Falklands War, 1982, Thread

[FORBIN]

The GR.3s definitely used use Paveway IIs but not 100% sure about the SHAR but could be likely as well. either way they all still need GBD though. I believe the GR.3 uses the Ferranti Type 106 LRMTS which does not illuminate. Back in 82', the Royal Marines etc still need to paint the target.

Exact Paveway IIs

Gelenkte Bomben
2 ×

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(454 kg, lasergelenkte Gleitbombe)

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Others, one very used BL755 cluster bombs

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[FORBIN]

Indeed. Ground designation was the method used, and during the war no Sea Harriers flew with LGBs. By the time the bombs and the GR3s arrived in service, the Sea Harriers were used solely for CAP duties, and the GR3s, which had been modified to fire Sidewinders as attrition replacements for the SHARs, were used just for ground attack missions. LGBs were integrated on the Sea Harriers after the war certainly, but like the GR3s they could not self designate.

Thanks ! but again a question maximum Sea harrier and Harrier embarked on CVs :

- Invincible i have 10 -12 Sea Harrier never Harrier here 10

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- A doubt for Hermes
On Wiki i have a max for the 20 may*, 16 Sea Harrier and 10 Harrier in more 10 helos but yesterday i find 15 + 6 + 9 helos or maybe others Harrier transfered after ?
And based to FOB when, i have see 4 Harrier can operate there.

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* Having completed the transfer of the RAF Harriers from Atlantic Conveyor to HMS Hermes it was now time for the Harrier GR.3 to get stuck in to the fight. It was May 20th

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[FORBIN]

For the 2 types Sea Harrier and Harrier i add, if Harrier is more capable for A2G missions with especialy LGBs more accurate and only fighter to have it Argentinians don' t have the Sea Harrier with her radar is clearly better for A2A missions even with same armament 2 Sidewinder + 2 guns can detect ennemy fighter to surely 30 - 40 km about... a difference.

Engaged 28 Sea Harrier whose 8 in Rfts at this time the last was again in production maybe 2 and maybe 2 lost before the War so Fleet Air Arm have a total 30 in 04/82.

Much more Harriers about 100 whose a majority in Germany, 10 engaged from 1st Sqn.

After we see for Agentinians Air services with much more about 150 combattants with scooter and Mirages !!!

Edit : CV Belgrano here only capable in practice to reach max 20 kn

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[Obi Wan Russell]

Thanks ! but again a question maximum Sea harrier and Harrier embarked on CVs :

- Invincible i have 10 -12 Sea Harrier never Harrier here 10

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- A doubt for Hermes
On Wiki i have a max for about the 20 may*, San Carlos landing i think 16 Sea Harrier and 10 Harrier in more 10 helos but yesterday i find 15 + 6 + 9 helos

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* Having completed the transfer of the RAF Harriers from Atlantic Conveyor to HMS Hermes it was now time for the Harrier GR.3 to get stuck in to the fight. It was May 20th

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One has to be careful about the numbers aboard the ships, as they fluctuated during the course of the conflict. Hermes sailed with 12 Sea Harriers, Invincible with 8. During the war total losses were six aircraft, to ground fire or accidents, none in air to air engagements. 8 additional Sea Harriers arrived in May, split 4 to each carrier. Also the 10 GR3s arrived and all went to Hermes. 3 GR3s were lost in combat due to ground fire

 

[b787]

"Shortly after Menem's statements, the Argentine Ministry of Defense issued a report describing the destruction of the ship as "a legal act of war," a point of view shared by General Belgrano's captain Héctor Bonzo."

Thank you for confirming these facts. Good luck with the court case, unfortunately courts deal in facts and evidence, not emotion or sentiment. People bring court cases all the time that have no chance of success and go nowhere, as I predict this one will.

Do you think evil rich people from western Europe are judged there?
Do you know the human justice is corrupted by Money? Do you know justice is perverted by money?
No there is a judge after death that is incorruptible and serves justice to all , further more there is the historical judge, we will see if the Falklands remain English in the next decades? all empires fade away all, all military might erodes, and the Falklands are near South America, not Europe. Any way the first shot of the war was a murder treacherous act called the sinking of Belgrano

 

[b787]

Date: 23-MAY-1982
Time:
Type:

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Owner/operator: 800 Sqn FAA RN
Registration: ZA192
C/n / msn:
Fatalities: Fatalities: 1 / Occupants: 1
Other fatalities: 0
Airplane damage: Written off (damaged beyond repair)
Location: near HMS Hermes, South Atlantic, east of Falkland Islands -

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Phase: Combat
Nature: Military
Departure airport: HMS Hermes, South Atlantic
Destination airport: HMS Hermes, South Atlantic
Narrative:
Exploded shortly after take off from HMS Hermes whilst on a bombing mission against Argentine Forces in the Falkand Islands, killing the pilot, Lt. Cdr. Gordon "Gordy" W. J. Batt. Per contemporary accounts from Royal Navy sources:

"In the evening of 23/05/1982 ZA192 this time piloted by Lt Cdr Gordon Batt departed from HMS Hermes for a toss-bombing attack on Stanley Airport. ZA192 was seen to explode either just before or on hitting the sea close to position 50 deg 35Min South, 56Deg 15Min West. Lt Cdr Batt was killed."

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The FAA did obtain a demolition in combat in the War of Malvinas.-

Much has been said about the technological difference of our Mirage, Dagger and A4, against the fearsome Seaharrier of the Royal Navy and Harrier of the RAF, which was undeniable.

From this comparison and beyond the successes that were obtained with the sinking of numerous ships, other seriously damaged ones, the breaking of the fence by our transporters, and other achievements, I would like to share with you a little known fact, or illude explained , Which was that the FAA obtained, beyond the demolition of numerous helicopters, the destruction of a Sea Harrier.-

The fact as it is narrated in the book "The Hawks do not cry", by the Commodore (R) Pablo Marcos Rafael CARBALLO (highly recommended), relates the events happened on May 1, 1982 and have as protagonist the then Captain Gustavo Argentine GARCIA CUERVA aboard a Mirage III, on an aerial cover mission (indicative Dardo) of a group of A4B Skyhawk (indicative Topo) .-

As reported by the author, Captain GARCÍA CUERVA, carried out one of the first heroic actions of the FAA, when intercepted by a cap of Harriers, interposed between them and the Falcons, dissuading the enemy to carry out the attack.-

What is now is a textual quotation from the book, which tells the story and subsequent and regrettable death of Captain GARCÍA CUERVA by friendly fire:

"... Garcia Cuerva, afterwards pursued his Harrier until the carrier Hermes, that was to about fifty kilometers to the north of the Falkland Islands, throwing to him with its cannons (heavy machine guns) - This is the DEFA30 system - when it was landing . The Harrier, hit, hit the elevator that flies planes from the hangar to the runway, bent and fell into the sea, in that position the pilot ejected, who hit the water, perishing in action. Paco - Captain's name ascended to Major post-mortem, sweeping the bridge of the ship with its guns, then moving away to Isla Soledad. Without fuel to return to the continent, he had two alternatives: to jet down the Islands and lose his plane intact, or to try to land on the runway at Puerto Argentino. It was decided by the latter, and when communicating by VHF its decision, the "ceasefire" was ordered repeatedly by CIC - Information and Control Center. He was also ordered repeatedly to be ejected, but he replied that his plane was whole and could not be lost.
The Mirage III went to the track and ejected its external loads to facilitate landing maneuvers, confused the cannon operators. The anti-aircraft batteries of the Argentine Army and the Argentine Navy opened fire, resulting in the demolition of the Mirage III and the death of Captain García Cuerva "(Comodoro (R) Pa

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Bajo el título «El primer ataque a la flota» que inaugura, según el documento de 1983, el «bautismo de fuego», los historiadores aeronáuticos cuentan la partida de dos Mirage III de la escuadrilla «Dardo», piloteados por su guía, el Capitán Gustavo García Cuerva y su numeral o acompañante, el Primer Teniente C.E.Perona. Matassi explica que «se trabaron en combate con dos Sea Harrier del portaviones HMS Invincible, al norte de nuestra Isla Gran Malvina». Después que el numeral fue atacado y logró eyectarse, el guía habría avistado al otro portaaviones, el HMS Hermes, «unas 25 millas al este de Puerto Argentino. García Cuerva picó sobre el buque insignia y lo atacó con lo que le restaba: sus cañones de 30 milímetros», después de lo cual ya no contaba con suficiente combustible para regresar a su base en Patagonia. Fue entonces cuando solicitó autorización para aterrizar en la base aérea de Puerto Argentino. Pero le fue denegada, y se lo instó a eyectarse. Dos historiadores de la FAA narran lo ocurrido del siguiente modo:

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[TerraN_EmpirE]

Any way the first shot of the war was a murder treacherous act called the sinking of Belgrano

Technically Argentina Never declared War, and The First shots of the War were the Assault on Moody Brook Barracks, followed by the Royal marines defence of Government house.
by The Time of the Attack on the General Belgrano The British had already launched Operation Black Buck, South Georgia Island had been recaptured and the ARA Santa Fe was depth charged surfaced captured and sunk.

 

[b787]

Technically Argentina Never declared War, and The First shots of the War were the Assault on Moody Brook Barracks, followed by the Royal marines defence of Government house.
by The Time of the Attack on the General Belgrano The British had already launched Operation Black Buck, South Georgia Island had been recaptured and the ARA Santa Fe was depth charged surfaced captured and sunk.

yes you are right but at the moment of the sinking of Belgrano England and Argentina were still is peace talks

The criminality of the sinking of the Belgrano was even recognized by the British, who accepted that the decision to torpedo it was more linked to a political issue than a military necessity, since the cruise did not represent any type of danger.

The former British prime minister would have ordered the collapse to hinder peace negotiations, as the Argentine military junta seriously analyzed the acceptance of the proposal of the then Peruvian president Fernando Belaunde Terry.

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[Obi Wan Russell]

Do you think evil rich people from western Europe are judged there?
Evil Rich People from all over the world can be judged there. You clearly haven't met many Dutch people, there's a reason that court is in The Hague...
Do you know the human justice is corrupted by Money? Do you know justice is perverted by money?
Extremely aware my Friend. Just look at Latin America, where they have the best Justice and Law Enforcement Money can Buy!
No there is a judge after death that is incorruptible and serves justice to all,
You're speaking to a devout atheist, so it matters little to me personally which of the more than 5000 deities on this planet you may be referring to...
further more there is the historical judge, we will see if the Falklands remain English in the next decades? all empires fade away all, all military might erodes, and the Falklands are near South America, not Europe.
Yes the Militaries erode. Just look at the Argentine Air Force, almost completely out of Fast Jets, or the Argentine Navy, which hasn't had any ammo for it's ships weapons for a few years now. And we all recall the sight of the ARA Santissima Trinidad, capsized at her moorings because of insufficient maintenance...
Yes The UK armed forces aren't what they were either. But we can still deploy forces half way around the world and fight if we have to. The Falklands are and have been for many years financially independent. They only require the UK for Defence, in return our forces get excellent training facilities. From the islanders perspective, they have no real need of connection with any part of South America. I live a lot closer to France than the distance between the FI and Argentina (barely 100 miles), and yet, I feel no need to learn French or visit the country. It's also a lot nearer than where I grew up in the North of England, but it is from my POV an Alien culture and a foreign country. Having met and worked with people from the Falklands, I know that is how they see things. Argentina is a foreign culture, and a foreign country, and always will be.
Any way the first shot of the war was a murder treacherous act called the sinking of Belgrano
What Treachery? You have been asked several times to show what assurances were given by the UK Government that Argentine forces outside the TEZ would NOT be attacked. The Belgrano was a Warship, in a War Zone during a time of War. If she had not been sunk that day and the 25 De Mayo carrier group had gone ahead with the plan to launch an attack on the Task Force the next day, with Belgrano's group attacking from the south west, you would be singing a different tune for sure. She was fair game, end of story. You lost one ship, we lost several, yet still you wail like a baby having a tantrum. It is most unbecoming. Grow Up!

 

[b787]

Evil Rich People from all over the world can be judged there. You clearly haven't met many Dutch people, there's a reason that court is in The Hague...

are dutch perfect? get it justice does not exist in the Haya as you claim, they are kangooro curts, they will just judge political enemies, but Thatcher? come on that evil woman sunk the Belgrano for political reasons, the main reason low popularity and the need to have military bases in the South Atlantic, any good historian will tell you that


What do you think this Panel of Argentine historians say? The British care for the Falklanders? please it is oil and a good military base to threaten South America why do you think Brazil is building nuclear Submarines?