J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V

Discussion in 'Air Force' started by Deino, Apr 17, 2015.

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  1. janjak desalin
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    janjak desalin Junior Member

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    And, of course, Robert Michael Gates was held over from the previous, disastrous, administration. That was President Obama's second biggest mistake. His first was giving Hillary Clinton the Secretary of Defense job! However, at least the preceding administration she had ties to wasn't a wholesale policy disaster like the one that followed it.

    Oh, but that's right, no on else can launch political asides here!


    LOL!!!
     
    #1191 janjak desalin, Dec 26, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
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  2. cn_habs
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    cn_habs Junior Member

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    The "Ignore" button works wonders sometimes.
     
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  3. janjak desalin
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    janjak desalin Junior Member

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    And, voila, my advice comes back to me!

    Yes, it does.
     
  4. latenlazy
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    latenlazy Colonel

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    "War is not a sport" is exactly why you shouldn't believe outlandish kill ratios with no solid analysis backing the claims or base the effectiveness of a plane based on 1 vs 1 comparisons.
     
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  5. Hendrik_2000
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    Hendrik_2000 Brigadier

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    I don't believe that is the case you call yourself engineer but you should know nobody change horse in the middle of the race.
    Changing engine right now will set ack the program by at least 5 years because you don't shift the CW of the engine and expect your fly by wire to work. And changing the fly by wire is not an overnight programming. It is tedious and time consuming. So the likelihood they use Russian engine is NIL.

    The fact they celebrate the beginning what look like LRIP, show that they have high degree of confidence that the engine will be there when production start. Sofar there is nothing that contradict this.

    They still have 2 more years before production . In the mean time they can produce plane for CFTC to develop tactic, doctrine and integration issue that can be used to fine tune the production model

    I am not sure about the socalled sale of Russian Su 35 as closed done deal We have no confirmation from Chinese military sofar.
    But it has nothing to do with J 20 program.

    I don't know what is the motivation maybe for sparring partner for J 20. Or helping Russian aerospace to get sale for Su 35 going,
    Have a peek of how the Russian manage to increase the range of Su 35

    As to your contention that western weapon defeat all the Russian weapon is just your own opnion

    As Plawolf has said before the west hasn't fight any peer or near peer since the Korean war. Beating up 2nd rate military power with export version of Russian weapon and dubious military leadership doesn't count as proof of western superiority.
     
  6. Jeff Head
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    Jeff Head General
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    IMHO, such snidery is not all that becoming to you Janak

    As to your comment about political asides...well, I think you just did...and many others have. So that particular statement is demonstrably not accurate.

    It's when folks either discuss specific topics forbidden by SD rules, or go off the edge into pure ideological rants and such that things get moderated. You don't agree with a lot of that I know...but that's fine, you have every right to not agree with whatever your heart desires.

    No worries.

    To be sure, Gates was most definitely held over, on that you are exactly right and we agree. What he said about the Chinese and Russian programs was said when he was in the process of instituting new policy...as a reason for halting F-22 production.

    As far as Hillary Clinton goes, well she was put in as Secretary of State...not defense.

    But, as I say...no worries. That is all now water under the bridge and long since gone.

    My point in that post of mine was simply that the Chinese have done amazing things with their J-20 Program. Perhaps we can focus n that?

    I salute them for doing so...they are showing everyone that their ability to develop, design, and fi8eld a 5h generation aircraft is very far advanced.

    My hat is off to them.
     
    #1196 Jeff Head, Dec 26, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2015
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  7. Jeff Head
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    Jeff Head General
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    One in 2011, one in 2012, four in 2014 and now three in 2015...with this last appearing (at least to me) to be a production aircraft perhaps.

    This is very significant progress and they clearly instituted significant updates/improvements in 2014...refined them in 2015...and I believe they are going to go into LRIP now.

    We shall see...time will tell.
     
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  8. manqiangrexue
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    manqiangrexue Captain

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    Supercruise is mainly to increase the range of the fighter; at this time, I don't think the J-20 suffers from a range deficit compared to its peers so supercruise is not the greatest concern for J-20. Thrust vectoring is not a huge deal either, especially not for a delta canard design, which is inherently highly maneuverable. I think that with current delta canards, the maneuverability is nearing a point where the pilots are the limitation, so adding thrust vectoring would not contribute significantly, except to engine weight. If it would, I doubt it would be too difficult for China to negotiate the acquisition of thrust-vectored AL-31 from Russia, even if China itself wasn't experienced enough with the technology to add it to Taihang engines. In my opinion, the main things that the J-20 could gain from engine improvement is extra thrust and rear-quarter stealth. But as a stealth jet approaching its target head on in an ambush attack, the J-20 is quite mature as is.
    Well, the point isn't that it's not ok to go to war with an unfair advantage; the point is that due to these overwhelmingly unfair advantages (which would most likely not be available against a near peer), one could not evaluate the outcome to draw a meaningful conclusion in the one-vs.-one sense.
     
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  9. longmarch
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    longmarch Junior Member
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    Policy agenda aside, what Gates was thinking was likely a J-20 with its "final" engine, i.e. WS-15, which is still years ahead.
    However with long-lifecycle weapon platforms like this, nothing is really "final", upgrades and improvements will keep coming when they are available. Without upgrade even subsystems of F-22A are no longer state-of-art. Rather than holding everything for WS-15, it's a very sensible decision to use an interim engine for its first batch, which is still a very capable aircraft against its potential opponents. Even F-22A didn't have everything ready with its first delivery. Well done 611!

    I appreciate this pragmatism, I also like the open-mindedness of the acquisition of a small number of Su-35. But I don't think they are going for 117S for J-20.

    I think in the next a few years it'll probably more fun to watch PLA navy developments than its air force. There may be a new strategic bomber coming, and WS-15, then some incremental improvements on the air force side. But on the navy side let's see 002! let's see 055! Let's see 054B with IEP! Let's see navilized J-20! Let's see the nuclear powered carrier with EMCAT! Let's see the airstrips in SCS put into some good use! It'll be 10+ years before all of them becoming reality but it's exciting to watch!
     
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  10. GreenestGDP
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    GreenestGDP Junior Member

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    Developing a J-20 Combat Manual

    3x Golden Helmet Champions ( JJJ ) and his other Top Notch
    PLAAF + PLAN Golden Helmet Champions have been tasked
    to create 2 manuals ... ...


    1) PLA new Strategies, new Combat Tactics, and Stealth
    and Anti-Stealth new Combat Extreme Maneuvering manual

    2) PLA Integrated Battle Network Killzone Setting, Combining
    KJ-2000, KJ-200, J-20, J-11xx, J-10xx, J-16xx, HK6,
    SAM Assets, EW Assets manual



    金头盔--2011--2015--12 Champs.jpg


    Method #1
    DODGING and EVADING Supersonic missiles


    Dodge--Evade--Missile--howto--1.jpeg


    Method #2
    DODGING and EVADING Supersonic missile
    s

    Dodge--Evade--Missile--howto--2--596px686.jpg

    Method #3
    DODGING and EVADING Supersonic missile
    s

    Dodge--Evade--Missile--howto--3.jpeg

    Method #4
    DODGING and EVADING Supersonic missile
    s

    Dodge--Evade--Missile--howto--4.jpeg

    Method #5
    DODGING and EVADING Supersonic missile
    s
    Hitting 5 pictures limit rule ... ... ...



    Link: http://www.worlddefence.com/threads/j-20-5th-generation-fighter.20/page-80#post-65732


    Source_1: http://video.sina.com.cn/view/250339042.html


    Source_2:


    Source_3: https://defenseissues.wordpress.com/2013/08/17/evading-air-to-air-missile/
     
    #1200 GreenestGDP, Dec 26, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
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