CV-16 Liaoning Thread II ...News, Views and operations

Discussion in 'Navy' started by Jeff Head, Aug 19, 2016.

  1. Hendrik_2000
    Offline

    Hendrik_2000 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    3,820
    Likes Received:
    10,770
    Ever heard of wet steam Most nuclear power plant are operated with saturated steam They can do that by making the steam turbine large Most nuclear power plant steam turbine are very large
     
    Equation likes this.
  2. vincent
    Offline

    vincent Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2012
    Messages:
    634
    Likes Received:
    854
    More pipes?
     
  3. Richard Santos
    Offline

    Richard Santos Junior Member
    Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2015
    Messages:
    548
    Likes Received:
    878
    More pipes increase mass flow, but does not increase energy density.

    To take advantage of higher mass flow but lower energy density requires larger turbines
     
  4. Richard Santos
    Offline

    Richard Santos Junior Member
    Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2015
    Messages:
    548
    Likes Received:
    878
    Nuclear plants uses lower pressure
    And temperature to reduce the

    Nuclear plants need to avoid excessive pressure and temperature to reduce the chance of radioactive steam leak in the hot loop. This puts limits on attainable steam condition in the turbine loop. It pays for this with reduced thermal efficiency and by needing larger and heavier turbines than usual for the same power output. However in a nuclear powered vessel this is justified because savings in fuel weight.

    Conventional marine steam turbine had striven for smaller size, lower weight, and higher thermal efficiency for the past century. Hence steam conditions have steadily risen from 1905 onwards. In return steam power plants, both boilers and turbines have become steadily smaller and lighter for the same power output, and thermal efficiency have also increased, resulting in higher fuel efficiency.

    To reduce steam pressure would be a retrograde step, and would mean either Cv-16 had to accept lower power output and lower fuel efficiency than Kuznetsov, or must adopt supplemental boilers to increase mass flow at lower pressure, larger and heavier turbine to accommodate higher mass flow at lower pressure, which would result in a heavier and bulkier Power plant with lower thermal efficiency but same power output.
     
    delft likes this.
  5. Hendrik_2000
    Offline

    Hendrik_2000 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    3,820
    Likes Received:
    10,770
    I thought it has more to do with the heat quality of nuclear fission and the fact it has to go to another steam generator and has nothing to do with radioactive steam leak since the primary heat loop is radioactive but the secondary is not that is why they have steam generator But having 2 heat loop mean you need a steam generator there fore create another heat loss unlike in conventional boiler.
    Nuclear plant is divided into 2 area containment unit and balance of the plant . The steam generator, reactor, fueling handling are in containment unit with all kind of shielding. The steam turbine is in balance of plant unit Both are separated by bulkhead . So there were never ever radioactive in steam turbine or you are in deep trouble

    I don't see any problem with Liaoning Henri K did measure the speed of Liaoning last time around they go to south china sea and he clock 30 knot or more ! How they did it any body guess!
    Sofar Liaoning has no problem with reliability unlike Kutznetzov. She has been out at sea more than her sister ship and there is no known serious accident. Since commissioning I believe she only back once to the shipyard for maintenance. It is compromise between reliability and efficiency
    China has highly developed steam power plant industry practically self sufficient and at the front line of technology. They know what they are doing
     
    #1375 Hendrik_2000, Nov 14, 2017 at 10:39 PM
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017 at 10:56 PM
    Intrepid likes this.
  6. Richard Santos
    Offline

    Richard Santos Junior Member
    Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2015
    Messages:
    548
    Likes Received:
    878
    The pressure and temperature of the hot loop in the rector is limited by safety concerns about leakage . The pressure and temperature of the secondary loop must lower than in the hot loop. Hence the secondary loop that feeds steam into the turbine on the nuclear power ship operated under much lower temperature and pressure than is common on high performance conventionally powered steam vessels.

    If Liaoning’s steam plant indeed operated at lower pressure and temperature than kuznetsov’s, and the Liaoning’s power plant can still match the power output of Kuznetsov’s engines, then I think that is prima facia evidence that Liaoning is not using the original soviet power plant. Instead it is using a equally powerful, more reliable, but bulkier and less thermally efficient engine.
     
    sangye and delft like this.
  7. Hendrik_2000
    Offline

    Hendrik_2000 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    3,820
    Likes Received:
    10,770
    If I was concern about the leakage then I would have higher pressure on the secondary loop .So if there is leakage the flow goes into the primary loop and not the other way around
    Because the containment unit it uninhabited whereas the Turbine room is close to control room and not contain meaning the air can leak outside.
     
  8. Hendrik_2000
    Offline

    Hendrik_2000 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2006
    Messages:
    3,820
    Likes Received:
    10,770
    In the hangar of the Liaoning aircraft carrier

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Sczepan
    Offline

    Sczepan Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    745
    Likes Received:
    151
    #1379 Sczepan, Nov 15, 2017 at 2:02 PM
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 2:10 PM
  10. Sczepan
    Offline

    Sczepan Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2005
    Messages:
    745
    Likes Received:
    151
    Could I get it? PLA MC 01.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

Share This Page