Is the US shooting itself in the foot by banning Huawei?

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Jono

Junior Member
Registered Member
banning Huawei without solid evidence of wrong doing would seriously undermine Europe's much taunted narrative of rule based world orders, and risk losing their moral high ground in the eyes of developing countries because it is simply a classic example of hypocrisy for all to see. Then Europe will no longer be able to lecture other countries, and invade others on moral principles.
As it is , world leadership is already slowly shifting East.
I myself, probably in minority opinion, would like to see Europe banning Huawei, because in doing so, would galvanize Chinese public opinion to new heights of patriotism and devotion to their country's cause, and ?? hasten the demise of the western dominance. Huawei will have enough business in China, Asia, ME and Africa. Imagine these countries having 5G connections and innovations 2 years ahead of the western countries!!
 

vesicles

Colonel
I myself, probably in minority opinion, would like to see Europe banning Huawei, because in doing so, would galvanize Chinese public opinion to new heights of patriotism and devotion to their country's cause, and ?? hasten the demise of the western dominance.

Galvanizing the Chinese public opinion for what? How would a heightened patriotism hasten the demise of the western dominance? A hot war with the West? Millions of Chinese, Europeans and Americans die? May I remind you the ultimate and the wisest goal of any conflict/competition by Sun Ze's Arts of War: to win without fighting. The ability of Huawei to dominate the 5G market in the whole world would be a first step in such effort. Once Huawei successfully gains a foothold in the world, China's technology and economy will gradually dominate the world, in a peaceful way WITHOUT sacrificing millions of precious lives. Would this be better than throwing away millions of lives in a highly unpredictable hot war? This is also partly why the US is doing everything they can to kick Huawei out. They understand the danger of Huawei's business model and technology, which is literally a start of a peaceful domination of China.

Also, would banning Huawei actually galvanize the Chinese public opinion? The US is fighting a trade war with China at a magnitude millions times bigger than Huawei's potential market in Europe. It is literally China vs. the whole world (at least the entire western world) in the trade war. Under such tremendous pressure, has the Chinese public opinion been galvanized again the Americans?

During the trade war, many jobs have been lost and China's economy has slowed down, which directly impacts the lives of many Chinese citizens. Has the Chinese public opinion been galvanized? Huawei is a single company. Would banning Huawei directly impact the lives of average Joes in China? Banning of Huawei in Europe would only hurt China's long-term strategic goal to peacefully dominate the world. Average Chinese citizens would simply go about their lives without feeling anything. Why would such act galvanize their opinion? If you ask any individual, Chinese, American or European, how 5G would impact their lives, the most likely answer would be "I don't know... the 4G LTE is pretty fast to me... I can watch/download movies online with no issue..." Many Chinese might be even questioning, at this very moment, why their country is spending that much effort (i.e. $$$) to do something "useless to them"... Many of them would rather their government spending more to improve the things that they can see and feel in their everyday lives.
 
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now I read
China to be the world's biggest 5G market with 460 million users by 2025: report
Xinhua| 2019-03-21 16:42:28
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China will become the world's largest 5G market, with 460 million users of the next-generation superfast network by 2025, China daily reported Thursday, citing a report given by the Global System for Mobile Communications Association (GSMA).

The user number in China is forecast to be higher than that of Europe (205 million) and the United States (187 million) combined. Backed by 5G, China's mobile ecosystem is expected to add 6 trillion yuan (about 895.92 billion U.S. dollars) in value to the national economy in 2023, up from 5.2 trillion yuan last year, said the GSMA report.

"China's mobile industry has been a key driver of economic growth, inclusion and modernization , creating a new generation of digital consumers and transforming industry and society," the newspaper quoted Mats Granryd, director general of GSMA, as saying.

Hu Houkun, rotating chairman of telecom equipment maker Huawei Technologies Co, is bullish on the future of 5G. "5G will play a vital part in triggering explosive growth in virtual reality and augmented reality because it can solve all the technological bottlenecks that blocking the industry's development."

China's traditional sectors are said to have shown a strong interest in partnering with telecom companies to explore 5G, and the country can play a leading role in the process of the integration, said the newspaper, quoting Wang Jianzhou, former chairman of China Mobile, one of China's big three mobile service carriers, as saying.
 

B.I.B.

Captain
"I don't know... the 4G LTE is pretty fast to me... I can watch/download movies online with no issue..." Many Chinese might be even questioning, at this very moment, why their country is spending that much effort (i.e. $$$) to do something "useless to them"... Many of them would rather their government spending more to improve the things that they can see and feel in their everyday lives.

I totally agree with all you said.Heck even where I live 5g has no meaning for us. Unless one is fortunate enough to have a satellite internet connection, 56k modem dial up is the best that we can expect. 3g is the best we can expect for cell phones for the next 10yrs or so (we just upgraded from 2g a year ago) and even tthen ,we have to travel 20 miles up the road to receive a cell phone signal.
 

Biscuits

Major
Registered Member
I think the misinformation spread by US regime to convince countries to miss 5G has gone to your head.

One of the major determinants of a society’s level is defined by the speed of it’s communication. The higher the speed, the more well oiled the society will be, which makes everything go faster, including science, building, warfare etc.

Just a few days ago, remote surgery has been made possible due to the extreme communication speed of 5G.

The telegram which was 10 000 times faster and could carry more data than horseback enabled European civilization to leapfrog civilizations based on horseback communication.

Rejecting 5G is equally foolish as the Qing rejecting telegrams.

Not even America truly wants to reject it, it will probably copy the design as soon as Huawei makes it public, to minimize the time it spends without it.
 

antiterror13

Brigadier
I totally agree with all you said.Heck even where I live 5g has no meaning for us. Unless one is fortunate enough to have a satellite internet connection, 56k modem dial up is the best that we can expect. 3g is the best we can expect for cell phones for the next 10yrs or so (we just upgraded from 2g a year ago) and even tthen ,we have to travel 20 miles up the road to receive a cell phone signal.

well ... your comment is very interesting, without knowing what 5G is ... :p

The main important factor of 5G is not juts a speed, but also LATENCY which is a very big deal ... also the security is much much improved

read it first my friend ;)
 

Icmer

Junior Member
Registered Member
I totally agree with all you said.Heck even where I live 5g has no meaning for us. Unless one is fortunate enough to have a satellite internet connection, 56k modem dial up is the best that we can expect. 3g is the best we can expect for cell phones for the next 10yrs or so (we just upgraded from 2g a year ago) and even tthen ,we have to travel 20 miles up the road to receive a cell phone signal.

Unlike the US, China has reached 99% 4G network coverage. The limited high-speed coverage that exists in US rural areas has only been possible due to Huawei equipment.
 
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mr.bean

Junior Member
I totally agree with all you said.Heck even where I live 5g has no meaning for us. Unless one is fortunate enough to have a satellite internet connection, 56k modem dial up is the best that we can expect. 3g is the best we can expect for cell phones for the next 10yrs or so (we just upgraded from 2g a year ago) and even tthen ,we have to travel 20 miles up the road to receive a cell phone signal.

i'm not a tech junkie but the thought of downloading an entire 4K movie in 3 seconds is very appealing to me! if you wanna be stuck in 2G, 3G be my guest but 5G for me please.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
China play hard ball against Canada and stop buying Canola seed from Canada all together I think Canada is dumb in getting involve with US Huawei feud
Canada need to diversify her economy She it too dependent to US whim Notice the recent closure of GM plant in Ontario which will undermine Canadian prosperity But well those people are too lazy to find other market compare that to German or Holland which roam the world for their product since their market are too small
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China stops purchase of Canadian canola seeds
bc039d41d96c4548ab52a9e850f4c0ad_original.jpg

Canola grower David Reid checks on his storage bins full of last year's crop of canola seed on his farm near Cremona, Alberta, Canada, Friday, March 22, 2019. China has stopped all new purchases of Canadian canola seeds in what some see as retaliation for Canada's arrest of a top executive of Chinese tech giant Huawei. The Canola Council of Canada said late Thursday exporters are reporting Chinese importers are unwilling to purchase the seeds at this time. (Jeff McIntosh/The Canadian Press via AP)


TORONTO (AP) -- China has stopped all new purchases of Canadian canola seeds in what some see as retaliation for Canada's arrest of a top executive of Chinese tech giant Huawei.

The Canola Council of Canada said late Thursday exporters are reporting Chinese importers are unwilling to purchase the seeds at this time.

In 2018, China bought about 40 percent of Canada's canola exports for a total of $2.1 billion.

Guy Saint-Jacques, a former Canadian ambassador to China, said Canada's government now needs to retaliate and should expel any Chinese athletes training in Canada for the Beijing Winter Olympic Games in 2022.

"We are going to lose billions in dollars in trade and it's time to show our displeasure," Saint-Jacques said

Earlier this year, Beijing suspended canola imports from Canadian-based Richardson International Ltd. for what one Chinese official alleged was the detection of hazardous organisms in the company's product.

But David Mulroney, Canada's former ambassador to China, said the blockage of Canadian canola is "absolutely related" to the Huawei arrest.

Relations between both countries have been tense since Canada arrested Chinese executive Meng Wanzhou in Vancouver in early December at the request of the U.S.

U.S. prosecutors have filed fraud charges against Meng, who is Huawei's chief financial officer and the daughter of its founder.

China has warned of "grave consequences" if Meng is not immediately released. On Dec. 10, it arrested two Canadians in an apparent attempt to pressure the government of Justin Trudeau. A Chinese court also sentenced a Canadian to death in a sudden retrial in December, overturning a 15-year prison term handed down earlier.

Mulroney said the latest move by China should convince the Canadian government that Huawei should be banned from supplying equipment for 5G networks in Canada.

"This is really the example that should convince people that the risk is too great," Mulroney said.

Canada and its security agencies are studying whether to use equipment from Huawei as phone carriers prepare to roll out fifth-generation technology. 5G is designed to support a vast expansion of networks to facilitate medical devices, self-driving cars and other technology.

Huawei is the world's biggest supplier of network gear used by phone and internet companies, but has long been seen as a front for spying by China's military and its highly skilled security services.

"We are about to make a really, really important decision on the future of the technology on which our internet is based," Mulroney said. "How can we not at least consider what's happening in the agriculture sector when we make a decision in the technology sector?"

"If China intervenes capriciously in one sector, might it not intervene capriciously in another? We have to turn the tables on China. China turns the tables on us," he added.

Prime Justin Trudeau said Canada's intelligence and security services are very carefully examining Huawei.

Trudeau added that he is optimistic his government will be able to solve the canola issue, noting a previous issue over canola exports to China in 2016 was solved.

It is not the first time that Beijing has struck back against a nation which appears to cross it.

In 2010, China suspended its bilateral trade deal with Norway and restricted imports of Norwegian salmon after the Nobel Peace Prize was awarded to Chinese political prisoner Liu Xiaobo.

Britain and other countries were also retaliated against over their meetings with the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan spiritual leader who is considered a dangerous separatist by Beijing.

"We cannot take this laying down any longer. It's a two-way relationship and they cannot do this to an old friend," said Saint-Jacques, the ex- ambassador.

Saint-Jacques also said it is getting close to the point where Canada should expel China's ambassador.

"He has not been helpful in this crisis," he said. "When you look at what the Chinese are doing this is pretty significant."

He also said the Trump administration needs to speak up more on Canada's behalf.

"We are in a big mess and Canadian farmers are going to suffer and so the Americans should recognize they have some responsibility in this. And they should try to help us," he said.
 

taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
well ... your comment is very interesting, without knowing what 5G is ... :p

The main important factor of 5G is not juts a speed, but also LATENCY which is a very big deal ... also the security is much much improved

read it first my friend ;)
Besides latency, another feature of 5G is IoT from telemeters to self driven cars and refrigerators etc. etc. 4G and before are to connect computers, 5G is to connect everything and anything.
 
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