J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V

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Blitzo

Blitzo

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Deino said:
o.k. .... maybe I should leave again for the weekend, so we get new and better images for comparison !? :D

Thanks,
Deino
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I think the photos we have are clear enough to tell the difference, though there are not many high quality photos of 2017 and previous prototypes from the exact same angle to overlay and show the obvious difference.
I did manage to find a previous photo of 2016 with the cockpit at the exact same angle to the camera to compare with 2017, but it's not an overlay, however it shows 2016's canopy right next to it in a way which I think makes the difference obvious:


cockpit compare.jpg
 
plawolf

plawolf

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Bltizo said:
The new geometry of the canopy is somewhat reminiscent of the F-35's... the previous prototypes were more reminiscent of F-22... I wonder what kind of design considerations made both CAC and Lockheed change to the newer geometry or if it just happened to be incidental.
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I think the key issues would have been pilot comfort/visibility and the structural integrity of the canopy.

Both the F22 and early J20s used a true one-piece canopy, such a canopy would be structurally weaker than a reinforced one-piece canopy made from the same materials and technology. As such, the true one-piece canopy probably had to be more streamlined to avoid too much air friction red-lining it's structural limits.

With a reinforced one-piece, you would have a much larger structural tolerance envelope, so could afford to make it less streamlined to give the pilot more headroom and to allow a winder range of body height for pilots.

The extra bulk of the HMD, and the shift in ejection method (using shaped charge to punch through the canopy rather than eject the entire canopy) would probably have made the new canopy design necessary compared to early J20s.
 
Blitzo

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plawolf said:
I think the key issues would have been pilot comfort/visibility and the structural integrity of the canopy.

Both the F22 and early J20s used a true one-piece canopy, such a canopy would be structurally weaker than a reinforced one-piece canopy made from the same materials and technology. As such, the true one-piece canopy probably had to be more streamlined to avoid too much air friction red-lining it's structural limits.

With a reinforced one-piece, you would have a much larger structural tolerance envelope, so could afford to make it less streamlined to give the pilot more headroom and to allow a winder range of body height for pilots.

The extra bulk of the HMD, and the shift in ejection method (using shaped charge to punch through the canopy rather than eject the entire canopy) would probably have made the new canopy design necessary compared to early J20s.
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Definitely possible. The slightly less aerodynamic but more voluminous canopy of 2017 may well be "enabled" by virtue of the canopy brace of the 201X prototypes and aboard F-35 which F-22 and the 2001 and 2002 prototypes do not have benefit of.

T-50, which has a two piece canopy, also seems to have an overall canopy geometry similar to that of 2017 and F-35 in the sense that there is a slight "peak" in the canopy.

edit: I have to say I'm in awe of how similar that side on shot of 2017's nose is to the F-35C side on pic I posted... if one ignored the J-20's canards one could almost be forgiven for thinking they were the same aircraft. Even 2017's canopy tint shines with the same rainbow-esque colours of that F-35C pic. Not to mention J-20's undernose EOIRST mount, and side nose optical aperture for the 360 degree PDS. And of course 2017's canopy shape now resembling F-35's more so than before. All due to form following function of course, and it is encouraging to see the latest J-20 prototypes following some of the latest and good features aboard the newer F-35 instead of blindly following in F-22's footsteps.
 
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Quickie

Quickie

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Looks like only the glass part of the cockpit canopy has changed. So, if they want to revert back to the previous shape of the cockpit canopy, it could easily be done by swapping between the different designs.
 
Blitzo

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Deino said:
BY the way, '2017' seems to have the older - regular J-11B/BS & J-10B style - HUD again.
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Not sure about that, I think it is still the same thinner HUD, but features slight reinforcement brace superiority.

It is definitely not a J-11B/J-10B model HUD.
 
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