there's

They were warned and they were intercepted, don't try if you can't back it up

Like I said this is not Crimea or Georgia
 

cn_habs

Junior Member
During Cold War USA and USSR clashed many times in much bigger scenarios and theatres I assume you have never heard of them

Turkey has said it's nothing more than protecting it's air space no beef with Russia or Russian people

So Russia is either backs down or risks more losses the choice is there's

They were warned and they were intercepted, don't try if you can't back it up

Like I said this is not Crimea or Georgia

If you pretend to be so knowledgeable, why don't you point me to a similar accident where the US deliberately shot down a Russian military jet in broad daylight and publicly acknowledged it?

Everything you wrote here in the past has clearly indicated your pro-Turkish stance. Do you honestly believe Turkey would have dared to shoot it down if it wasn't part of NATO regardless whether it went to Turkish airspace or not?
 
Last edited:

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Its quite amusing that everyone is taking Turkey's version of events as fact when the Russians are openly insisting their plane never entered Turkish airspace at all.

It is my understanding that the Syrian-Turkish boarder region is in dispute, with overlapping territorial claims. So the area in question may be Turkish on Turkish maps, but I bet on Syrian maps (which the Russians would have been using) it says that's sovereign Syrian territory.

This side of the story has been judiciously ignored by all western mainstream media as far as I am aware, its a little disappointing that the Russians haven't made a bigger deal of this yet, as the Turks shooting down the Russian jet over disputed territory makes their position far more untenable.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
The audio sounds cut and dry, plus US supports Turkish version, and that's good enough for me. Nevertheless, it does seem the Turks overreacted to a minor incident, and now we'll see how Russia responds. My guess is no cheek turning.

Did you listen to the same audio tapes as me?! Because on the version of the tapes the BBC posted, the audio quality was astonishingly poor, with a hell of a lot of static, interference and heavy accented English.

I am a fluent native speaker of English, and I could barely pick out even an handful of words from it, certainly not enough to even get a general idea of what the message is trying to say, and I was concerntrating and listening hard. So i would be amazed if the Russian pilots understood any of it at all.

Considering the Turkish version of the tapes should have been the clean recorded version before transmission, I cannot understand how the audio quality could be so atrocious.

A cynical person might think the Turks deliverably garbled up their 'warnings' to make them unintelligible to the Russians so they could claim they gave fair warning to lend their ambush the cover of reasonableness while not tipping the Russians off so they could ensure they could shoot the jet down.
 

dtulsa

Junior Member
Its quite amusing that everyone is taking Turkey's version of events as fact when the Russians are openly insisting their plane never entered Turkish airspace at all.

It is my understanding that the Syrian-Turkish boarder region is in dispute, with overlapping territorial claims. So the area in question may be Turkish on Turkish maps, but I bet on Syrian maps (which the Russians would have been using) it says that's sovereign Syrian territory.

This side of the story has been judiciously ignored by all western mainstream media as far as I am aware, its a little disappointing that the Russians haven't made a bigger deal of this yet, as the Turks shooting down the Russian jet over disputed territory makes their position far more untenable.
That would through a whole different log on the fire
Its quite amusing that everyone is taking Turkey's version of events as fact when the Russians are openly insisting their plane never entered Turkish airspace at all.

It is my understanding that the Syrian-Turkish boarder region is in dispute, with overlapping territorial claims. So the area in question may be Turkish on Turkish maps, but I bet on Syrian maps (which the Russians would have been using) it says that's sovereign Syrian territory.

This side of the story has been judiciously ignored by all western mainstream media as far as I am aware, its a little disappointing that the Russians haven't made a bigger deal of this yet, as the Turks shooting down the Russian jet over disputed territory makes their position far more untenablSmother The TE]situation
That's another log on the fire
 
Top