possible diffrent outcome to korean war...

MiG 21

Banned Idiot
we all know how the korean war ended but it could have ended much much more differently if truman hadent have kept macarthur on such a short leash macaurthur(often looking for glory clear in ww2)wanted to expand the conflict and atack china itself using atomic bombs to hit chinese cities and natinalist troops on formoasea(taiwan)to invade china even making an aperance on television to try and turn the american peaple in his favor this angered truman and he relieved truman of his command so my point is what do you think would have happened if macaurthors plan had been given approval taking into acount china's mutual assistance pact with the soviets could this have started a ww3?
 

The_Zergling

Junior Member
MiG 21 said:
we all know how the korean war ended but it could have ended much much more differently if truman hadent have kept macarthur on such a short leash macaurthur(often looking for glory clear in ww2)wanted to expand the conflict and atack china itself using atomic bombs to hit chinese cities and natinalist troops on formoasea(taiwan)to invade china even making an aperance on television to try and turn the american peaple in his favor this angered truman and he relieved truman I believe you meant MacArthur of his command so my point is what do you think would have happened if macaurthors plan had been given approval taking into acount china's mutual assistance pact with the soviets could this have started a ww3?

First off... try to make your sentences a bit more coherent, it is seriously hard to understand what you are saying sometimes... just a tip. Proper punctuation and capitalization make posts a lot easier to read.

Anyway... it's undeniable that things might have been different if Truman had decided to let MacArthur attack China with atomic bombs.

And yeah, even if the Soviet Union didn't have a mutual assistance pact with China, it is possible/inevitable that WW3 would have started anyway (if the bombs had been dropped).
 

Kampfwagen

Junior Member
Let's just all be thankful that Macarthur did not decide to push his Atomic Annie into China and turn the nation into iradiated swiss-cheese, otherwise the only ones using the internet would be superiradated mutant cockroaches.

It would have been inevitable at that time that if China was attacked by nuclear weapons, the Soviets would undoubetly gotten some sweaty collars, especialy with the possibility of fallout. WW3 would be inevitable, since it had been Macarthur's plan to push through China into the Soviet Union and shell that with atomic cannon fire. I doubt that Truman would have folded at the chance to take out his most insubourdunate of generals, though. From what I understand, Macarthur never got along with Truman and Truman absolutely detested Macarthur.

At least, that is what I understand.
 

FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
Kampfwagen said:
Let's just all be thankful that Macarthur did not decide to push his Atomic Annie into China and turn the nation into iradiated swiss-cheese, otherwise the only ones using the internet would be superiradated mutant cockroaches.

It would have been inevitable at that time that if China was attacked by nuclear weapons, the Soviets would undoubetly gotten some sweaty collars, especialy with the possibility of fallout. WW3 would be inevitable, since it had been Macarthur's plan to push through China into the Soviet Union and shell that with atomic cannon fire. I doubt that Truman would have folded at the chance to take out his most insubourdunate of generals, though. From what I understand, Macarthur never got along with Truman and Truman absolutely detested Macarthur.

At least, that is what I understand.

McArthur wasn't the only general who was gung-ho about using nukes. Wasn't there another general during the Vietnam war who suggested the use of nukes with the phrase 'I'd rather die from a nuke than a rusty bayonet in the belly' ...i think he was rapidly transferred
 

vincelee

Junior Member
the use of nukes in vietnam was seriously studied, and the conclusion was that the diminishing margin of return would eat into the effectiveness of nuke so much, it would be cost ineffective.
 

Ender Wiggin

Junior Member
Actually a often not studied alternative is what happened if Kim il-Sung listened to Mao and Zhou En-Lai and stoped the attack to consolidate their holdings for a military analyst under Chou/Zhou correctly determined that MacArthur would land in Inchun.

Kim refused to stop attacked and when MacArthur attacked and cut the supply lines the North Korean forces shattered.

Had MacArthur been defeated at Inchun MacArthur would've been side lined (because Inchun would've then been believed to be a death trap as a result of his "aggressiveness") and NK would've driven Task Force Smith and the South Korean forces into the Sea of Japan.

Source: Mao: A Life by Phillip Short.
 

MiG 21

Banned Idiot
(ill have to make this quick)kampfwagen your refering to the nuclear artillery that fired tactical nukes right?(how usful those would be against the hordeing chinese tactics of the korean war) didint america only produce a handful of those until it was decided that it was impossible to move them without the soviets knowing? also do you guys think that america and its european allies(surely they would be involved) could have deafeated china and russia with out nuclear weapons?
 
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mindreader

New Member
Why theorize on the impossible? MacArthur was a man with what one can call the "God conflict." His reputation far supercedes his abilities. His failures in Korea is what I would put as the number one reason why Ike became the president where MacArthur did not.

No the US would not have nuked China even if Truman secretly wanted to. Why? They plain didn't have enough nukes to force both Mao and Stalin into submission. Doing so would be an invitation for the Red Army to steamroll Western Europe.

No the US would not have launched a land invasion of China either. Why? To start, they simply can't win. They'll do a lot of damage but the outcome will be no different than what happened to the Japs in WWII. A stalemate and eventual defeat.

Even if they were show any success, it would have meant that couple million American troops are tied down in China and Korea and once again, an open invitation for the Red Army to steamroll Western Europe.

Stalin would have been the happiest man on earth had that happened. Why do you think he was so, um, tardy in delivering the Migs to Mao? He wanted both sides to hurt as badly as possible.

In summary, MacArthur was a moron.
 

Kampfwagen

Junior Member
MiG 21 said:
(ill have to make this quick)kampfwagen your refering to the nuclear artillery that fired tactical nukes right?(how usful those would be against the hordeing chinese tactics of the korean war) didint america only produce a handful of those until it was decided that it was impossible to move them without the soviets knowing? also do you guys think that america and its european allies(surely they would be involved) could have deafeated china and russia with out nuclear weapons?

The reason I used the comparison with the artillery is because those cannons were Macarthur's babies, practicaly. He even did the stupid move of presenting them to an enemy ambasador (Or general, I dont know...he showed it to some enemy big wig and I forget which side. If someone would not mind helping...) and they were aparently impressed. I call this stupid because the Soviets were able to reverse engeneer a B-29 with a few photographs...So the rest is pretty obvious. But the Cannons were really innefective, especialy since the cannon had a very limited range and could only really be used in a specific scenario, against a target without signifigant suppourt...it's just more economical to drop a bomb.

As far as I know, there were alot of generals pushing for use of nukes. I think I have heard of a few who sugested it during 'nam, and several who backed up macarthur. Not to mention the oodles who had itchy fingers over the big red button during The Cuban Missile Crisis.

Macarthur reminds me alot of Patton, a man who's reputation superceeds his skill from mere luck and chance and eventual numerical superiority.
 
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