East China Sea Air Defense ID Zone

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Jeff Head

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"By shutting the door on communication, Japan once again puts the security of its citizens at stake, asking Japanese airlines not to report flight information to Chinese authorities as required," she added.
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Actually, this is not so. Airliners, flying normal civilian air routes are typically not required to adhere to ADIZs. Other nation's are not required by international law to adhere to such zones in international air space. It is their choice. How China reacts to non-compliance is its choice.

As I have said numerous times, these zones are generally established to find, monitor, warn off and intercept air craft who fly aggressive, provocative flight profiles towards another nation's air space, and particularly any sensitive areas.

As long as other nation's keep away from that, they should be fine. I do not believe it is China's intent to create international incidents.

If an aircraft has troubles and is forced to seek the nearest land, they would be contacting others any way they can, and broadcasting international Maydays.

Finally, port-08, I have asked you to read the forum rules. Clearly you have not done so. The rules clearly state:

Forum Rules said:
The colors RED, BROWN, & BLUE are for the exclusive use of moderators!! If you want to make a point use some other color or bold print. Do not increase the FONT size or use bold text exclusively.

Read the rules and adhere to them. Doing so will indicate you are interested in participating and contributing to the forum. Not doing so, will indicate you are not interested in that.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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Within Japanese territorial airspace in which Japan does not accept it to be disputed, Japan will shoot if PLAAF fighters does not comply. This is an act of self defense and is within our sovereign rights. This has not changed whether PRC declares an ADIZ or not.
Declaring an ADIZ does not change that situation.

So war, then? Just to hold up the insistence that those islands are undisputed?

Well it seems Japan has really talked itself into a corner these last few years. What a shame. Things might have been resolved more amicably if Japan was willing to sit at the negotiating table. Of course that requires a recognition that the islands are disputed in the first place.
 

jobjed

Captain
Within Japanese territorial airspace in which Japan does not accept it to be disputed, Japan will shoot if PLAAF fighters does not comply. This is an act of self defense and is within our sovereign rights. This has not changed whether PRC declares an ADIZ or not.
Declaring an ADIZ does not change that situation.

I dare the JASDF to "try" shooting down PLAAF aircraft over Diaoyu airspace. I DOUBLE dare them to. There would be more SRBMs and IRBMs landing on JSDF bases than there are planes in the JASDF inventory.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
xiabonan said:
Guys there's really no point in posting inflammatory comments.

Great advise, xiabonan, and you are right.

Posters need to stop the talk about each side shooting down the other side's aircraft. Can the dare's to try. Can the flame baiting and accusations thereof. If the thread descends into more of this, it will be temporarily closed. If things do not cool off thereafter, it will be permanently closed.

Guys, we are bigger than this. We do not have to devolve into a war of words, and emotional or purely nationalistic rants at one another. It's not what SD is about.

We can professionally discuss the military technology, the refueling and patrolling tactics, the intent of the ADIZ, how ADIZs are meant to operate, and the various civil options that each side has with respect to them.

Clearly, if a nation sends in aircraft to attack China, China will defend itself. These zones are really established to allow China or any other country to not be caught flat footed if someone tried that...or tried to enter their soverign air space and spy on or do surveillance on them.

Let's stay cool headed ourselves and wait and see how it pans out for the islands.

I personally believe cool heads in the military will prevail and that short of some one locking someone else up, or firing missiles at each other, that what it will develop into is each side simply keeping a close eye on each other there, while elsewhere, things will settle down.

But no more inflammatory, provocative, or war talk. Okay?.
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
Within Japanese territorial airspace in which Japan does not accept it to be disputed, Japan will shoot if PLAAF fighters does not comply. This is an act of self defense and is within our sovereign rights. This has not changed whether PRC declares an ADIZ or not.
Declaring an ADIZ does not change that situation.

Japan firing the first shot isn't likely because it doesn't want war with China, or anyone else for that matter, and it's not sure if the US would come to its aid if it started the fifth Sino-Japanese war.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
A few more details regarding the intercepted aircraft.

It would be nice if they published photo, just to parallel Japanese ADIZ norms.


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Jets scrambled over ADIZ
Global Times | 2013-11-30 0:48:02
By Yang Jingjie and Sun Xiaobo

The People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force Friday scrambled fighter jets to identify US and Japanese military aircraft in China's newly established Air Defense Identification Zone (ADIZ) over the East China Sea.

According to a statement posted on the website of China's defense ministry, Shen Jinke, spokesperson of the Air Force, said fighter jets including Su-30 and J-11 were scrambled Friday morning to the zone. The Chinese jets identified two US reconnaissance aircraft, a P-3 and an EP-3, as well as 10 Japanese jets coming in seven batches, including the models E-767, P-3 and F-15.

Shen said the PLA Air Force has been working with the PLA Navy to monitor the entire process of foreign military jets' entering of the ADIZ and identify them in a timely manner.

Friday's mission by Chinese fighter jets realized China's regular and effective monitoring and control of the ADIZ, said the air force spokesperson.

It was the second time that China announced its fighter jet mission in the ADIZ since two unarmed US B-52 bombers flew into the zone without notifying China on Tuesday, after which China's defense military said in a statement that it had monitored the whole process.

Following the US defiance, aircraft from the South Korean military and Japanese coast guard and military made similar moves.

On Thursday, the PLA Air Force sent several fighter jets and an early warning plane to patrol the zone.

Li Jie, a military expert, told the Global Times on Friday that the PLA Air Force's announcement of Friday's mission is a response adjusted according to recent occurrences.

"It is nothing new that foreign aircraft such as US EP-3 scout planes fly close to China and we think it is unnecessary to release what we have monitored every time, by which we mean to save some face for these countries," Li said.

"But given the defiant moves from the US and Japan in the past week, we announced their intrusions to warn other countries, particularly the US and Japan, that China has the capability and techniques to monitor their moves within the zone and they may not act too aggressively," he said.

Regarding the PLA Air Force's patrol in the ADIZ, Qin Gang, China's foreign ministry spokesperson, Friday told a regular press briefing that planes from the Air Force have the right to patrol in the zone in light of the need of air defense.

Qin said China's armed forces shoulder the mission of protecting the country and safeguarding peace, noting that the armed forces are permanently on a state of high alert, the Xinhua News Agency reported.

Meanwhile, the US and Japan went ahead with a massive naval exercise, AnnualEx 2013, with the USS George Washington, a 90,000-ton Nimitz-class aircraft carrier, patrolling waters off the island of Okinawa, CNN reported.

The drill involves dozens of warships, submarines and aircraft from the US Navy's 7th Fleet and the Japan Maritime Self Defense Force, according to CNN.

CNN quoted the US Navy as saying that the drill aims to provide a stern test of their ability to effectively and mutually respond to the defense of Japan or to a regional crisis or contingency situation in the Indo-Asia-Pacific region.

"Our operations in the East China Sea will continue as they always have," Vice Admiral Robert Thomas, commander of the US 7th Fleet, told reporters Thursday, when asked about China's ADIZ, the Asahi Shimbun reported.

According to the report, commenting on China's ADIZ, Vice Admiral Yasushi Matsushita, commander of the Self Defense Fleet, said, "While we will have to be more cautious than before, I do not believe we have to limit our activities."




So they clearly have the capability to carry out a large number of interceptions and at last identifications.
Anyone who still think the B-52 incursion was a "challenge" clearly didn't realize how they were barely in the ADIZ in the first place, and it was a Chinese choice to not bother intercepting them rather than an incapability.

Now with over a dozen Japanese/US aircraft entering the ADIZ in a day all IDed or intercepted, it's obvious the PLAAF and PLANAF can do its interception duties. So anyone still harping on about the B-52s are basically playing a broken record.
 

A.Man

Major
Within Japanese territorial airspace in which Japan does not accept it to be disputed, Japan will shoot if PLAAF fighters does not comply. This is an act of self defense and is within our sovereign rights. This has not changed whether PRC declares an ADIZ or not.
Declaring an ADIZ does not change that situation.

This is the readiness of Chinese Air Force:

[video=youtube;mFNq_HXFqlY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFNq_HXFqlY[/video]

[video]今日关注 《今日关注》 20131111 [/video]
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
The problem with Global Times is it's a propaganda organ of the CCP, therefore lacks credibility as a free and unbiased Press.
 

SamuraiBlue

Captain
Japan firing the first shot isn't likely because it doesn't want war with China, or anyone else for that matter, and it's not sure if the US would come to its aid if it started the fifth Sino-Japanese war.

It's about defending sovereign rights. If PLAAF fighter planes flew within Japanese territorial air space and does not adhere and comply various warning to move away from territorial air space then that would be considered as a military provocation by the PLAAF in which at that point it doesn't matter who shot the first shot.
Basically PLAAF declared war at the point of not complying to warnings signaled out by Japan.
 
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