Aircraft Carriers III

[TerraN_EmpirE]

LOL what for? I repeatedly saw stuff how an F-35 pilot would control several combat drones (according to me that's a way how to suffer a heart attack in the cockpit)

2 seaters are generally used for trainers and sometimes for ground attack. Especially during transitional training like say moving from an F16 to an F15.
when it comes to a single seater "controlling" drones I think that would demand AI controlled wingmen basically you don't need the second seater because even if you had one it would be just a guy sitting bored back there.
I mean it falls into a weird spot kinda like what the Russians though of doing very early in the Mig 25. Where they thought the second seater was going to be a General directing the whole Air war.

 

[Jura The idiot]

2 seaters are generally used for trainers and sometimes for ground attack. Especially during transitional training like say moving from an F16 to an F15.
when it comes to a single seater "controlling" drones I think that would demand AI controlled wingmen basically you don't need the second seater because even if you had one it would be just a guy sitting bored back there.
I mean it falls into a weird spot kinda like what the Russians though of doing very early in the Mig 25. Where they thought the second seater was going to be a General directing the whole Air war.

16 minutes ago I meant something like this (quoting from

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):

AFRL LCAAT project manager Bill Baron was quoted by the Dayton Daily News as saying: "If you team up a bunch of these aircraft with an F-35 or an F-22, or some of our surveillance assets, you'd basically be able to cover more space at a lower cost point.

"In a lot of cases, we don't have enough airplanes and, as you look to the future, our fleet sizes are most likely going to continue to be more limited so this is a way to provide a force multiplier."

would likely kill "an F-35 or an F-22" pilot due to his/her stress level in combat

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

Well Jura right now, yes because the only way to control a drone is either scripted where you plan ut the mission before it happens and the drone does only the script. or Remote where basically the Cockpit and the plane are separated by a thousand miles and a satcom.
What they are talking about is AI control where the unmanned aircraft flies and operates itself. Where the Pilot is an AI who takes orders from the manned aircraft.

 

[Jura The idiot]

Well Jura right now, yes because the only way to control a drone is either scripted where you plan ut the mission before it happens and the drone does only the script. or Remote where basically the Cockpit and the plane are separated by a thousand miles and a satcom.
What they are talking about is AI control where the unmanned aircraft flies and operates itself. Where the Pilot is an AI who takes orders from the manned aircraft.

LOL I'm too old for this (and don't believe a ... in the AI part)

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

I know Jura, I know. But that's the only way those Drone proponents can get there dreams. Otherwise It would have to be Controlled by a remote station. There is no other option and Remote stations limit what the Drone can do.

 

[Jura The idiot]

I know Jura, I know. But that's the only way those Drone proponents can get there dreams. ...

yeah, instead of dreaming I wait for the new DOT&E report on how F-35 is doing

 

[FORBIN]

The preferred sqn size for UK F-35Bs has been set at 12 for over ten years now. There are no twin seat Lightnings, training will be conducted on simulators,- both QECs will have two simulators aboard ship linked to a flyco simulator so sorties can be practiced before taking off. Similarly there will be simulators at the Lightning's home base at RAF Marham to compensate for the lack of two-seaters. 12 aircraft sqns have been calculated as necessary to provide a round the clock two aircraft CAP for air defence as well as a standby small anti ship strike package and one or two aircraft in maintenance at any given time. As a basic force protection and limited strike capability a single sqn of 12 packs a hefty punch, which is why most Naval Harrier operators go with it as the model. View attachment 44964 View attachment 44965

In the Sea Harrier days the RN originally went with 5 aircraft sqns (two CAPs alternating between high readiness deck alert and 30 minute readiness as back up and a fifth aircraft as a spare). Five aircraft was seen as the minimum needed to provide a credible 'Hack the Shad' capability (interception of a shadowing Russian Bomber in the North Atlantic) without arousing the suspicion of the RAF that the RN was getting back into the carrier game properly, but the plan was always to boost the numbers of SHARs in the frontline sqns in time of war using pilots crews and airframes from the headquarters sqn (899NAS), which always had 12 aircraft on strength and more pilots than planes (the frontline sqns had five aircraft each but about 8 or pilots so airframes could spend more time in the air after a given pilot had reached his maximum hours for the day). This plan was carried out in 82 when 899 gave up seven aircraft and pilots to 800NAS aboard Hermes and three more to 801 aboard Invincible. The remaining four aircraft plus four more drawn from storage were used to stand up a third frontline sqn, 809NAS which flew down to the Task Force a few weeks later and on arrival reinforced the other two sqns, four each to 800 and 801. After the war plans were announced to increase sqn size in peacetime to 8 aircraft each but this was done incrementally over a couple of years. Other Harrier operators such as Spain and Italy went with the twelve aircraft sqn size from the start to get maximum 'bang for buck', mainly because they didn't have historic opposition from their Air Force to deal with.View attachment 44966

Thank you and yes logic 12 for the rest rare infos !

currently no Fifth gens have 2 seaters. F22 Originally planed a F22B but it was cut to reduce cost this got carried over into F35.
The Russians and Chinese followed suit in SU57 and J20 then again J31. The Indians In their bid for HAL FGFA wanted 2 seaters but so far Vaperwear. The Israelis for a time talked about looking into a 2 seater F35 variant but again nothing yet.

Indeed and possible now 2 seaters no longer needed ? no sure remains interesting have 2 crewmens especialy for A2G missions 4 eyes to look around... the driver can be very busy i know it is an advantage for Mirage 2000D or N but with super technology which is not always perfect ... ! maybe later a driver can to be really sufficient ?

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

The main use of 2 seaters is transitional training moving from one fighter to another, Somewhere along the lines the powers that be decided to go single seater only.

 

[FORBIN]

The main use of 2 seaters is transitional training moving from one fighter to another, Somewhere along the lines the powers that be decided to go single seater only.

And for nuclear missions more safe with 2 mens as for Bombers i am difficult i know
The 2 Rafale French Sqns ( for soon again one with Mirage 2000N K3 for few months ) have only 2 seaters

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

And for nuclear missions more safe with 2 mens as for Bombers i am difficult i know
The 2 Rafale French Sqns ( for soon again one with Mirage 2000N K3 for few months ) have only 2 seaters

F35 is unlikely to be tasked with such a mission by the US, As that will more likely fall to US Bombers. off the list of Nuclear powers who have F35 I think that's nly the US and UK both tend to give the mission to other systems the US Silos, SSBN, B1, B2, B21, B52, F15E. The UK SSBN.