PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Sczepan

Senior Member
VIP Professional
Re: Latest Varyag Pics

those launchers couldn't be needed by trainee-ships

I'm still waiting for radar antennas and more of this electronical stuff ....
it will say, the Varjag becomes ready for sea triales after that time,
so longer they need to this installations,
so more expansive is the overhauling-process in Dalian,
so more I believe in a military future of the ship :nana:

lets wait and see :coffee:
 

Sea Dog

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Re: Latest Varyag Pics

The more I look at these pictures, the more it looks as though this ship is not going to be a casino or museum. The deck surfaces look clean and well prepared. And the island structure is looking more complete. Obviously, electronics and sensor masts will probably be the last thing we see installed.

Anybody see any signs of propulsion plant work yet?
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Re: Latest Varyag Pics

The more I look at these pictures, the more it looks as though this ship is not going to be a casino or museum. The deck surfaces look clean and well prepared. And the island structure is looking more complete.
I agree Sea Dog, and for all of those who have said, or may have thought that the Varyag was in too bad a condition to upgrade, well, shipyards are capable of some amazing things. An older, Kiev class carrier, is being refitted (and openly I might add) in Severodvinsk, Russia, as we speak. The old (much older than the Varyag) Gorshkov will become the new INS Vikramaditya.

Here's a satellite pic of that rework going on...looks similar to what we see on the Varya in many respects.

INS-Vikramaditya.jpg


Thought I would include this pic here because of the obvious similarities and the fact that older ships like this are very capable of being modernized if a nation is willing to spend the money.
 

BLUEJACKET

Banned Idiot
Re: Latest Varyag Pics

[admin edit: It seems most of your links are dead... copy paste from some other forum? ]
Sorry, I had written it a while ago but couldn't post it until yesterday.
Regarding carrier escorts, at least in the 1st decade of carrier ops China may not need as many of them as other Navies do (particularly USN), and here is why:
1. Besides the airwing, the carrier will be armed with its own anti-ship missiles;
2. China has/developing antiship cruise/medium/short range ballistic missiles that can be deployed on land, that can be used to blow up an enemy CBG;
3. The CBG will operate in the "blue water", but still close enough to the land based PLAAF & PLAN air assets- even when in the Indian Ocean, those aircraft can be deployed to Pakistan, Malaysia, East/South Africa and Myanmar;
4. China has a large fleet of submarines (both purchased from Russia & domesticaly built) armed with anti-ship missiles/torpedoes that can compensate for the shortage of surface ships.
The eight new Project 636M submarines currently under construction in Russia are reported to be fitted with the Novator 3M-54E submarine-launched anti-ship missile as part of the Klub-S missile system. The missile has a maximum range of 220km and a 450kg high-explosive warhead.
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bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Re: Latest Varyag Pics

Guys this has been a great thread! Kudos to all members!:) I'm closing this thread and moving the latest post to the "All about the Chinese CV" thread. This is done because there are so many duplicate and nearly the same post in both threads. Please post all your PLAN CV thoughts there. You fellows are great forum members!:) We have the best, most intelligent Chinese military forum on the internet! Keep posting!!! :china: :china:

bd popeye moderator
 

kevin JJW

Banned Idiot
Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Here's a simulated (meaning it is not real) overhead satellite picture of what the first PLAN CBG might look like, including the Varyag, two type 052c DDGs, a type 956 DDG, a type 052B DDG, two type 054 FFGs, and two type 093 SSNs.


[qimg]http://www.jeffhead.com/redseadragon/sat_plan_cbg.jpg[/qimg]​

I had posted this on the older forum and thought I would p[ost it here too for comment. Would a 051c be in there...will there be larger, more capable area AAW DDGs or CGs?
Beihai Fleet CV
Varyag 1 CV/ CVN
Luzhou Class 2
Luhu Class 2
Jiangkal Class 4
Shang Class 2
 

crobato

Colonel
VIP Professional
Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Here's that pic:

[qimg]http://www.jeffhead.com/redseadragon/plan_cbg1.jpg[/qimg]

You made that picture up? Sweet. Perhaps you should have copyrighted it or it will start circulating among the Chinese language forums.
 

Neutral Zone

Junior Member
Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Great topic guys! :china:

I take it that PLAN is also going to be adding additional AOE type support ships like the Qiandaohu class for it's carrier group? Looking at Jeff's pics that CVBG will get through a lot of fuel and food in a day and even if it's only going to be operating in the South China Sea it will need to replenish at sea regularly.

Also is there any idea as to what the Varyag will be renamed as when it enters PLAN service? And on a general point, do PLAN ship's have a titl such as USS or HMS?
 

kevin JJW

Banned Idiot
Beihai Fleet CV
Varyag 1 CV/ CVN
Luzhou Class 2
Luhu Class 2
Jiangkal Class 4
Shang Class 2




"China could have its first aircraft carrier battle group composed of 11 warships in place by 2020."
CV 1
DDG 4
FFG 6
:D :china:

Great topic guys! :china:

I take it that PLAN is also going to be adding additional AOE type support ships like the Qiandaohu class for it's carrier group? Looking at Jeff's pics that CVBG will get through a lot of fuel and food in a day and even if it's only going to be operating in the South China Sea it will need to replenish at sea regularly.

Also is there any idea as to what the Varyag will be renamed as when it enters PLAN service? And on a general point, do PLAN ship's have a titl such as USS or HMS?

Taiwan (Republic of China) Republic of China Navy ROCS (older usage: CNS) Republic of China Ship (older usage: Chinese Navy Ship)
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
I believe the Chinese are building a full blown STOBAR carrier with the refurbishment of the old Varyag. Will t be their finbal design? Most probably not. They will build other designs that are motre modern later, probably full blown CATOBAR carriers at some point.

Whatever the build, they will need an airwing to actually make use of their vessel design. All fixed wing carriers want to have all of the following functions filled with their aircraft:

Air Defense/Air Superiority
Attack
Airborne Early Warning (AEW)
Anti-submarine warfare (ASW)
Search and Rescue (SAR)
Electronic Warfare (EW)
Refueling
Carrier on board Delivery (COD)

In a lot of cases, some aircraft will fill two roles. In most STOBAT or VTOL designs, helos fill several of the roles.

The CHinese STOBAR carrier will probably fill the Air Defense/Attack/Refueling role with one or two aircraft. TYhe other roles will probably be filled by helicopters.

Wehn the Chinese go to CATYOBAR operations, they will expand the use of fixed wing aircrafty to fill mnore and more roles. At that point they may consider a fixed wing ASW aircraft.

Now, in that regard, the Russian P-42 design was a carbon copy of the S-3.. a Vikinski.

From the size and disposition, probably would have had similar capabilities and it is very understandable that they would want something like that. The Viking was an excellent carrier-borne ASW platform. Lots of capability, ordinance, range, and endurance.

IMHO, it is a shame that the US Navy has discontinued the S-3 use without anything replacing them. Not only a shame, but, again, IMHO, derelict.

Now, here's a potential design taken from my Dragon's Fury Series, and first put forward a good 5 years ago in the intial release of the initial voume in the series...now an all-in-one book.

It's basically a modular container design with very serious modifications, but meant to be produced quickly and in numbers.

-50-60,000 tons
-40 aircraft (30 air defense/attack)
-10 VLS ASM missiles
-36-48 VLS AAM missiles
-4 CIWS
-2 screws
-Conventional power

Plenty of hangar space.

PLAN-SeaControl-X-Concept.jpg


The crossing design is unconventional, but also very possible for optimizing air operations, both for catapault launches and arrested landings.
 
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