Hong Kong....Occupy Central Demonstrations....
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Re: Chinese General news resource thread
Regarding the what would get high school students part -- I'm a student of psychology, and it's not that long ago that I too was a 16 year old as well, discussing sensitive political topics (not too different to this) with fellow 16 year olds.
I've learned a few things from both: it's easier to appeal to short term emotion than long term holistic and strategic thinking; it's easy to get people on your side with words like freedom and democracy; and easy to hate someone throwing words like authoritarianism and dictatorship.
I'm sure many of the protesters definitely do have valid greivances, but imo it is a stretch to say the high school students are evidence of such unbearable injustices that even children are pouring onto the streets.
My own mother was a university student protester at TAM in 1989 and she describes the feeling of excitement, solidarity, and 热闹, was a far bigger driver to your average student than whatever specific aims the organizers had at the time. Solidarity has a power of its own.
I look forward to your further posts on the matter.
Regarding the what would get high school students part -- I'm a student of psychology, and it's not that long ago that I too was a 16 year old as well, discussing sensitive political topics (not too different to this) with fellow 16 year olds.
I've learned a few things from both: it's easier to appeal to short term emotion than long term holistic and strategic thinking; it's easy to get people on your side with words like freedom and democracy; and easy to hate someone throwing words like authoritarianism and dictatorship.
I'm sure many of the protesters definitely do have valid greivances, but imo it is a stretch to say the high school students are evidence of such unbearable injustices that even children are pouring onto the streets.
My own mother was a university student protester at TAM in 1989 and she describes the feeling of excitement, solidarity, and 热闹, was a far bigger driver to your average student than whatever specific aims the organizers had at the time. Solidarity has a power of its own.
I look forward to your further posts on the matter.
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
Oh the petition has now 100,000 signatures. This is just to show you how fast and how serious the sentiments are going.
Oh the petition has now 100,000 signatures. This is just to show you how fast and how serious the sentiments are going.
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
Oh and I'm preparing my reply to you on the other window as we speak. Sorry for the wait.
Ahh you're psych major too eh? Always to have a friend of the same discipline
Oh and I'm preparing my reply to you on the other window as we speak. Sorry for the wait.
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
LOL, wow.... I think the most sensitive word I can describe that with is ambitious.
Whether the US will say anything on the matter is another question. This isn't exactly ukraine and Russia, HK is still sovereign Chinese territory, and this is as sensitive of an internal matter as any for beijing.
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What I can't get my head around, is the impatience of it all. Even if only three candidates are vetted, it's still a step forward compared to what HK has now and what the british had for HK. It seems like the movement just wants everything and they want it now, no room for compromise.
LOL, wow.... I think the most sensitive word I can describe that with is ambitious.
Whether the US will say anything on the matter is another question. This isn't exactly ukraine and Russia, HK is still sovereign Chinese territory, and this is as sensitive of an internal matter as any for beijing.
---
What I can't get my head around, is the impatience of it all. Even if only three candidates are vetted, it's still a step forward compared to what HK has now and what the british had for HK. It seems like the movement just wants everything and they want it now, no room for compromise.
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
I guess I will sleep after this, so I'm gonna answer all your questions
Yea it's actually not separated. The disappointment led to the HK public no longer wants CCP to pick our leaders. Here's the thing: If CCP had been picking CE who could lead HK properly and pertain to HKers' interests as well, then we would be satisfy and no need to change things. So it's the fact that while the past few ones ain't doing their job properly, this CE, CY Leung, messes everything up and basically so inept, he burned all the fuse/card/chances/tolerances that HK had left after the previous 2 CE. While the past few had some disappointment, for most part they ain't that bad. This guy however, is so bad that he had refused to come out to address the crowd until 2 hours ago. That's how you piss someone off. Imagine someone asking you to provide explanation, but you purposely ignore them, which of course adds fuel to the fire. That's just one example.
This is what spurred the anger. The National People's Congress reviewed the demands for direct election and eventually made this decision. Why HKers are upset is because:
1. this means non-pro-Beijing candidates could be filtered out. The election committee were essentially pro-Beijing representatives already, so essentially they will do Beijing's dirty work of filtering the undesirables
2. meddling in HK's control of democratic process
3. violating the 1984 Joint Declaration
All in all, this meant the "promised" democratic process is a sham, and HKers already had enough of Beijing selecting our Chief Executives. In a more casual analogy, we're saying to Beijing, "Sorry boss, but we don't want you to pick our food. You suck at picking"
Totally understandable. I agree with you. This is why I was first confused, shocked, then saddened by the turnout of the events. Unlike what a lot of people here said(because they don't understand or know HK or been there), HKPF has one of the most professional and courteous police force in the world. (Many reasons. HKers are very demanding and educated by default and any small things can lead to complaints towards the officers, and this often can not only risk the officer's career, but also by default the HKPF had been highly trained to have very very good EQ generally, and they've been battered with so much verbal abuses these days, the same equivalent in elsewhere would've led to arrests or rude treatment). Anyways, so when people these 2 years are calling HKPF dogs or "gong 'an"(Chinese cops because it's a term associated with police state police), I would defend the HKP. All this changed 48 hours ago when HKPF started using force I felt is excessive to the situation. Of course by standards of how other police treat citizens HKPF isn't that bad, but by HK's standards where we rarely get treated this way, it's totally too much. What made it worse was that their targets are students, many of which are still in high school. Also, there are now a lot of cases of rough handling caught on video camera. If there were any skepticism of them being now rough, now it's all gone.
[Latest Update at 3:08 - Tear gas used]
I will upload this part. Next part coming up. I need to look over at the newest development. HKPF is digging themselves a deeper hole.
I guess I will sleep after this, so I'm gonna answer all your questions
Yea it's actually not separated. The disappointment led to the HK public no longer wants CCP to pick our leaders. Here's the thing: If CCP had been picking CE who could lead HK properly and pertain to HKers' interests as well, then we would be satisfy and no need to change things. So it's the fact that while the past few ones ain't doing their job properly, this CE, CY Leung, messes everything up and basically so inept, he burned all the fuse/card/chances/tolerances that HK had left after the previous 2 CE. While the past few had some disappointment, for most part they ain't that bad. This guy however, is so bad that he had refused to come out to address the crowd until 2 hours ago. That's how you piss someone off. Imagine someone asking you to provide explanation, but you purposely ignore them, which of course adds fuel to the fire. That's just one example.
This is what spurred the anger. The National People's Congress reviewed the demands for direct election and eventually made this decision. Why HKers are upset is because:
1. this means non-pro-Beijing candidates could be filtered out. The election committee were essentially pro-Beijing representatives already, so essentially they will do Beijing's dirty work of filtering the undesirables
2. meddling in HK's control of democratic process
3. violating the 1984 Joint Declaration
All in all, this meant the "promised" democratic process is a sham, and HKers already had enough of Beijing selecting our Chief Executives. In a more casual analogy, we're saying to Beijing, "Sorry boss, but we don't want you to pick our food. You suck at picking"
Totally understandable. I agree with you. This is why I was first confused, shocked, then saddened by the turnout of the events. Unlike what a lot of people here said(because they don't understand or know HK or been there), HKPF has one of the most professional and courteous police force in the world. (Many reasons. HKers are very demanding and educated by default and any small things can lead to complaints towards the officers, and this often can not only risk the officer's career, but also by default the HKPF had been highly trained to have very very good EQ generally, and they've been battered with so much verbal abuses these days, the same equivalent in elsewhere would've led to arrests or rude treatment). Anyways, so when people these 2 years are calling HKPF dogs or "gong 'an"(Chinese cops because it's a term associated with police state police), I would defend the HKP. All this changed 48 hours ago when HKPF started using force I felt is excessive to the situation. Of course by standards of how other police treat citizens HKPF isn't that bad, but by HK's standards where we rarely get treated this way, it's totally too much. What made it worse was that their targets are students, many of which are still in high school. Also, there are now a lot of cases of rough handling caught on video camera. If there were any skepticism of them being now rough, now it's all gone.
[Latest Update at 3:08 - Tear gas used]
I will upload this part. Next part coming up. I need to look over at the newest development. HKPF is digging themselves a deeper hole.
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
Let's just say it's gotten that bad, which is why this is happening. Plus, the other thing is, it doesn't make sense for HKers to demand reform in a future date when right now it's just been established.
Sorry but my heart had dropped with what the HKPF had just done. I have nothing to say.
Let's just say it's gotten that bad, which is why this is happening. Plus, the other thing is, it doesn't make sense for HKers to demand reform in a future date when right now it's just been established.
Sorry but my heart had dropped with what the HKPF had just done. I have nothing to say.
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
Everything.
Various attempts: Yes.
- Nationalistic Education, where they attempted to change textbook material to be more Communist-friendly and patriotic and install the curriculum.
- Article 23, which was back in 2003 which attempted to censor any material deemed unfriendly to CCP. The result led to the first July 1st March, which became almost an annual thing since.
As for fundamental mistakes, I don't even remember how many. There are just simply a lot. For recent part, CY being not accountable to HKers is the biggest thing. He basically already began to ignore what HK has to say and refused to meet with groups when he had promised all of those. And as of the latest development, people pulled up images of the past where a question was "Would you use tear gas on the people?" in which CY said No, and Henry Tang rebuked "You lied". Unfortunately Tang never became the CE because he threatened to expose the content in a backdoor meeting between senior HKSAR government staffs and CCP staffs, which led to CCP telling the special committee (election committee) to cast their votes to CY, which got his position today. And of course now this fker is using tear gas on HKers as we speak. This is the absolute fking proof WHY we hate CY, the HKSAR government, and don't want Beijing to pick our CE!
Everything.
Various attempts: Yes.
- Nationalistic Education, where they attempted to change textbook material to be more Communist-friendly and patriotic and install the curriculum.
- Article 23, which was back in 2003 which attempted to censor any material deemed unfriendly to CCP. The result led to the first July 1st March, which became almost an annual thing since.
As for fundamental mistakes, I don't even remember how many. There are just simply a lot. For recent part, CY being not accountable to HKers is the biggest thing. He basically already began to ignore what HK has to say and refused to meet with groups when he had promised all of those. And as of the latest development, people pulled up images of the past where a question was "Would you use tear gas on the people?" in which CY said No, and Henry Tang rebuked "You lied". Unfortunately Tang never became the CE because he threatened to expose the content in a backdoor meeting between senior HKSAR government staffs and CCP staffs, which led to CCP telling the special committee (election committee) to cast their votes to CY, which got his position today. And of course now this fker is using tear gas on HKers as we speak. This is the absolute fking proof WHY we hate CY, the HKSAR government, and don't want Beijing to pick our CE!
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
They had just warned they will use gun.
Guess how we HKers feel?
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Two of my friends just cried. Blitzio I'm completing my answer for you cause I want to give you the truth, even though I'm very shaken and angry right now.
I feel a lot of pain.
They had just warned they will use gun.
Guess how we HKers feel?
----------------------------------
Two of my friends just cried. Blitzio I'm completing my answer for you cause I want to give you the truth, even though I'm very shaken and angry right now.
I feel a lot of pain.
Last edited:
airsuperiority
Captain
Re: Chinese General news resource thread
News has it PLA might get deployed.
Please tell me how to feel about this.
News has it PLA might get deployed.
Please tell me how to feel about this.
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