Littoral Combat Ships (LCS)

93fiM5 said:

Well looks like the SSC will be one of the LCS designs beefed up, still no clear word on which one.

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From the article:

Article said:

Provide an assessment by May 1 of the cost and feasibility of back-fitting SSC survivability and lethality enhancements into Flight 0+ LCSs already under contract, and for eight more LCSs to be ordered through 2018. The overall intent, Hagel wrote, is “to improve the lethality and survivability of Flight 0+ ships as much as practical.”

Hagel’s decision affirms the goal of buying a total of 52 LCS and SSCs. The final number and mix, he wrote, will depend on “future fleet requirements, final procurement and operations and support costs and overall Department of the Navy resources.”

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So, it seems to me that they are going to go right ahead and buy the 52 vessels, with the new "Flight" being beefed up to meet the SSC needs and the old flight to be upgraded as much as possible to meet the same requirement.

The artcile incorrectly says that the two offerings keep the 57mm gun and provide no VLS, yet the indicates the follwoing as included:

- Spy-1F (V) Array
- Missile Illuminators
- 1 x 76 MM Otomelara Super Rapid
- 32 x MK 41 Vertical Launching System
- 2 x 4-Pack Harpoon 8 Cells
- OTS Torpedo Launcher
- CIWS
- 4 x .50 Caliber Guns
- SRBOC

And the , what they are calling their MMC variant, says:

- Spy-1F (V) Array
- 32 x missile Vertical Launch System
- 1 x medium caliber gun (Forward)
- 8 x Harpoon missiles
- 2 x Close-in Weapons Systems
- 6 x ASW Torpedos

So, I imagine the new versions of these vessels will be built to the higher combat standard and include all of the above. I believe the older flight vessels will be retrofitted with the as many of the sensors and weapons as possible, and as much additional combat survivability as possible.

They then will proceed to build probably an equal number (26) of each.

Quite frankly, I would rather see a total of 24 Independence class built with a predominant focus on mine warfare and ASW warfare with adequate self protection, and then 28 Freedom class built to multi-role frigate standard that gives them adequate ASW, AAW, and ASuW coaabilities so they can readily escort a CSG, escort an ARG, be a strong addition to any SAG, or to perfrom strong show the flag duties anywhere in the world.

Jeff Head said:

...

And the

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, what they are calling their MMC variant, says:

...

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Jeff, this brochure is dated
(April 7, 2011) though ...

another view I found a moment ago: contains pictures of the Upgraded Freedom, Upgraded Independence but ... can somebody please post or give link to bigger ones so that I can read the captions?

this seems to be the official:

no mine-hunting by the SSC, it seems to me according to:

1.

Greenert and Stackley said the new ship would not be required to perform the mine countermeasures (MCM) mission – a task that the LCS will handle.
“There are enough mission packages within the 32,” to take care of MCM needs, Greenert said.

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2.

Finally, and note this well, the new version will not be able to function as an MCM vessel, according to the Navy. MCM is, arguably, the Navy’s number one need and we’ve now dead-ended our MCM program. The original dozen or so vessels can still be MCM and I assume that they will be dedicated to that function but there has been absolutely no indication that the Navy intends to buy additional MCM modules, assuming they can get them to work. This may be the most noteworthy and serious development in this whole saga. The Navy will come to regret this. A single mine detection can halt a carrier group in its tracks. We need a robust MCM capability and this confirms that we won’t have it.

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and 3.

By omission, mine warfare seems out, since modular requirements are maintained solely for capabilities against surface ships and submarines.

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I some how missed them buying both variants in upgraded form so thanks for pointing that out! I for one am quite happy with the idea of a beefed up LCS design. Especially so if they integrate LRASM at some point.

Jeff do you know if the VLS on either ship can accommodate the LRASM?

-Greg

dtulsa, are you around? no torpedo tubes even for the SSC??

Configured for ASW, the ships will operate with a variable depth sonar and helicopter anti-submarine weapons.

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according to

Jeff Head said:

The artcile incorrectly says that the two offerings keep the 57mm gun and provide no VLS, ...

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Jeff, the defensenews article posted here several times as well as the navy.mil article provided by Jura indicates to me that while the industry proposals did offer 76mm guns and other stuff, the actual selection of the late SecDef, as shown in the accompanying presentaion, does not go as far with the changes.
Still 57mm gun and rather minor weapon upgrades. The navy mil article states "OTH surface-surface weapons, but only names a Longbow Hellfire module. It states improved AAW sensors and weapons, but only states SeaRAM.
I'm sure there's going to be (a bit) more. But my initial feeling is that this SSC thing fell short of what all the talk made people exspect to come out.
I feel like there wasn't really a strong, forward looking decision, but rather a weak "ok, make it all a little better".

Maybe I misread & misinterpreted the article, though.

Scratch said:

Jeff, the defensenews article posted here several times as well as the navy.mil article provided by Jura indicates to me that while the industry proposals did offer 76mm guns and other stuff, the actual selection of the late SecDef, as shown in the accompanying presentaion, does not go as far with the changes.
Still 57mm gun and rather minor weapon upgrades. The navy mil article states "OTH surface-surface weapons, but only names a Longbow Hellfire module. It states improved AAW sensors and weapons, but only states SeaRAM.
I'm sure there's going to be (a bit) more. But my initial feeling is that this SSC thing fell short of what all the talk made people exspect to come out.
I feel like there wasn't really a strong, forward looking decision, but rather a weak "ok, make it all a little better".

Maybe I misread & misinterpreted the article, though.

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The official US Navy site indicates that the SSCs as approved by Hagel will have the following:

US Navy said:

this ship will be equipped with over-the-horizon surface-to-surface missiles, air defense upgrades (sensors and weapons), an advanced electronic warfare system; advanced decoys; a towed array system for submarine detection and torpedo defense, two 25mm guns, an armed helicopter capable of engaging with either Hellfire missiles or MK-54 torpedoes, and an unmanned FireScout helicopter for surveillance, reconnaissance, and targeting.

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So:

- Harpoon or LRASM for the ASM (Hellfire is NOT OTH)
- Air Defense Sensor Upgrade
- Air Defense Weapons Upgrade
- Advanced EW system
- TAS
- 2 x 25mm secondary guns
- 1 x Seahawk capable of ASSW and ASuW (which means a "Romeo" to me and this is where the Hellfires come in)
- 1 x FireSocuty UVAV

The specifics ar enot there...but based on the Freedom class specific SSC proposal, I believe the items will ultimately be what they proposed. And the same will go for the Independence SSC IMHO.

I guess we will have to wait and see.

Jeff Head said:

...

I guess we will have to wait and see.

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yeah I spent half of Friday evening with the SSC and I think the single most importance statement was made by Admiral Greenert:

But SecDef was clear -- cost and the industrial base has to be a consideration.

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quoted in

I couldn't even find what 25 mm would used ... does anybody here know this, by the way?

Found a new picture but good place for Helfire ? and I thought 45 missiles, Helfire or Griffin in 3 modules on/close flight deck ?

Never see a view or we see the place where they are.

With this pic I wonder if some kind of Hellfire launching device will emerge from below deck or if the Hellfires themselves are verticaly launched. Also, if those arrows depict the actual location of the mentioned system, then the OTH missiles can't be that big / numerous, being placed above the hanger. Maybe a few Harpoon / NSM? Four of them would still be a potent improvement.
But it still leaves the question were the upgraded AAW armament will go.