F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread

Discussion in 'World Armed Forces' started by Jeff Head, Dec 1, 2011.

  1. Jura
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    interestingly,
    Next F-35 Deal Expected Soon, But Multi-Year Strategy Shifts

    May 10, 2019 https://aviationweek.com/defense/next-f-35-deal-expected-soon-multi-year-strategy-shifts

     
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  2. Jura
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    now
    US, Poland to Discuss Potential F-35 Sale, Air Force Secretary Says https://www.defenseone.com/business/2019/05/mw-poland-f-35/156971/?oref=d-river
     
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  3. Brumby
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    A well written article on the F-35's EW features.

    The F-35 Isn't Just 'Stealthy': Here's How Its Electronic Warfare System Gives It An Edge

    source :
    Loren Thompson Contributor Aerospace & Defense
     
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  4. Brumby
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    https://news.usni.org/2019/05/13/na...hip-upgrades-but-funding-timing-still-unclear

    As I previously highlighted, the F-35's sensors are vacuuming up so much data that the existing communications infrastructure are simply having problem coping.
     
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  5. Jura
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    wondering if it's "collect it all" as in
    NSA is so overwhelmed with data, it's no longer effective, says whistleblower
    One of the agency's first whistleblowers says the NSA is taking in too much data for it to handle, which can have disastrous -- if not deadly -- consequences. https://www.zdnet.com/article/nsa-whistleblower-overwhelmed-with-data-ineffective/
    (dated April 27, 2016)
     
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  6. Jura
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    inside:

    "Everything gets channeled through a central processor that sorts out diverse inputs at the rate of a trillion operations per second, ..."

    how would the author know there's 1 TFLOPs on board??
     
  7. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    Last I heard about it the F-35 computer was no where near that speed. They might also be mentioning performance in DMIPS rather than FLOPS.

    You should consider that they typically measure the performance of the whole compute module which might be multiple boards with several chips per board. In addition there are multiple versions of the F-35 ICP and the latest was announced last year I think.

    Even if it really was 1 TFLOPS (I doubt it) that level of performance can be attained and surpassed with current GPUs. Even a single GPU chip.
    An NVIDIA Turing GPU can do like 4 SP TFLOPS.

    Even the Russians could do a board like that if they wanted to. A single Elbrus-8SV chip (VLIW) can attain half a TFLOPS. Two chips would be enough.
    The chip is manufactured at 28 nm. Hardly a leading edge manufacture process.
    SMIC has been able to manufacture with those sorts of features for a long time already and should be able to produce with 14 nm features this year.

    That is the Russians we are talking about here... So the Chinese can do better.

    China has the Sunway architecture used in the Sunway TaihuLight supercomputer for example.
     
    #6817 gelgoog, May 15, 2019
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  8. Brumby
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    I have seen so many times the argument that the latest and greatest COTS somehow just seamlessly and readily can get adopted into military application that it warrants to be debunked. It is a false argument that does not reflect reality. Chips for military applications are of a different standard that go through a lengthy process of testing and hardening against radiation, EMP and shocks. The emphasis is about reliability and not the fastest and greatest. It is not a subject I have technical expertise but there is a poster (Hornetfinn) in F-16.net who works in the radar industry that did a writeup on this issue which I am reproducing because his insight comes with industry knowledge. This is at least a couple of years ago.

     
    #6818 Brumby, May 15, 2019
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  9. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    Eh. There are other foundries worldwide, even outside the US, which can manufacture chips with some level of radiation resistance.
    ST Micro from Europe is one example. They can manufacture chips with silicon on insulator technology.

    The leading edge fabrication facilities in the US are owned by Intel and GlobalFoundries. GlobalFoundries is owned by a fund from Abu Dhabi. Most of the process development at GlobalFoundries is actually done by Samsung. So Samsung basically has access to any process which GlobalFoundries has access to which includes silicon on insulator. Intel's leading edge fabs don't support fabrication with silicon on insulator technology, heck, AFAIK Intel uses no rad-hard specific manufacturing processes at all.
    The fabs in the US which produce such rad hard chips specifically for the US military also typically use 2nd hand tools or are decades old and might as well be using 2nd hand tools which would likely be better. Guess who is one of the leading silicon on insulator (SOI) wafer manufacturers in the world? You guessed it, it is China.

    SOI is widely used in RF, microwave, MEMS, so telecoms chips. Guess who is the leading manufacturer of 5G wireless telecoms equipment?

    Also, to a large degree, making a specific rad hard processor or chip might not even be necessary if you use an adequate chip and board design.
    For example SpaceX uses COTS hardware on their rockets. They just have a lot of redundant hardware chips so even if they have faults they can work around them.

    With regards to Mikron, sure, they can only manufacture at 65nm. But there are plenty of foundries the Russians can use including in China.
    AFAIK most of the production Mikron does is things like credit card chips for the Russian Mir payment system. You don't need some advanced fab to do that.
    They can simply outsource the leading edge production. If push comes to shove, the Mikron factory is a security measure. Mikron can produce the Elbrus-4S at 65nm which does 107 GIPS and 50 GFLOPS. Which is good enough to make a system with that kind of performance if you use enough chips. It is faster than the processors either the F-22 or the initial F-35 ICPs use.

    AFAIK the current Su-57 combat computer uses some SPARC processor derivative manufactured at 90nm also designed by MCST which will still have better performance than chips used in either F-22 or the initial F-35 ICPs.
     
    #6819 gelgoog, May 15, 2019
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  10. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    Also, you don't need millions of processors to manufacture a couple hundred combat aircraft. That is one reason why the Russian government limits their investments in fabrication facilities. China on the other hand has huge industries which can easily create the demand for large leading edge facilities.
     
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