J-XX Fighter Aircraft

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MIGleader

Banned Idiot
Re: J-xx

it was probably a mig 29. the 29 and 31 are the only migs in russia service, and i couldnt imagine why a mig-31 would be flying over an enemy country, since its an intercpetor. it would be nice to know which model it was, so the radar information copied could be known.
 

swimmerXC

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VIP Professional
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Re: J-xx

about next generation stealth fighter requirements
中国新一代隐身战斗机:最完整的报道
2005-12-25 07:02:10 点击:2009
中国新一代隐身战斗机:最完整的报道

  在“八五â€初期,国防科工委和中航总公司根据中国的国情,考虑到国外先进战斗机的技术特点,提出了中国新一代战斗机的战技要求:
  1新飞机要具有较好的隐身性能,正前方RCS 0.5m^2
  2机动性优于Su27
  3不要求有超音速巡航能力
  这就是中国的“三代半â€战斗机,并称之为高机动隐身战斗机。
  以上指标的具体含义是,新飞机要有
大的瞬间盘旋能力和大的可用迎角,有高的最大升力系数及在失速迎角之后飞机仍是稳定可控、同时超音速的升阻比要高,而在外形设计上还要考虑到隐身的要求。
  601所的高机动隐身战机的布局经历了四次重大的方案改进,这些布局方案分别称作91型、92型、93型和新93型。
  
  国产高机动隐身战斗机要求具备的气动设计指标:
  1亚音速区最大升阻比达到10,在超音速区最大升阻比达到5;
  2低速最大升力系数大于1.8,超大迎角(a>60)气动特性可接受;
  3超音速最小阻力系数小于0.044
  601所总体设计初期,选择的发动机是预研的国产中推涡扇发动机两台(加力推力8120KG)或俄罗斯的RL33发动机(加力推力8250KG),在飞行升限、最大飞行速度、爬升率、稳定盘旋过载、基本航程和起降性能等参数,经过总体综合优化设计,得出高机动隐身战斗机的翼载应为 325350KG/m2,推重比应选在1.10~1.15之间,飞机的总重限制在15吨。机翼的展弦比应在2.8~3.5之间,前缘后掠角38~45,根梢比在5~6。
  601所91型:翼下进气大边条方案其几何特徵类似米格29,布局上偏重高机动性,601所92型:另一种是两侧进气小边条方案称为92型,它的前机身和进气道吸收了一些YF22的布局特点,布局上偏重隐身特性。
  
  91型飞机重量92型飞机重量
  结构重量4568.7 4771
  动力装置2933.4 2930
  设备2029.3 1979
  空机重量9351.4 9680
  有效载荷5247.5 5200
  总重14999.5 14880
  
  601所根据隐身研究的成果,对飞机正前方的主要强散射源:进气道、座舱和雷达天线等,侧向的机身和垂尾等飞机部件做了处理。特别是进气道,气唇口,管道和压气机等部件。进气道采用采用斜切式进气口和S弯型管道有效降低雷达散射截面积。使用倾斜侧机身、外倾双垂尾翼身融合体外形。双垂尾外倾角大于20度
  在1991~1993年间的风洞吹风中发现92型在满足隐身要求的前题下对气动性能也能达到91型的标准,91型淘汰601所93型:针对92型的问题,对其进行重大改进,重新设计了进气道和机翼边条,机头缩短,双垂尾前移,形成了93布局,93型重量特征与92型基本一致。
  601所新93型:为了全面达到先进气动布局课题指标的要求,对93型进行低速最大升力、超音速最小阻力、最大升阻比和航向稳定性的改进。包括:
  1修改机翼翼型相对厚度;
  2选择高效率的边条;
  3中弧度弯扭机翼设计;
  4选择最佳垂尾位置,在93的基础上前移;
  新93型满足了低亚音速最大升力系数、超音速最小阻力系数、超音速最大升阻比的3向设计要求。同时新93型的横向稳定性也较最初有大幅改善。在相当大的迎角范围内,随着迎角的增加安定度也增大。偏航导数的不安定区也消失了。同时93型在迎角为20度时的下降幅度明显消失,新93型已经满足了大迎角纵横向可控的指标要求。
  表中飞机起飞重量为14986.5Kg,机内燃油4860Kg,机动性计算取50%的机内燃油。升限计算重量取35%机内燃油;着陆性能计算取8.5%的机内燃油。飞机基本武器状态为带2枚近距格斗导弹。可见,高机动隐身战斗机的飞行性能全面优于F-16,它的爬升率和定常过载优于Su27飞机,其他飞行性能与Su27相当,只是在续航能力上稍差一点,可以采取空中加油的方法弥补。最后通过引进俄罗斯的软体进行类比高机动隐身战斗机的雷达散射截面积在正前方30度范围内,RCS达到0.3M^2,在侧向RCS小于1M^2。这表明该方案隐身性能已经满足了指标要求。
  
  后记
  
  关于国产高机动隐身战斗机的传闻已久,从当年BQZS转载一篇配图的美国海军情报中心的文章开始,网上所谓XXJ、J12、新J10的讨论不绝于耳。
  从相关文献中可以得知,提出研制高机动隐身战斗机的时间是1990-1991年间,之后几家设计单位开始提出气动方案,各自拿出最后优化过的气动布局。 601所的新93型布局方案也就是其中一种。在95年基本上气动布局就都研究完成了,在1996-1997年间大概进行了选型。除了新93方案另外还有一种布局和93方案类似的三翼面方案,该方案也就是最近网上流传的Jane's公布的三视图。它和93方案的区别大致是机头、边条还有使用3翼面。此外,还有一种双发双垂尾机腹进气鸭式布局的方案。而最后这个方案大概才是最后的选型结果,也就是目前计划实行中的国产高机动隐身战斗机。
  目前基本可以肯定新93性很有可能是所有布局方案中第一个被淘汰的。根据资料显示新93型作战能力不强(由于是作为气动验证型,评估方法很欠缺),其对较新型的 F16 Black 5x的作战交换比最高仅达到1:1.23。对于空军要求的能在国土防御中有效的对抗进攻中的F22。显然这个资料还不能令人满意。加上新93型的资料泄密,加速了其在选型中的淘汰。
  另外,外电公布三翼面布局据说也是淘汰的。具体原因还不清楚,恐怕三翼面导致的隐身问题是其淘汰的主要原因。
  剩下的就唯有鸭式布局的国产高机动隐身战斗机了,其上视图可以看出它不是10号的简单放大,拥有很高的翼面积和翼身融合体。某种程度和俄罗斯的MFI-I142有很多相似之处。最明显的区别就是飞机的大小。
  大家现在很清楚了国防科工委和中航总公司的国产高机动隐身战斗机的要求:战斗机总重,其大小和欧洲目前发展的三代半类似,飞机空重大概都在9500KG 左右,推力都是9000KN级附近的,根据Aero所述我们的先进中推推重比达到8,并可能接近9,这样就可以达到欧洲战斗机EJ-200发动机的水平。其和F-22比还有不少差距。其明显具备超越欧洲战斗机很多的隐身能力,也具备水平很高的大迎角飞行能力,个人认为实力在EF-2000之上。但是这款战斗机明显不具备F22级别四代机的很多尖端特性。如全面的超音速巡航能力,该机具备部分超音速巡航能力,但是与美国的F22不可同日而语。另外的缺陷就是电子设备的先进性远不如F-22,主要不是雷达系统的差异而是资讯系统的综合能力上的差距。
  正因为这些,所以这个在85计划初期发展起来的战斗机计划,明确可以认为是西方三代半标准后期战斗机的水平,这种战斗机水平极为接近F22,在特定的战场支援环境下,更确切的说就是在中国本土防空中这种先进战斗机完全可以和F22对抗,并取得辉煌的战果!
  根据可信的消息,这种机在选型成*后,即开始进入详细设计阶段,这个阶段中通常开始构筑各部分的*能细节,同时一些模型或者改装的科研机就会开始试飞,验证具体*能。现在已经有一段时间了,最近的庆祝中国航空工业50周年的相关新闻中,也明确提到该机将在明年进行试飞。(先进战斗机和先进发动机的工程进度是配套的),预计2005-2006年国产高机动隐身战斗机就将进入量为型试飞的阶段,如果国际形势逼迫下进度更快的话,那么在2008年,F-22进入部队服役不到4-5年,全球第二种具备隐身和高机动能力的空中优势中型战斗机将在中国率先进入部队服役。
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skyhawk2005

Banned Idiot
Re: J-xx

Can someone tell me from the article above:

1> Will the JXX have super cruise?
2> At the end, was it comparing the JXX to the F22? What did it say about the comparison?

3> And did it say the JXX will be flyng in 2006?
 

Sea Dog

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Re: J-xx

skyhawk2005 said:
Can someone tell me from the article above:

1> Will the JXX have super cruise?
2> At the end, was it comparing the JXX to the F22? What did it say about the comparison?

3> And did it say the JXX will be flyng in 2006?

I don't lknow from the article above, but I believe China intends to field a J-XX by a 2010(???) timeframe. Please someone correct this if wrong. And I do believe Chinese aircraft designers will have super-cruise in mind in it's design. But comparing it to F-22 is futile as F-22 exists and is in service. So far J-XX is being planned but there are no actual aircraft as far as we know.
 

Roger604

Senior Member
Re: J-xx

skyhawk2005 said:
Can someone tell me from the article above:

1> Will the JXX have super cruise?
2> At the end, was it comparing the JXX to the F22? What did it say about the comparison?

3> And did it say the JXX will be flyng in 2006?

The article says that China's next generation plane needs to have a frontal RCS of less than 0.5m squared, better maneuverability than an Su-27, but does NOT need supercruise.

It says that if the international environment makes it necessary to hurry the production of the JXX, the world's second stealth plane should start going into service around 2008.
 

peace_lover

New Member
Registered Member
Re: J-xx

it's said the PLAAF don't satisfy the J-10's performance and unit price is too expensive , they are developing a sort of more advanced fighter , maybe it's J-x , it's a stealth fighter.
 

Totoro

Major
VIP Professional
Re: J-xx

That's kinda all backwards from today's trends dictated by BVR fighting. Bigger maneuvrability and no need for supercruise. I am not saying that's stupid but does that mean chinese are confident they have found a weak point in western plane design and they can exploit it by designing a plane so its stealthy enough to get to dogfight range alive and then use its advatages to defeat its enemies? Sounds like a risky plan.

And i just do not see a chance in hell that jxx can be put into service by 2010, no matter how well hidden the development program is. Perhaps that was a mistake in the article, and the first flight will be made by 2010. If that's the case, then still it can not enter service before 2015 and i think far more realistic timetable would be 2020.
 

Indianfighter

Junior Member
Re: J-xx

If major 5th generation projects are seen, it can be observed that they are in development by joint-ventures between 2 or more countries.

As an example, the PAK-FA project between India and Russia, the project by the EU, etc. Thus, the development of J-xx by China, without external co-operation may lead to a weaker configuration of the J-xx as compared to the F-22 raptor.

Another possibility in the absence of external co-operation by China may be that the critical technologies may be procured from abroad in a covert manner, or else the time by which it shall be inducted may be of the order of 2 decades from now (since it was the time taken by the F-22 project).

Thus, time may have to be sacrificed in lieu of complete in-house development, or external co-operation must be garnered in order to save the resource of time in the development of the J-xx fighter.
 

skyhawk2005

Banned Idiot
Re: J-xx

peace_lover said:
it's said the PLAAF don't satisfy the J-10's performance and unit price is too expensive , they are developing a sort of more advanced fighter , maybe it's J-x , it's a stealth fighter.

Where does it say that?
 

Roger604

Senior Member
Re: J-xx

Totoro said:
That's kinda all backwards from today's trends dictated by BVR fighting. Bigger maneuvrability and no need for supercruise. I am not saying that's stupid but does that mean chinese are confident they have found a weak point in western plane design and they can exploit it by designing a plane so its stealthy enough to get to dogfight range alive and then use its advatages to defeat its enemies? Sounds like a risky plan.

And i just do not see a chance in hell that jxx can be put into service by 2010, no matter how well hidden the development program is. Perhaps that was a mistake in the article, and the first flight will be made by 2010. If that's the case, then still it can not enter service before 2015 and i think far more realistic timetable would be 2020.

Maybe the idea is that RCS reduction runs into the law of diminishing returns because at a certain point you can be tracked by IRST anyway. So why not build a cheaper plane that can keep a kill ratio of the F-22 to a 3:1 or 2:1.
 
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