Hitler's influence on German military defeat on the eastern front

Discussion in 'Military History' started by Richard Santos, Jan 8, 2017.

  1. taxiya
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    taxiya Senior Member
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    If I dare to interpret the two examples that you brought up (in reality, there are more such examples, such as the Baltic states), they all demonstrated what I have said.

    In the same way as the purge, the collaborators and the cause of them weakened USSR, but because of their insignificant numbers (even in Ukraine with a large population, the collaborators are mostly from the west, the east identified themselves more as Russian), they didn't make a meaningful unti-faction within USSR. Their effect is similar to the unti-Hitler Wehrmacht officers, just a bit bigger in numbers.

    One example is that Khrushchev, an Ukrainian was crucial in maintaining the USSR control on Ukraine and latter succeeded Stalin (a Georgian some of whose ethnical brothers also collaborated with Germany).

    The core of the issue is that within USSR there was no organized and unified political/ethnical faction that wanted a German win except some unorganized people who assisted Germany out of their resentment to USSR (some of their grievance are surely justified). However, without a clear vision those collaboration with the Nazi simply won't make any difference.
     
  2. Jura
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    Jura Senior Member

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    LOL recalled:
    while seeing

    [​IMG]
    a moment ago (a new map of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stavropol_Krai)

    OK it happens to shows roughly (I said roughly) how far the Germans (with Romanians) got in the southeastern direction for example in the middle-bottom close to the altitude scale is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nalchik
    then towards the Black Sea:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Elbrus#History
    etc. etc.
    LOL it also show places where they didn't get like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gagra at the seaside
     
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