Iranian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Discussion in 'World Armed Forces' started by ShahryarHedayat, Oct 13, 2015.

  1. Gloire_bb
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    Gloire_bb Junior Member
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    Iran has lots of high quality oil and gas, though. Barter deal is a nice way out.
    It may sound strange, but mig-35 may actually have a good case here(at least somewhere, lol).
    Not because Iran likes it(i really doubt it does), but because it may end up being their only option.
     
  2. TerraN_EmpirE
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    TerraN_EmpirE Tyrant King

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    That might be more tempting to China. Remember Russia is an Oil nation.
     
  3. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    It would not be the first time Russia made a similar deal. They buy oil & gas from their ex-USSR satellites all the time.

    Russia is more than an oil producer, they are also an oil refiner, and distributor.
    You can always use cheap oil, even if you are a producer, you can simply consume the cheaper oil yourself and thus free up more of your own production for export.

    Also, Russia has a lot of experience with conducting barter deals, they recently did one with Indonesia recently for Sukhois. Then again China has also conducted barter deals in the past, they recently did one with Malaysia where they bartered palm oil for construction services.

    I think Russia, China, and probably other nations, should setup their own trade list and start conducting trade with Iran, be it with barter deals or gold backed transactions.
     
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  4. Khalij e Fars
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    Khalij e Fars Just Hatched
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    Su-27 or su-30 are possible from Russia, but Russia has a terrible record in keeping its word and Iran has learnt this lesson the hard way. Iran also wants full ToT but this is something Russia doesn't want to give, especially not for su-30.

    Chinese jets are possible but I think Iran's air force do not want to switch to Chinese jets. Iran has a long way to go before it can build something large like f-18 or even f-14, but it is slowly building the industrial base and experience in production lines etc to achieve this one day in the future.

    Currently, Iran's budget is too small and industrial base not yet on a sufficient level to go much beyond reverse-engineered F-5 with improved (4th gen) avionics etc. The biggest problem is the engine - Iran reverse engineered J-85 in 2016 but a more powerful engine like J-79 or RD-33 in the 15,000-20,000 lbf category will take some more years (but is being worked on). Until then Iran is very limited in what it can do air-force wise as you say.

    How many countries can fully indigenise engines like this whilst under strict sanctions that prevent them importing even basic materials? It's not easy, especially for a country that has no experience in building such complex materials itself and only started to push for self-sufficiency in these areas in the '90s and has to start from scratch.

    But the air force is not a priority for Iran, Iran believes BMs are better deterrence (Iran cannot compete with US air force so what's the point of conventional competition, and of course Iran cannot get 4+ gen fighters anyway). UAVs are also a big priority for Iran, the (near) future will be further developments of Saeqeh and Simorgh.
     
  5. Khalij e Fars
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    Khalij e Fars Just Hatched
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    I should add that Iran announced it was working on an engine 4x as powerful as Owj/J-85 in 2016 when it announced completion of Owj, it is believed to be based on RD-33 (which Iran has imported for its Mig-29s).

    Iran tested Owj for about 5 years before fully revealing it, so I expect we will see Iranian version of RD-33 with 18,000-20,000 lbf in the next 2-4 years.

    Iran has also already started designing a more powerful engine even than that since early 2019, with 35,000 lbf, but that is in early stages. :)
     
  6. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    I am not sure about the air force being useless. If Iran stationed the aircraft in the north of the country, far away from the Persian Gulf, and Iraq, I think it would be hard for the US to directly attack those facilities with anything but missiles.

    The aircraft could be used as an anti-shipping weapon platform with the appropriate missiles.
     
  7. Gloire_bb
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    Gloire_bb Junior Member
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    Resell the oil, especially when Iran is so troubled selling it by itself.

    It's actually a big win, since mixing good and bad oil(Russia has quite a few bad one), when possible, drastically improves product quality(and price), thus gives more profits than even reselling this very oil for market prices. Essentially it is money right out of thin air.
    There are technical questions(chemical), but they are solvable.

    Yeah, that's the terrible side.
    Even in Russia Israeli voice has its impact, and Iran has little way to counter such an open bullying.
    +Iran is essentially out of luck, with all mutually exclusive relationships in the region, i have hard time seeing China choosing Iran over all gulf monarchies and Israel to sell offensive weapons... Iranian relations with Pakistan aren't great either.

    This is why i told what maybe - just maybe! - mig-35 may be a case here. While the fighter suffers from legacy of Soviet doctrine, its downsides may actually push it forwards:
    From Russian side:
    1. As unwilling to sell advanced equipment to Iran as Russia is(Iran is a very well known tech absorber), RuAF doesn't really want this fighter itself. Problem is, it doesn't want Mig dead either.
    2. Key russian assets aren't really endangered: Russia and its key allies fly Sukhois(and we already heard rumors what su-30sm/su-35 are unlikely to be sold to Iran even after 2020).
    3. I believe it to be a fighter with the lowest possible pushback from Israel.
    For all intents and purposes, even in its latest form, range/payload ratio of mig-29 family isn't great, neither are its stand off strike capabilities.

    From Iranian side:
    1. First and foremost, they don't really have a choice. To my belief, if China won't suddenly forget everyone around, it's the one and only modern 4.5 gen platform availible to them.
    IOC 2020-2021, about as fresh as they can hope for, with all appropriate bells and whistles onboard.
    2.Mig is arguably among better 4.5 gens availible for defensive counter air(primary mission), and does reasonably well most secondary ones. According to mig, most glaring shortcomings of original fighter are all fixed(namely, range, ability to acf independently of GCI environement, and a2g). And its main upsides - almost f-15 class raw performance, unmatched WVR, dispersability(mudfighter qualities) and intercept timings, all of them are still here.
    While Gripen E/Meteor combo at least shakes this position, they will never ever get it, and i am not sure if Swedish concept is even appliable to Iran and its adversaries.
    3.They have much to learn from it, in two ways.
    Firstly, in the end it is a really modern 4.5 gen piece. Lots of interesting tech.
    Secondly, it is based on mig-29s already in their posession. It offers a an insiders vidw on how Mikoyan evolved their fighter. The same reason with China going for su-35, basically.
    4.Experience with mig-29. Iran operates them for 27 years.
     
    #97 Gloire_bb, Jun 2, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2019
  8. asif iqbal
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    asif iqbal Brigadier

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    Iran is far more capable and also very determined

    They have proxy’s all over the Middle East

    They will attack every foreigner in Iraq

    Hezbollah in Lebanon will probably open a second front against Israel

    Syria and Yemen

    Basically it’s WW 3

    This is why US will never attack Iran
     
  9. Dizasta1
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    Dizasta1 Senior Member

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    I believe it is high time that Iran modernizes it's air force. The country needs strong allies and it needs to build it's economy. Iran has the ability to absorb ToT from any country, so it would be in their interest that Russia and/or China strengthen ties with Iran and come to a mutually beneficial agreement whereby Iran is able to establish broad based trade agreements with both countries as well as Pakistan and the Central Asian Republics. In doing so, Iran will be able to stabilize it's economy and modernize their air force.
     
  10. Khalij e Fars
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    Khalij e Fars Just Hatched
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    Problems: (i) Iran likes to do everything indigenously, (ii) Iran only wants to import high level jets that satisfy the demands of many stakeholders inside Iran (i.e. the pilots themselves have a big say in this), (iii) Iran faces a lot of difficulty in importing such jets and lastly (iv) Iran doesn't have the military budget that would be necessary for a large air force. The little money it does spend on its military is diverted mostly to IRGC missile and UAV forces.
     
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