Is the US shooting itself in the foot by banning Huawei?

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AssassinsMace

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
This debate over who has better 5G technology reminds me of Obama peddling Solyndra having better solar panel technology. Solyndra went bankrupt even with government subsidies because it couldn't compete despite having better technology. Yes Trump is right to ban Huawei because that's the only way Western 5G survives is by forcing Western customers to buy it. The only way the US can be supreme is if no one else has it. The US is against One Road One Belt because it doesn't want other markets they do not control to develop. New economic blocks that can defy US wishes. From Obama to Trump... they claimed the world would rather choose the US over China then the US has nothing to worry about. If the US/West is less expensive, then other countries can chose them over China. If all factors were in the US's favor, nothing to worry about China. If countries are worried that they'll be in debt with China, then choose the US instead. The critics act like China is putting a gun to poor countries' heads. Do we see countries getting loans running to the US for protection from big bad China? No. You don't see the US offering a better deal. It's because they want everyone to pay Western prices or don't have it at all because it would be embarrassing if tiny poor countries had better 5G services than in the US. Out of all Western and allied countries, the US has the worst internet speeds and services. It has always lagged behind its own allies. Remember the propaganda that China had low internet speeds because the government wants to control the internet. Well China is going to 5G that's faster than anything now. Shouldn't China be preventing 5G from spreading in China? Remember how Obama claimed he wanted to be the green President. He wanted to scare the world into adopting green technologies to save the Earth. Not because he believed what he was peddling. He wanted to scare the world into having to buy expensive US green technology until China ruined it coming out with cheaper by the dollar alternatives. Then Obama killed any attempt by the world into going green because the US wasn't going to be the primary benefactor of it.


When do Chinese wear kimonos/pajamas? Obviously the mayor is referring to some cultural attire but when do the Chinese ever do that? Yeah because the people at the relay station have internet while the town doesn't, there must be a conspiracy going on. Maybe they're expecting China to force internet services the town can't afford but to seem to complain not having. The Chinese taught the locals skills to build their town but expect freebies like in aid which they want more. Sounds like they were puppeting Western talking points.
 
plawolf

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Apple just posted its first downwards revised investor forecast in 15 years due to weak demand in China.

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What is most striking is the arrogance of Apple and western media coverage, blaming it all on weaker Chinese growth.

Funny how Alibaba and it’s Chinese smartphone competitors are not feeling the same negative impacts of China’s supposed economic collapse.

Fortunately, because this is a business story, where people’s money is on the line, so you do get some actual serious objective and accurate analysis as dogma is worth dogpoop in the world of money.

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The two drastically contrasting quality of analysis and tone of those two articles on the same subject is actually a very good case study in western media reporting.

When you have real stakes (for the western readers), you tend to have people who got to where they are by being good at being right writing the analysis. OTOH, your typical western political/tech/entertainment/etc writer, who write on subjects that won’t cost their readers money if they are wrong, tend to get and keep their jobs by saying what their editors/owners like to hear.

But what we can see from this is that even Apple, the supposed untouchable American poster child is getting hit harder than expected at least particularly as a result of the trade war.

And that is all without China playing its trump card of whipping up public sentiment for a boycott.

China is pulling its punches as it does not want the trade war and is mainly looking to contain and stop it. Yet already American companies are feeling the pain.

Imagine what it would be like for them if China started playing to win.

In a way, I am worried China’s respectful, nuanced approach might be going over Trump’s head.

Far from realising China is pulling its punches to give him a chance to back down with at least some grace, he might instead think China is weak and easy to bully.

Let’s hope Chinese negotiators and diplomats are far more frank in private about just how much China could hurt America’s economy back if the gloves come off.
 
A

ahho

Junior Member
does anyone remember the huawei bid was blocked for London underground coverage for the 2012 Olympics. took them another 5 years to complete the network while most metro system in China already have coverage. the western government should really take a good look on what kind of band should be in place or else their country could lag behind
 
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antiterror13

Brigadier
ahho said:
does anyone remember the huawei bid was blocked for London underground coverage for the 2012 Olympics. took them another 5 years to complete the network while most metro system in China already have coverage. the western government should really take a good look on what kind of band should be in place or else their country could lag behind
Click to expand...

I didn't know that ... so it was operational in 2017? who won the bid and built it?
 
G

gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
plawolf said:
Apple just posted its first downwards revised investor forecast in 15 years due to weak demand in China.

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What is most striking is the arrogance of Apple and western media coverage, blaming it all on weaker Chinese growth.
...
Click to expand...

Apple is full of shit. They stopped reporting their unit shipment volumes some time back. Now they use the China trade war issue as an excuse for why their poor value products are not selling. If anything they should be thanking the Gods that these gullible fools have bought their overprice crapola for as long as they have.

Now I've heard they want to move production to India and expect to replace the Chinese market with the Indian one. Good luck. The Indians have proved so far to have little budget for overpriced widgets like the iPhone. It all smacks of Johnny came lately since even Chinese companies like Xiaomi are already there with a much more competitive product.
 
Jura The idiot

Jura The idiot

General
here comes the story of
China, Huawei, and the Coming Technological Cold War
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dated January 3, 2019
:
2019 might be the year that splinters the global technology system into distinct spheres of influence.

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.
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.
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. Whatever you call it, the U.S.-China science and technology relationship is being violently remade. While a tightly linked technology system benefited the United States and China over the last two decades, there is now widespread concern on both sides of the Pacific that the economic and security risks outweigh the gains. President Xi Jinping has embraced and accelerated policies designed to increase the innovativeness of the Chinese economy and reduce dependence on foreign suppliers. The Trump administration has put Chinese technologies policies front and center as a danger to U.S. economic and national security. The eventual outcome of this contest may be two distinct technology systems, with other countries forced to choose if they are going to plug into American or Chinese technology platforms and standards.

Over the last year, the Trump administration has pressured Beijing to roll back
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and worked to prevent the flow of American technology to China. Congress passed the
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, which expands the Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States’ ability to investigate foreign investment in “critical technologies”, and the Department of Commerce is expected to introduce
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on “emerging and foundational technologies.” In November 2018, then Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced a
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to identify priority Chinese trade theft cases and evaluate whether additional legislative and administrative authorities would be required to protect U.S. assets from foreign economic espionage. The Department of Justice indicted
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from the Ministry of State Security in December 2018 for stealing secrets from the banking, finance, telecommunications, health care, energy, and automotive industries.

Huawei, the Chinese telecom manufacturer, sits at the center of this new cold war. 5G, the next generation of mobile communication technology, promises greater speed and capacity, and will enable the internet of things, automated vehicles, and other innovations. It will also introduce new cybersecurity
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. While U.S. officials have never publicly provided evidence that Huawei equipment has backdoors or been tampered with, they warn that allowing the company to be involved in the build-out of 5G networks raises unmanageable security risks, and they have steadily increased pressure on the company at home and abroad. In January, after scrutiny from U.S. regulators, AT&T walked back from a deal to sell Huawei
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in the United States. The
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proposed making it harder for smaller carriers to use the Universal Service Fund to pay for future purchases of telecom equipment from Huawei. In August, President Trump signed a
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that prohibited any carrier with any substantial amount of installed Chinese telecom equipment from federal government contracts.

Washington has pressured its allies not to use Huawei. In August, Australia
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Huawei from supplying equipment to develop the country’s 5G wireless infrastructure. In November, the New Zealand government
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a local telecom’s proposal to use Huawei equipment in its 5G network upgrade. In December, a major British telecom announced that it would remove Huawei equipment, and UK intelligence officials have flagged
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in Huawei software.
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,
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,
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,
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, and
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are reportedly considering banning or limiting Huawei. While not directly connected to the cybersecurity concerns of Huawei products, the detention of CFO Meng Wanzhou in Canada on charges she misrepresented subsidiary relationships in order to deceive U.S. banks into conducting business with Iranian telecommunications companies in
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has raised the tensions around the company considerably.

The United States is also
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to slow Huawei’s expansion in third markets. Australia objected after the Solomon Islands signed a deal with the company to explore building a link between it and the Australian mainland, and the government eventually stepped in and will
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of the construction to keep Huawei out. Efforts by the United States, Japan, and Australia to stop Huawei in its efforts to build a submarine telecommunications cable to Papua New Guinea were not as successful when the country decided that it could not afford to walk away from a project that was more than half finished. As
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put it, “Whatever views Australia or the U.S. might have in relation to cybersecurity, as far as Huawei or China are concerned, those are for the big boys to worry about.”

The race for 5G is far from over. U.S. companies hold a strong position in patents and technological development. Chinese telecoms are rapidly developing competing technologies, benefit from government support in roll out and implementation of 5G services, and often offer their products at prices twenty to thirty percent cheaper than their competitors. The challenge for Washington is to create an environment that supports innovation at home and a shared approach to 5G security with its friend and allies. The competition is likely to pick up in 2019, and the end result increasingly looks like separate spheres of technology influence.
Click to expand...
 
plawolf

plawolf

Lieutenant General
antiterror13 said:
Who would any smart people buy the current iPhone? .... Huawei, Xiaomi or LG are the only ones I would use ... 1/3 to 1/4 of iPhone price and in some areas are better than iPhone
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OT, but it’s the software that keeps people locked into Apple.

All my media and software purchased from the Apple App Store would not be useable if I switch to Android, which is probably going to take a lot of money to re-purchase from the playstore. Not to mention the time and inconvenience of migrating all my files, playlists, settings etc.

That is a key reason why Apple thinks they can get away with charge stupid money for inferior hardware, and which that kind of shit just won’t fly on Android.

For Android users, switching between Samsung or Huawei carries none of the costs and inconvenience as a switch away from the iPhone would be for long time Apple users.

Personally I think this is an area ripe for China to exploit if it wants to hurt Apple and the US.

An anti-trust investigation that results in a ruling that media and software purchased from Apple should be free for the user to transfer to Android if they so wish (and vice versa, but who in their right mind would go through all that to switch to Apple these days?!) could destroy Apple’s whole pricing strategy. As I can see massive numbers of Apples ‘loyal’ customers jumping ship to Android if the software and media cost barriers of doing so was eliminated or massively reduced.

Such an investigation would have massive popular support world wide, in the EU and US.

If the EU follows China’s lead, it will put America in an extremely uncomfortable position.
 
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