Russian Su-57 Aircraft Thread (PAK-FA and IAF FGFA)

aksha said:

from berkut
... So, back in 2010, it became clear that a few poorly designed plane. Required operating overload withstand could not cut the rivets on the air intakes, air-to-air heat exchangers for cracked welds, and the fuel in the tank №3 categorically refused consumed completely. To the first safety car came the assigned resource to 300 hours, in August 2011, it delivered on completion (the rest of the gain made in the factory), and started to design the machine of the 2nd stage (by the way, incidentally removed from the keel 50-1 left there wrench key). At the 2nd stage significantly increased the proportion of composites (virtually the entire lining of the RMB has become), but the weight of the airframe due to increased KCC still excessively increased. Then they decided to replace many nodes B95 duralumin and AK-5 on the aluminum-lithium alloy 1461T with a specific weight of almost 20% less. In October 2012, the final decision on the launch of the 2nd stage of production. It was planned 2 cars - T-50-7 and T-50-8. At that time, at different stages of production are 3 cars 1st stage - 4, 5, 6. But just woke up and decided to make a 50-7 statics. And in February, the 13th decided to make the transition model and assign the T-50-6. To avoid confusion, the T-50-6 of the first phase became known as T-1.6.50, and the car of the second phase - T-02.06.50.
However, among the imported parts for T-50 and the US were the honeycomb structures of carbon, widely used in the wing and tail. Our military leadership decided that this is unacceptable and has decided to "importozamestit" and instructed CVTs "Technology" from Obninsk develop domestic cellular materials. By the way, all the other composites for the T-50 is also made in Obninsk. Expectedly, obnintsev provaflili all time. As a result, grief Sagittarius (he is now GK Pak, not Davydenko) in May even suggested removal of plumage from T-50-4 and put on 6-2, modified fairing and drive spindles, but a month ago finally came honeycomb.
Another problematic issue was the alloy 1461. Desperate crackled when mechanical working, then there must be said that the assembly we still conducted on technologies 70s, that is, the assembly units in unit kuvaldometr still very popular. A similar treatment alloy does not bore. As a result, went reconversion of the parts of the 1461 B-95, and sometimes back again in 1461.Chto, of course, led to the indescribable delight everyone, especially prochnistov.
Thus passed the 2013, 2014 and in February 2015 the first was docked 6-2 fuselage ...

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aksha said:

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i can't confirm about the IAF trying to stall the FGFA ,
but i know very well that they tried and still does their level best to stall the Tejas progrmme

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tphuang said:

Thanks Aksha. This was a little hard to understand, but it seems like they are having some real issues with production. I guess we will see how it goes.

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Air Force Brat said:

That is an understatement TP, and yes thank you Aksha, this does in fact clarify some things? initially after the first flight, some elements appeared to be poorly designed, lots of cracking, unexpected stress fractures, and "pulled rivets?" after finding and attempting to "fix" these design elements, some had to be redesigned, bringing us to T-2 the second stage of PAK-FA, as they were waiting for the tail feathers etc that were honey-combed carbon fibre, they finally decided to just "borrow" the empennage of 054, and fly T-2 650 with those, but finally the long awaited empennage and fairings arrived.

They decided to redesign some parts using 1651T, apparently a Titanium alloy, that proved very difficult to cut and machine, or even drill a clean hole?? they seem to have overcome that final obstacle, and are expecting to fly T-2.6.50. anytime now???

as you said TP, we will see how it goes? I anticipate that India will buy PAK-FA, but in the interim will finally purchase those Rafaels? particularly in light of all the reliability issues with the MKIs, and the ongoing struggle to get PAK-FA in the saddle?

The Indians wanted the better engine as well that would supercruise, but now they are also dragging their feet on footing the co-development costs, so this is throwing a real monkey wrench in the Russian development schedule and plans?? The Indians saying they will now buy the 2nd stage T-50 rather than wait on FG-FA, which is what I predicted they would do anyway.

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Air Force Brat said:

Heh! Heh! Heh!,,, oh man I love this, now some of you remember my Buddy from last year, everything that I wrote was wrong, stupid, or worse, even as I read those tea leaves and tried to pull the spin off the top and get a read on PAK-FA, and frankly others who were/are way ahead of me were saying the same thing?

So, this is kinda an I told ya so? and I know that is sometimes frowned upon, but here goes. Moscow is NOT confused, they know the Indians know they are having the devil of a time getting PAK-FA up to speed, they are promising the moon, and kissing lots of butt, and promising to kiss a whole lot more, if the Indians will pick up the tab for getting PAK-FA back on track. The RUAF cutting the PAK-FA buy to 12 is real, they are also sending a message? trust me on this?

The bottom line is that IAF is sick of the games and empty promises, they want the Rafael, as it is a real aircraft, with some neat upgrades, and it will be reliable, and the French will make it happen for them, other folks are buying Rafael, and it is a solid investment and a very solid aircraft! They want airplanes they can park on the flightline, fuel up, preflight, and go fly a mission with, without all the excuses and nonsense! but even though my little buddy said it disappears as soon as you hit the master switch??( it doesn't?), it is a very solid 4.5 gen aircraft, that will be a very fine foil against the anticipated threat?

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tphuang said:

I'm trying not to be constantly negative on this project. This particular news seems very discouraging for Russians. I'm not sure how valid it is, but it seems like the indians are having some doubts and more excited about Rafael?

Do you think that's the case, Aksha?

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1) Massive Russian Air Force Fighter Purchase

One of the biggest expected contracts will be a domestic purchase of 48 Sukhoi Su-35 fighters, Russia's cutting-edge fourth generation multi-role aircraft. With Russia's fifth generation Sukhoi T-50 fighter facing procurement delays due to the collapse of the ruble, the air force is expected to focus on buying more of the older Su-35 fighters.

Last week, Vedomosti newspaper reported that the Defense Ministry will sign a 100 billion ruble ($1.5 billion) contract for 48 brand new Su-35s. Russia's United Aircraft Corporation, which owns Sukhoi, declined to comment on the Vedomosti report, saying all details will be announced at MAKS.

The contract will keep Sukhoi production lines running for several years while the Defense Ministry decides how many of the newer T-50s it wants. The company is finishing deliveries of a similar 48-fighter contract signed in 2009 this year.

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tphuang said:

I'm not sure how valid it is, but it seems like the indians are having some doubts and more excited about Rafael?

Do you think that's the case, Aksha?

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Several reports point the finger square at the IAF for dilly dallying to press the case for the Rafale. Others note Russians didn't bother responding in time to the IAFs concerns and were too arrogant. Yet others note the UPA led MODs complete lack of interest in anything involving defence (unless it lined some pockets). Probably all three have some truth to them, and at the end the lack of coordination hurt Indian interests. We could have leapfrogged in A2A AESA radar development for instance, but neither the establishment nor the AF seemed to have seen it that way.

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