KJ-600 carrierborne AEWC thread
- Thread starter Blitzo
- Start date
The weight itself is irrelevant. It is about acceleration and minimum flying speed.
The size of the aircraft is limited, see E-2 that has smaller wing span than civilian turbo props of similar take off weight. But you can go to stronger engines and you can use contra-rotating props as we saw on Yak-44. You can connect the engines on both sides as is used in V-22 - engine failure is an important design case. It is entirely possible to design such an aircraft for use over a ski ramp.
SamuraiBlue
Captain
@delft
Weight and acceleration has a close relationship since the lighter the weight the better acceleration with the same engine. The engine itself has a relationship as same with drag and lift.
At the end I doubt a very heavy plane is able to take off from a ski ramp since it will not able to accelerate fast enough to reach minimum speed due to limit in the engine.
Weight and acceleration has a close relationship since the lighter the weight the better acceleration with the same engine. The engine itself has a relationship as same with drag and lift.
At the end I doubt a very heavy plane is able to take off from a ski ramp since it will not able to accelerate fast enough to reach minimum speed due to limit in the engine.
Your doubt is based on ignorance.
SamuraiBlue
Captain
Saw what you want.
Basically it's your words against mine without any empirical evidence to prove one way or the other.
Ya, and money grow on trees. You know maintenance cost a lot of money right? Building the logistical train jist for a one-of-a-kind is rather stupid
There is no empirical evidence but a simple simulation will show that it is possible and there is the story a few years back that Northrop-Grumman told the Indian navy that E-2D might operate from Vikramaditya.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Henri K take on the sudden appearance of Y7J model First the back ground article and the latest progress
Background from 2015
Recently have appeared on Chinese sites of artists' views of what could be the future AWACS embarked on Chinese aircraft carriers:
The Chinese AWACS? Note the counter-rotating propellers
2015 July: the AWACS development program embarked on at least the pre-study stage, according to an article in the Anshun Municipality. Its development is led by the Institute 603 in Xi'an, the AVIC group, the same engineering as the fighter-bomber JH-7 or the transport plane Y-20 . (See Hu Jianxing)
Another artist's view
It was learned in July 2015 that the on-board AWACS development program had at least passed the pre-study stage, according to an article from the Anshun Municipality. Its development is led by the 603 Institute in Xi'an, of the AVIC group, whose official name is now First Aircraft Institute of AVIC; It is intended for the design of civil and military aircraft of medium or large size (ground attack, bombers, civil aircraft, transport planes, special aircraft); He will conceive in particular the Y-7, the JH-7, the Xiaoying-500, the KJ-1.
A small retrospective of the AWACS
2005, Vice Premier Wu Bangguo in front of an embedded AWACS model
In April 2005, a photo published shows Vice Premier Wu Bangguo visiting the 603 Institute: a model similar to the Grumann S-2 Tracker with a rotodome and a large cooling inlet above the fuselage, two turboprop engines with propellers 6 bladed leaves foreshadow the development of AEW / AWACS based on an aircraft carrier (Richard Fisher, Jr., 2005: " a Turning Point for China's aircraft carrier Ambitions" ).
To be usable on an aircraft carrier, the wings must be foldable and the tailplane and fuselage smaller than those of the Y-7. It is thought at the time that the radar is a smaller version of the KJ-2000 with three AESA antennas in the fixed rotodome providing 360 ° coverage, probably developed by the Nanjing Research Institute of Electronic Technology (CETC 14th Institute ).
In 2009, an article in a magazine from China's Northwestern University shows wind tunnel studies of the Sukhoi S-80 Russian short-bomber take-off device modified in AWACS version with either a rotodome or a fairing like the KJ- 200; We know that since 2006, several countries including China had expressed interested in this unit ( Air International , August 2006: "Pre-series Su-80GP First Flight" ) and that contacts had been made for the creation of a Joint venture for the assembly of this device in China. There will be no follow-up.
In January 2009, show three photos of an airborne AWACS in an and that looks like an E-2 in its first versions (with only two vertical fins instead of four in Recent versions).
AWACS airborne (unverifiable authenticity)
Rumors from September 2010 show a prototype built by the 603 Institute and the Xian Aircraft Company - XAC (Factory 172) tested at the Chinese Flight Test Evaluation in Yanliang and equipped with 4 vertical drifts and in April 2011 Appear the first photos.
AWACS version of the Y-7 transport aircraft
In January 2012, Cao Chen, the deputy chief designer of the ZDK-03 radar, announces that the first Chinese embedded AWACS could be developed from a Y-7 in an interview granted magazine "Weapon's Knowledge" , Confirming the rumors that circulated until then. He adds that the components of the radar (microprocessors, amplifiers ...) as well as data processing software are all of Chinese origin.
It is likely that the Y-7 was used as a test platform for the development of radar and probably was not envisaged as a platform directly usable on the Liaoning, the ground height with the drift being 8, 85m while that of the Northrop Grumman E-2 Hawkeye with its typical empennage is only 5.58m.
The modifications that will be made to the Y-7 in order to adapt it to the specificities of the carriers will lead to a demonstrator, the JZY-01.
It should be noted that Institute 38 of the ECCC envisaged a version of the Y-7 with an AESA beam radar "Balance Beam"
Background from 2015
Recently have appeared on Chinese sites of artists' views of what could be the future AWACS embarked on Chinese aircraft carriers:
The Chinese AWACS? Note the counter-rotating propellers
2015 July: the AWACS development program embarked on at least the pre-study stage, according to an article in the Anshun Municipality. Its development is led by the Institute 603 in Xi'an, the AVIC group, the same engineering as the fighter-bomber JH-7 or the transport plane Y-20 . (See Hu Jianxing)
Another artist's view
It was learned in July 2015 that the on-board AWACS development program had at least passed the pre-study stage, according to an article from the Anshun Municipality. Its development is led by the 603 Institute in Xi'an, of the AVIC group, whose official name is now First Aircraft Institute of AVIC; It is intended for the design of civil and military aircraft of medium or large size (ground attack, bombers, civil aircraft, transport planes, special aircraft); He will conceive in particular the Y-7, the JH-7, the Xiaoying-500, the KJ-1.
A small retrospective of the AWACS
2005, Vice Premier Wu Bangguo in front of an embedded AWACS model
In April 2005, a photo published shows Vice Premier Wu Bangguo visiting the 603 Institute: a model similar to the Grumann S-2 Tracker with a rotodome and a large cooling inlet above the fuselage, two turboprop engines with propellers 6 bladed leaves foreshadow the development of AEW / AWACS based on an aircraft carrier (Richard Fisher, Jr., 2005: " a Turning Point for China's aircraft carrier Ambitions" ).
To be usable on an aircraft carrier, the wings must be foldable and the tailplane and fuselage smaller than those of the Y-7. It is thought at the time that the radar is a smaller version of the KJ-2000 with three AESA antennas in the fixed rotodome providing 360 ° coverage, probably developed by the Nanjing Research Institute of Electronic Technology (CETC 14th Institute ).
In 2009, an article in a magazine from China's Northwestern University shows wind tunnel studies of the Sukhoi S-80 Russian short-bomber take-off device modified in AWACS version with either a rotodome or a fairing like the KJ- 200; We know that since 2006, several countries including China had expressed interested in this unit ( Air International , August 2006: "Pre-series Su-80GP First Flight" ) and that contacts had been made for the creation of a Joint venture for the assembly of this device in China. There will be no follow-up.
In January 2009, show three photos of an airborne AWACS in an and that looks like an E-2 in its first versions (with only two vertical fins instead of four in Recent versions).
AWACS airborne (unverifiable authenticity)
Rumors from September 2010 show a prototype built by the 603 Institute and the Xian Aircraft Company - XAC (Factory 172) tested at the Chinese Flight Test Evaluation in Yanliang and equipped with 4 vertical drifts and in April 2011 Appear the first photos.
AWACS version of the Y-7 transport aircraft
In January 2012, Cao Chen, the deputy chief designer of the ZDK-03 radar, announces that the first Chinese embedded AWACS could be developed from a Y-7 in an interview granted magazine "Weapon's Knowledge" , Confirming the rumors that circulated until then. He adds that the components of the radar (microprocessors, amplifiers ...) as well as data processing software are all of Chinese origin.
It is likely that the Y-7 was used as a test platform for the development of radar and probably was not envisaged as a platform directly usable on the Liaoning, the ground height with the drift being 8, 85m while that of the Northrop Grumman E-2 Hawkeye with its typical empennage is only 5.58m.
The modifications that will be made to the Y-7 in order to adapt it to the specificities of the carriers will lead to a demonstrator, the JZY-01.
It should be noted that Institute 38 of the ECCC envisaged a version of the Y-7 with an AESA beam radar "Balance Beam"
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
The latest Update 2017 Jan. According to Henri the model is similar to E2C but it is not It is indigenous AEW. Wow with Chinese new year we have bumper harvest of new technology revelation
Last year had spoken here of , including studies conducted by industry so far and some prototypes were built. One of them would be at an advanced stage of development today and testing could have started, if we believe in the last elements made public.
In a text to express Chinese New Year wishes, the CAEIT Institute of the Chinese electronics group CETC has published a photo of an AWACS development team, in which the model of an AWACS embarked, next to that of ZDK-03 sold in Pakistan. The ECCC is the main supplier of electronic equipment, including AWACS radars, for the Chinese Army.
A model of AWACS embedded in the AWACS development office of the CAEIT Institute (Source: ECCC)
The appliance model shows many similarities with the American AWACS embedded E-2C , with a vertical tail to four planes and two turbo to 8 blades.
Because of the turbulence generated by the radome and its support on the back of an AWACS, the longitudinal stabilizing capacity of the conventional vertical tailplane is greatly reduced. To remedy this problem, engineers can increase the height (in height or width) of the empennage in question so that the latter "exits" the zone of influence of the turbulences. This is the solution chosen by the Yak-44 , AWACS board who should join the Soviet Ulyanovsk class aircraft carrier.
However, in the case of modern AWACS, which must enter the hangar of an aircraft carrier where every meter is precious, increasing size is not an ideal solution, and it is for this reason That the E-2 for example, and now the Chinese, have chosen a better compromise which consists of multiplying the number of vertical planes.
In this regard, the Institute of AVIC Xi'an 603 Group, designer of many Chinese military aircraft such as fighter-bomber JH-7 and the transport aircraft Y-20 , tabled in November 2013 a patent on a new Vertical 4-plane tailplane to meet the needs of an on-board AWACS that must be able to take off in strong lateral winds, to land at low speed and at high incidence, and to continue flying with the loss of one of the two engines.
One can notice its difference with the same type of vertical empennage of the American E-2C. This is probably due to a different design of the radome, the support and the cell of the aircraft.
The vertical tail of the E-2C (left) and that of the Chinese design.
Apart from these two institutional elements, a photo taken by a spotter in Wuhan shows that a new model is now on the deck of the "concrete carrier". The latter is a platform of simulation of electromagnetic compatibility of the Institute 701 of the Chinese naval group CSIC.
On the concrete aircraft carrier of the 701 Institute in Wuhan is a new AWACS embedded model.
We can see in this picture the presence of three models, those of the onboard fighter J-15 , the naval helicopter Z-18 , and on-board AWACS.
The latter, which resembles the demonstrator JZY-01 built by the Institute and the XAC 603 in 2005, measures at least within 18 meters if we take the Z-18 on the side as a reference.
The Embedded AWACS Demonstrator JZY-01
The appearance of this model suggests that the 701 Institute, the designer of the 3rd Chinese carrier, would have started the electromagnetic compatibility tests with all the devices that could be on the Chinese CATOBAR.
Note that the first catapult launch tests, steam and electromagnetic (EMALS), have already begun to naval aviation training center in Xingcheng, led by the staff of the Chinese navy (see our article " "of November).
Finally, another patent filed by the Institute 603 of AVIC in May 2016 on ( "drop test" in English), seems to prove that the development of Chinese new board AWACS would be entered In the advanced testing phase.
The video below illustrates several "drop tests" of different aircraft:
In summary, with these new data to the radar operator (the group CAEIT Institute ECCC), the manufacturer (the Insitute 603 of AVIC Group) and the designer of the first Chinese aircraft prote catobar Type 002 (Institute 701 CSIC group), there is reason to believe that the new Chinese AWACS, destined for the 3rd Chinese aircraft carrier whose construction is in full preparation, will not be long to show itself to the public. It is estimated that its development should end no later than 2021 or 2022, when Type 002 will be delivered to the Chinese Navy.
To be continued.
Henri K.
Last year had spoken here of , including studies conducted by industry so far and some prototypes were built. One of them would be at an advanced stage of development today and testing could have started, if we believe in the last elements made public.
In a text to express Chinese New Year wishes, the CAEIT Institute of the Chinese electronics group CETC has published a photo of an AWACS development team, in which the model of an AWACS embarked, next to that of ZDK-03 sold in Pakistan. The ECCC is the main supplier of electronic equipment, including AWACS radars, for the Chinese Army.
A model of AWACS embedded in the AWACS development office of the CAEIT Institute (Source: ECCC)
The appliance model shows many similarities with the American AWACS embedded E-2C , with a vertical tail to four planes and two turbo to 8 blades.
Because of the turbulence generated by the radome and its support on the back of an AWACS, the longitudinal stabilizing capacity of the conventional vertical tailplane is greatly reduced. To remedy this problem, engineers can increase the height (in height or width) of the empennage in question so that the latter "exits" the zone of influence of the turbulences. This is the solution chosen by the Yak-44 , AWACS board who should join the Soviet Ulyanovsk class aircraft carrier.
However, in the case of modern AWACS, which must enter the hangar of an aircraft carrier where every meter is precious, increasing size is not an ideal solution, and it is for this reason That the E-2 for example, and now the Chinese, have chosen a better compromise which consists of multiplying the number of vertical planes.
In this regard, the Institute of AVIC Xi'an 603 Group, designer of many Chinese military aircraft such as fighter-bomber JH-7 and the transport aircraft Y-20 , tabled in November 2013 a patent on a new Vertical 4-plane tailplane to meet the needs of an on-board AWACS that must be able to take off in strong lateral winds, to land at low speed and at high incidence, and to continue flying with the loss of one of the two engines.
One can notice its difference with the same type of vertical empennage of the American E-2C. This is probably due to a different design of the radome, the support and the cell of the aircraft.
The vertical tail of the E-2C (left) and that of the Chinese design.
Apart from these two institutional elements, a photo taken by a spotter in Wuhan shows that a new model is now on the deck of the "concrete carrier". The latter is a platform of simulation of electromagnetic compatibility of the Institute 701 of the Chinese naval group CSIC.
On the concrete aircraft carrier of the 701 Institute in Wuhan is a new AWACS embedded model.
We can see in this picture the presence of three models, those of the onboard fighter J-15 , the naval helicopter Z-18 , and on-board AWACS.
The latter, which resembles the demonstrator JZY-01 built by the Institute and the XAC 603 in 2005, measures at least within 18 meters if we take the Z-18 on the side as a reference.
The Embedded AWACS Demonstrator JZY-01
The appearance of this model suggests that the 701 Institute, the designer of the 3rd Chinese carrier, would have started the electromagnetic compatibility tests with all the devices that could be on the Chinese CATOBAR.
Note that the first catapult launch tests, steam and electromagnetic (EMALS), have already begun to naval aviation training center in Xingcheng, led by the staff of the Chinese navy (see our article " "of November).
Finally, another patent filed by the Institute 603 of AVIC in May 2016 on ( "drop test" in English), seems to prove that the development of Chinese new board AWACS would be entered In the advanced testing phase.
The video below illustrates several "drop tests" of different aircraft:
In summary, with these new data to the radar operator (the group CAEIT Institute ECCC), the manufacturer (the Insitute 603 of AVIC Group) and the designer of the first Chinese aircraft prote catobar Type 002 (Institute 701 CSIC group), there is reason to believe that the new Chinese AWACS, destined for the 3rd Chinese aircraft carrier whose construction is in full preparation, will not be long to show itself to the public. It is estimated that its development should end no later than 2021 or 2022, when Type 002 will be delivered to the Chinese Navy.
To be continued.
Henri K.
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