F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread

[Jura The idiot]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

There's been an interesting discussion of "F-35 jamming" in another thread http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/world-armed-forces/indian-military-news-ii-99-5934.html#post317676 and http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/world-armed-forces/indian-military-news-ii-99-5934.html#post317747 but I don't know want to think about it so now I did a google search, found, read:

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(dated 1 August 2014)

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(April 29, 2014)
and two years old summary

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[Jeff Head]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

There's been an interesting discussion of "F-35 jamming" in another thread http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/world-armed-forces/indian-military-news-ii-99-5934.html#post317676 and http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/world-armed-forces/indian-military-news-ii-99-5934.html#post317747 but I don't know want to think about it

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(April 29, 2014)

and two years old summary

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As I have indicated numerous times.

The F-35 is a major, complex program. The people working on it have not forgotten anything and they are not screwing up by the numbers.

Since is it the largest defense contract in history, there are ample naysayers both within the US and without, and they will be making noise for many years...as they have already done.

But, it will come forward, and they will bring state of the art capabilities into it as they move forward and achieve the various milestones.

Will there be hick-ups and hold ups? Yes, absolutely. Any such program has them.

Will the issues be identified and resolved? Yes they will...some perhaps sooner than others, but...mark my words... in the end, the F-35 is going to be the most prolific 5th generation aircraft produced and will be used to unbelievably good effect by many nations.

 

[A Bar Brother]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

As I have indicated numerous times.

The F-35 is a major, complex program. The people working on it have not forgotten anything and they are not screwing up by the numbers.

Since is it the largest defense contract in history, there are ample naysayers both within the US and without, and they will be making noise for many years...as they have already done.

But, it will come forward, and they will bring state of the art capabilities into it as they move forward and achieve the various milestones.

Will there be hick-ups and hold ups? Yes, absolutely. Any such program has them.

Will the issues be identified and resolved? Yes they will...some perhaps sooner than others, but...mark my words... in the end, the F-35 is going to be the most prolific 5th generation aircraft produced and will be used to unbelievably good effect by many nations.

NGJ has been indefinitely deferred for the F-35, so the jamming capabilities are quite limited on the F-35, and the NGJ is not available for export AFAIK. It shouldn't end up being a situation where only the US forces end up with an active cancellation kit in their F-35s while the partners and exports customers are asked to bugger off, "Be happy with what you got, chums!" kinda situation.

 

[Jeff Head]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

NGJ has been indefinitely deferred for the F-35, so the jamming capabilities are quite limited on the F-35, and the NGJ is not available for export AFAIK. It shouldn't end up being a situation where only the US forces end up with an active cancellation kit in their F-35s while the partners and exports customers are asked to bugger off, "Be happy with what you got, chums!" kinda situation.

Look, Bar, as I have said, the program moves forward and the issues will be addressed. In the end, despite all of the hoopla, the number of nations who will buy and use the F-35 will speak for itself...whether you agree with it, or like it, or not.

There's always those who think they have found the chink in the armor and the golden bullet...but my own experience tells me that the people involved in these programs are not forgetting anything and they are far more plugged in than we are.

Over the last while I have noticed that for some reason you seem compelled to continually interject these barbs like "bugger off," "chums," etc. They are uncalled for and un-needed.

My advise? If you hope to remain long here on SD, you'd best tone it down and stick with the technical issues and reasoned arguments and leave the bias and animus aside.

 

[A Bar Brother]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Look, Bar, as I have said, the program moves forward and the issues will be addressed. In the end, despite all of the hoopla, the number of nations who will buy and use the F-35 will speak for itself...whether you agree with it, or like it, or not.

There's always those who think they have found the chink in the armor and the golden bullet...but my own experience tells me that the people involved in these programs are not forgetting anything and they are far more plugged in than we are.

Everybody is forced to work with a budget, Jeff. The F-35 that is to be ready by 2021 was supposed to be available in 2012.
What the F-35 should have been by 2021 in a perfect world is different from what it will be by then.

You see, the F-35 is no doubt a good aircraft, and I want to see the F-35B/C in the Indian Navy. You will have to excuse me if I think it is inadequate in its current avatar. The Israelis wanted their own ECM kit on their version for very good reason.

Over the last while I have noticed that for some reason you seem compelled to continually interject these barbs like "bugger off," "chums," etc. They are uncalled for and un-needed.

This is my first time using these terms. I will keep that in mind though.

 

[A Bar Brother]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Jeff, the Indian Navy has its eyes on the F-35.

We may see a new tender or a direct FMS purchase once the clearance is given by the Indian MoD. They are waiting for the IAF Rafale deal to be signed before starting a new program.

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"We have received the Request for Information (RFI) from the Navy seeking information about the F-35 aircraft, which are capable of taking off from aircraft carriers. We are going to offer our aircraft to them," Lockheed Martin vice president Orville Prins said.

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. According to Pentagon acquisitions Chief Ashton Carter, “there is nothing on our side, no principle which bars […] Indian participation in the Joint Strike Fighter. The decision to pursue the F-35 is India’s alone”.

We are looking at acquiring 80 aircraft (the numbers may have changed since 2009). If it goes through the FMS route, then the F-35 will be purchased directly. But more likely it will be a tender, and the F-35B/C and Rafale-M will face off in a new contest. If the SH production line continues to remain active until early next decade, we may see another serious participant.

I suppose that answers your question on why I am interested in a Rafale/F-35 comparison.
Maybe there should be one since these two aircraft are the only ones available for CATOBAR carrier operations.

 

[HMS Astute]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

 

[Brumby]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

NGJ has been indefinitely deferred for the F-35, so the jamming capabilities are quite limited on the F-35, and the NGJ is not available for export AFAIK. It shouldn't end up being a situation where only the US forces end up with an active cancellation kit in their F-35s while the partners and exports customers are asked to bugger off, "Be happy with what you got, chums!" kinda situation.

Conversation about the F-35 can be frustrating or misdirected for at least three reasons; (i) its capabilities are classified; (ii) tactical use are borne out of capabilities and likely different from expectation; and (iii) misplacement in comparison. For example; the jamming capabilities in the F-35 is a by product of the AESA fit out unlike a dedicated jamming pod which has wider spectrum and strength. The piece we don't know and I am speculating here is that its jamming capability may be amplified when used in a group through fusion nodes effectively demonstrating the sum is greater than the parts. This same reasoning also extends to enhanced mapping fidelity and greater theatre threat warning capabilities for the group in a battlefield. Its value I suspect will be demonstrated when it fights the next war and not the way we think how it will fight the last one. When you think of the F-35 in light of :
(a) Fusion capabilities compressing decision cycles;
(b) Mapping fidelity amplification for awareness, threat identification and prioritisation
(c) Hub and spoke web extensions opportunities when used in conjunction with UAV
they open up many new ways to fight a future war.

 

[A Bar Brother]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

Conversation about the F-35 can be frustrating or misdirected for at least three reasons; (i) its capabilities are classified; (ii) tactical use are borne out of capabilities and likely different from expectation; and (iii) misplacement in comparison. For example; the jamming capabilities in the F-35 is a by product of the AESA fit out unlike a dedicated jamming pod which has wider spectrum and strength. The piece we don't know and I am speculating here is that its jamming capability may be amplified when used in a group through fusion nodes effectively demonstrating the sum is greater than the parts. This same reasoning also extends to enhanced mapping fidelity and greater theatre threat warning capabilities for the group in a battlefield. Its value I suspect will be demonstrated when it fights the next war and not the way we think how it will fight the last one. When you think of the F-35 in light of :
(a) Fusion capabilities compressing decision cycles;
(b) Mapping fidelity amplification for awareness, threat identification and prioritisation
(c) Hub and spoke web extensions opportunities when used in conjunction with UAV
they open up many new ways to fight a future war.

This is not restricted to the F-35 alone.

The F-35's jamming and cyberwarfare capabilities is restricted in the X band, and in the frontal sector. This capability exceeded expectations in 2012, nobody else had it. But by 2021... that's questionable at best.

The F-35 is working on, what is now, a very limited and tightly scrutinized budget. It may already be facing obsolescence pressures without LM having to request new schedule for more advanced systems. The NGJ has been deferred due to costs. The US feels the Growler with the NGJ is more than enough for now. And VLO is moving into active stealth technologies. That makes the F-35 inadequate today.

Don't get me wrong. The US forces will adapt around the F-35's current flaws relatively quickly, but export customers will not be able to in the short term, and the East Asian front is where the F-35 may feel the most threatened.

 

[FORBIN]

Re: F-35 Joint Strike Fighter Thread

61th FS, OCU based to Luke get now 14 F-35A, 16 for end of year in march had received the first.

And first flight for CF-19 to Ft Worth LM factory.