Interesting, Pakistani AF to buy both F-16 and J-10

I wonder what this means to the FC-1/JF-17 project?

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The Bush administration will formally ask the U.S. Congress to approve the sale of American-made F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan, Undersecretary of State Nick Burns said on April 27.

He made the announcement after talks with Pakistani Foreign Secretary Riaz Khan, who said the package would be scaled-down from an earlier request and include old as well as new aircraft.

After a devastating Oct. 8 earthquake, Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf said he would postpone the purchase of F-16s -- built by Lockheed Martin Corp. -- while the government assessed how it would meet the costs of reconstruction and rehabilitation in devastated parts of Pakistani Kashmir and the North West Frontier Province.

Burns said he reassured Khan "we are committed to the sale of American F-16 aircraft to Pakistan and we intend to begin (formal) consultations with Congress shortly."

Other than saying it would be a "scaled down request (with) some new and some old" jets, Khan said he could provide no further information. The details of the package "keep getting revised," he told a news conference.

Earlier in the month, Pakistan’s cabinet gave its air force clearance to open negotiations to buy 36 Jian-10 fighter aircraft from China and 62 F-16s from the United States.

The shopping list included 36 modified versions of China’s Jian-10 aircraft, along with 26 F-16s of Type A and B, and 18 F-16s of the latest Block 50/52 C and D type models, with an option for 18 more, defense officials in Islamabad said at the time, confirming a report in the Business Recorder newspaper.

The newspaper, citing an official document, said the government also gave approval for purchase of Beyond Visual Range (BVR) missiles, targeting pods and joint direct attack munitions.

Since the earthquake, the international community has offered over $6 billion in aid and soft loans to help Pakistan recover from the disaster. Though no official figures have been released, the cost of the F-16s alone is expected to be around $2.5 billion.
The costs for the Jian-10 and the BVR missiles are also estimated to run into billions of dollars.

Dongfeng said:

I wonder what this means to the FC-1/JF-17 project?

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Actually, there shall be no 'threat' to the JF-17. The JF-17 shall be the PAF's backbone, as it was the primary reason they helped fund $ 0.5 billion into it since the past decade.

Thus, Pakistan will definitely purchase the JF-17 in large numbers.

Operating three types of fighters with similar roles and close performance would be a logistic nightmare. I have got a feeling that this might something to do with politics. Of course Paksitan wish to have F-16, but it would be waste of money to give up FC-1 now since a lot of money has already been invested. At the same time, Pakistan has also learned its lesson not to trust the U.S. 100% just in case the 1993 saction repeats again.

DongFeng,

Actually you have valid point but lemme try to explain.

F-16s are being acquired because of the urgent need for mature and viable aircraft that could fulfill the current and future requirements of PAF. The infrastructure is also there and training is not lacking either.Block 50/52 are being inducted as high end fighters until J-10 will either replace them or take their place once it become mature enough.

JF-17: is going to be the low to middle tier aircraft. What everyone misses when they talk about Jf-17 is the aircraft production capabilty this aircraft will bring to Pakistan. No problems with spareparts and probably commonality in weapon system and avionics with J-10 or atleast they will be dealing with the same company CAC for both planes. With more upgrades it will become better and better in future but it will still be the backbone like indianfighter said. It might however start taking over from A/Bs Mlued F-16s when in Air-2-Air role. Also Jf-17 will ensure replacement of F-7Ps,PGs,A-5s,Mirages(all types). So in theory Pakistan will be going from 4-5 types to just three types.

J-10 is a long term acquisation solution something that will lead to near fifth gen capabiltiy with more potential for upgrades and no threat of sanctions unlike Block 52/50.

Dongfeng said:

Operating three types of fighters with similar roles and close performance would be a logistic nightmare. I have got a feeling that this might something to do with politics. Of course Paksitan wish to have F-16, but it would be waste of money to give up FC-1 now since a lot of money has already been invested. At the same time, Pakistan has also learned its lesson not to trust the U.S. 100% just in case the 1993 saction repeats again.

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The numbers and prices set for these aircraft are not set in stone. Pakistan couls use the same kind of leverage india uses to drive down prices.

What im really interested in is what kind of j-10 pakistan will be purchasing. Im sure it will be similar to the first chinese test batch, but with what modifications? will the russians allow these planes to use al-31?

MIGleader said:

The numbers and prices set for these aircraft are not set in stone. Pakistan couls use the same kind of leverage india uses to drive down prices.

What im really interested in is what kind of j-10 pakistan will be purchasing. Im sure it will be similar to the first chinese test batch, but with what modifications? will the russians allow these planes to use al-31?

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Very good point. Whenever Pakistan buys military equipment from China, it is always with modifications to suit the specific needs of the PAF. One can only imagine what type of modifications or upgrades Pakistan will want for the J-10's.

crazyinsane105 said:

Very good point. Whenever Pakistan buys military equipment from China, it is always with modifications to suit the specific needs of the PAF. One can only imagine what type of modifications or upgrades Pakistan will want for the J-10's.

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Western Avionics? Most likely a European country as relations between the EU and China are warming up.

DPRKUnderground said:

Western Avionics? Most likely a European country as relations between the EU and China are warming up.

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That might be true but then given the progress China has made in the field of avionics i wouldn't doubt if it gets alot of Chinese content including a chinese AESA/PESA radar. It will be some time before J-10 makes it into PAF. SO i think it will be an improved version of J-10 (probably the one that flies this year???)

Latest news.




Pakistan scales back F-16 purchases from US
By Farhan Bokhari in Islamabad
Published: April 28 2006 11:49 | Last updated: April 28 2006 11:49

f-16 fightersPakistan has scaled back by half its ambitious planned purchase of new fighter planes from the US to help pay for the relief costs of last year’s devastating earthquake.
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Foreign secretary Riaz Mohammad Khan announced on a visit to Washington that rather than buy new Lockheed Martin F-16 fighters, Pakistan would purchase “a mix” of old and new planes. The plan would be “far less ambitious”, he said without giving figures.

Western diplomats familiar with the US-Pakistan discussions said Pakistan was now likely to spend US$1.6bn-US$1.8bn on the F-16s, down from as much as U$3.5bn.

The original plan for at least 75 new F-16s had been cut to 18 new and 36 used planes, with an option for a further 23 fighters some time in the future, said one western diplomat.

The US last year lifted a 15-year-old ban on the export of F-16s to Pakistan, a key ally in its war on terror. “We are committed to the sale of American F-16 aircraft to Pakistan and we intend to begin [formal] consultations with Congress shortly,”said Nick Burns, US undersecretary of state, on Thursday.

October’s earthquake forced Pakistan to postpone the purchase as it sought more than US$5.2bn from donors to help with reconstruction costs.

“It is possible that the US urged Pakistan to be more realistic about how much money it could spend on this deal. The Bush administration must have thought Pakistan would loose its goodwill with other donors such as Europeans if it insisted on such a large spending on defence,” said the western diplomat.

Earlier this month, the Pakistani cabinet approved the purchase of 77 F-16s, although it was not clear if these were all new planes.

It also approved air force plans to buy an unspecified number of Jian-10 fighter planes from China.

Diplomats said on Friday they had no evidence of any change in plans over the J10 purchase, which was currently for up to 36 fighter planes in a deal worth up to US$1.5bn.

The Pakistani Air Force favours a purchase of fighter planes from a source other than the US because of concerns about a repeat of Washington’s past sanction on the F-16s which sharply widened the gap between the capability of the PAF and its closest rival, the Indian Air Force.

So far this is what we know the PAF will look like in the future:

18-41 F-16C/D Block 52
68 F-16A/B MLU
32 J-10
150 JF-17