Australian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

shen said:

I think that's one of the problem with Japanese defense companies. They don't seem really keen to export their products. The Japanese government is leading the charge to export, for political reasons. But the companies don't seem to care either way.

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Now master shen, its only 50 billion dollars, LOL, tell me those companies call that chump change??? Japanese companies LOVE EXPORT, its in the blood bruda, you know dat!

What they may be coy about is sharing that 50 billion??? that's something even the brat would have to think about? LOL

I think its a bit the reverse Shen. Japanese defense contractors have been reigned in by the Policy of the Ruling parties of Japan for decades, this has resulted in a massive cost issue for Indigenous systems. A Type 89 carbine for example is fare more expensive then any comparable 5.56mm Assault rifle in service. The firms have however found times when they could partner in the past the F2 between Mitsubishi and Lockheed Martin the Mitsubishi 117 that became the Airbus Helicopter H145 and the later actually came to full export but with Airbus making the product and the profit.

The contractors saw that and have pushed to try and get some lee way. Abe and his Administration have agreed but with some limitations.

Now the contractors are looking but they prefer to hedge there bets by partnering with other firms investment money lost in a loosing bid would not force a firm to lock the doors and it also allows a more favorable conditions of price and assures that the Would be Buyer does not feel totally reliant on sole sourcing. It would also mean more options of tailoring of offered systems to meet end buyers wants.

Recently there has been talk of Mitsubishi approaching General Dynamics about there high speed Amphibious Assault vehicle concept if they formed a partnership between them for such that would allow compliance for the US DOD and mean options for Australia and Canada who both buy vehicles from GDLS.

Remember most developed Nations don't like to buy whole packages from abroad. Those nations that do get whole package systems from other nations tend to be lesser states with limited to no indigenous defense industry. When developed states do buy from abroad they like to customize. Japanese contractors fro decades have sold sub components of weapons systems. Lenses here a few motors there. Small parts available for both military and civilian use. Now they are being given a freer hand but its still some what limited in that the major makers would never be allowed to totally export a Type 10 tank to JGSDF spec. Or a whole submarine but through partnership bids with other builders they can design a new platform, partially based on there existing design modify it to meet the client needs and assemble larger portions of it well sharing work load, risk and keeping it all on the up and up.

I think that there is little doubt, that if given the chance, and given the money to be made, that the Japanese firms would jump at the chance to produce the subs for Australia.

There's a lot of things that are going to have to happen to make that possible between now and then...including all of the discussions that would go into the transfer of technologies, potential manufacturing of some of the subs in Australia, etc., etc.

My point is that if it can be worked out, I view an Australian Soryu design as a pretty optimum design for Australia.

Whether or not that can become reality is something we are going to have to wait, watch and see.

found this at Jane's:
Australia drops plans to use AWD hulls for Future Frigates

The option of using the Navantia-designed hull of Australia's Hobart-class Air Warfare Destroyers (AWDs) as the basis for the proposed Future Frigate that will replace the Royal Australian Navy's (RAN's) Anzac-class fleet has been quietly dropped, informed sources have told IHS Jane's .

At the same time, a reported limit on the displacement of the Future Frigate has been set aside in favour of assessing the capability effects of competing platforms, an industry briefing was told on 15 July.

Both developments clear the way for a robust international competition to build at least eight Future Frigates under Project Sea 5000.

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source:

don't have an access to the rest of the article though ... somebody here familiar with
Project Sea 5000?

the most recent article I found a moment ago using google is vague:



I found these interesting (not dated, though) slides in:

Project Sea 5000 is the RAN requirements for a future Frigate. I thought I read somewhere that there was interest in the British Type 26 for the Job.

Right now there is something of a frigate bonanza going on and lots of options available off the shelf so I expect to see offers from all over. FREMM and Type 26 from Europe, Freedom and Independence (which already has a licensee developing one in Japan) from the US, the German F series just to name a few.

Too bad for Australia IMHO.

They were going to build the vessels in Australia...and by using the existing hull, they would be able to keep the shipbuilding in Australia going, experience significant cost benefit from the already existing tooling, and expertise, and enhance the overall RAN vessel inventory.

Lots of positives if they could have pulled it off. They are doing this rather quietly so it will be interesting to ultimately find out what the real reasons are.

Could the following 14 pages from:

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...have been what influenced the Australian government to quietly drop their plans for a SEA 5000 frigate based on the existing hull of the AWD destroyers?

Hmmm? It's a pretty convincing presentation if the Australians can afford it. It would allow for the tech transfer and the building in Australia.

Air Force Brat said:

Now master shen, its only 50 billion dollars, LOL, tell me those companies call that chump change??? Japanese companies LOVE EXPORT, its in the blood bruda, you know dat!

What they may be coy about is sharing that 50 billion??? that's something even the brat would have to think about? LOL

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50 billion is not chump change. but the Japanese arms companies have been isolated from the global market for almost 70 years. they face no competition. they have an easy revenue stream from their government, which is willing to pay for overpriced weapons in order to support domestic industry. would any other country be willing to pay $125 millions for a warmed up F-16?

to compete globally, they have to invest a lot of money upfront to tailor the products to customers, streamline to cut cost and accept smaller profit margins.

If Japanese company is eager to sale the subs to Australia, they should be the one to reach out to the British firms to form joint bid, instead it is the other way around.

When the talk was about off the self purchase of Soryu, the Japanese could've made a handsome profit for little risk. but now the Australians are leaning towards home production, risks for the project is now much bigger. the Japanese government is still eager to make the deal for political reasons, but the companies seem to be less eager.