SamuraiBlue
Captain
On subs, since they really can't see outside so most sub operators around the world changes the color of the light to express the time of day. Night time is red and day time is white light.
Yuan Class AIP & Kilo Submarine Thread
- Thread starter Jeff Head
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On subs, since they really can't see outside so most sub operators around the world changes the color of the light to express the time of day. Night time is red and day time is white light.
antiterror13
Brigadier
Interesting, I didn't know it is the reason. I thought the reason inside the CIC room is dim and red is in context, means people are likely focused on their own displays, resolving whatever the demands of their jobs are. It is the case when it is in high alert situtaion
SamuraiBlue
Captain
The reason why they change the color in CIC on a surface ship and on a submarine is quite different.
You don't have to worry about light pouring out from a sub.
For subs it more about adjusting the biological clock of the crew. Without it the people on the sub will start showing symptoms of insomnia which affects overall efficiency.
When you say "don't have to worry about light pouring out from a sub," are you suggesting that on a surface ship, they have dimly lit CICs because they're afraid the light will somehow escape from a window outside and give away the position of the ship? That seems a bit too fantastical, let alone the fact that CICs are often in the enclosed belly of the ship and fairly well protected, without windows/portholes to the outside.
From my understanding, the dim light in CICs in general (regardless of whether it is in a surface ship or submarine) is due to reducing ambient light in the CIC to reduce eyestrain and allow individuals to work better. We see this in other types of rooms with many large screens as well, such as control rooms for large tv stations.
I'm not sure if submarines alternate between bright lights and dim lights during standard "work days," and if that is intended to affect the crew's biological clocks -- if so, then this is the first time I've heard of it as a prime reason.
....doing a bit of searching, I think the the red light use in submarines is more associated with preserving night vision, eyestrain and transitioning to mission ready status (near complete dark) than biological clock related, per se -- after all, crew on submarines tend to do six hours on, six hours off (or a variant of that work schedule), so their biological clock during missions would be completely changed from being on land on the surface anyway.
In a surface ship's CIC I think it is more consistently dark, so red lights may be less needed. That said, some CICs have also been photographed with red lights but they seem to be more of a feature for submarines.
.... Also, funnily enough (at least in older submarines), there seemed to be a risk of light emerging from a submarine's periscope that could be detectable by surface ships -- if the interior of the submarine was well light the periscope would naturally reflect that light outside, which is why submarines with older periscopes operated with dark interiors during missions... so in a way, there is a greater risk of light "pouring out" from a submarine's operations room/CIC (with older periscopes) to the outside, than there is from a surface ship's CIC!
SamuraiBlue
Captain
Biological clock is not about sensing the hours of the day, human's biological clock goes out of whack when deprived of optical input and starts ticking at 25 hours a day not 24 hours. This has been recorded through various experiments placing people in a confined room with no windows for a week. They can turn off the lights within the room when they go to bed.
This is also used as the first step in mind control in which they deprive a subject there sense of time changing feeding patterns pulling them out of beds at middle of the night for interrogation and so on.
Yes, it is well established that circadian rhythms can be affected by light.
However, at the same time I think the evidence is far more strongly in support of the idea that the difference in lighting aboard submarines (or ships) is related to operational needs of the ship during different degrees of combat readiness and operation rather than seeking to assist the crew's biological clock.
vesicles
Colonel
Where did you get the 25 hours vs. 24 hours thing? That's not what biological clock, or circadian cycle, is. You can switch day and night for mammals. In fact, that's what we do in the lab to all our mice. Mice are nocturnal. So they are active at night. To conduct behavioral experiments, we would need them to stay active. So ideally we would have to do the experiments at night when they are active. However, that would not be desirable for the guys doing the experiments. So the first thing we do when we get the mice is to turn off the lights during the day and turn the light back on at nights. It takes about a week to completely switch their circadian cycle. It's an important part of their acclimation process. And we also conduct careful control experiments to validate that the acclimation by comparing with/without acclimation.
AssassinsMace
Lieutenant General
Isn't the primary reason it's dimly lit because eyes adjust quickly to sudden light changes as if when the power goes out especially below decks? Why during battle are the lights red? Because red light is found to be the best medium for quicker adjustments from dark to light and light to dark. On the TV show Mythbusters they tested a theory that the stereotypical pirate's eye patch wasn't to hide a bad eye but because when pirates board other ships they're trying to take, when they go below they switch the eye patch to the other eye because the eye kept dark doesn't need adjustment and they see better than the eye that was exposed to the light which takes time to adjust. The theory worked and the reason for the eye patch was found to be plausible.
vesicles
Colonel
I think the dim light is simply to make it easy to see the monitors. This is also why various types of imaging facilities, on land or at sea, all have dim lights.
There should be enough lighting on modern ships so that no one would have to worry about using their eye patches.
SamuraiBlue
Captain
I read it in a science journal where they had tested human's biological clock in which if humans are to make their own cycle without outside input then humans start clocking 25 hours day instead of 24 hours. I believe NASA with the cooperation of some US Universities conducted the tests in the 80's
Here are some examples;
Here are some examples;