Chinese UAV/UCAV development

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Quickie

Colonel
P.S. I still don't get why people think the broader track is EMALS and narrower one being steam though.

That's because EMALS always has 2 lines of conductor running along the track and you can see traces of the 2 lines on the track that is said to be the EMAL type. Curious thing is the other track also has this double line running along the track but starting from the white section of the track. So the speculation of it being an EMALS type too is not without any basis.
 

taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
That's because EMALS always has 2 lines of conductor running along the track and you can see traces of the 2 lines on the track that is said to be the EMAL type. Curious thing is the other track also has this double line running along the track but starting from the white section of the track. So the speculation of it being an EMALS type too is not without any basis.
I am skeptical about the "2 conductor lines -> EMALS" explanation. They could be just the edges of the covers of the tracks. The covers are metal and will meet the concrete trenchs, so two visible lines are no surprise. BTW, any part of launcher will be hidden except the top covers, so the lines can only be cover edges than something related to conductors.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Look at older pics when the tracks were being built. The trench of the thick launcher matches the width of the darken area
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
I wouldn't immediately leap to think it is cloud shadow. The shape of that UAV could be that twin engine UAV or even an entirely new UAV for all we know.

Wasn't it mentioned during Zhuhai that the export version of Cloud Shadow had a single engine while the domestic version had a twin engine?
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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Wasn't it mentioned during Zhuhai that the export version of Cloud Shadow had a single engine while the domestic version had a twin engine?

it was "suggested" by someone on a forum here or on CDF or elsewhere, yes, but we never had any indication as to whether Cloud Shadow was actually directly tied to the twin engine HALE UAV


===

as for this uav, if it really does have the modifications for catapult launch and arrested recovery, then that is quite significant. HALE uavs that can be launched from carriers would provide quite an additional useful ISR tool.
But I wonder if it has wings that can be folded. As useful as this capability would be, if its deck footprint is very large then it may not be worth it.
 

Blitzo

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Would've been more helpful if it were on a cat, then we'd know which one is the EMALS!

Not really -- by the phrasing of the rumour, there is no indication that its testing was only for the EM cat, and in fact we don't even know if it has been tested yet, only "presumably" for EM cat. In which case, it seems like the rumour is being generated based off the picture rather than having a rumour first independent of the picture.

This is different to the J-15A rumour, which seemed to explicitly say that J-15A had been tested from the EM cat, and where a picture of J-15(A) from satellite near the catapults was then seen. In that case the J-15A test from the EM cat was independent of the picture.


In other words, even if this uav was saddled atop one of the two catapults, it doesn't not provide any strong indication of which is EM and which is steam even if rumours indicate that a uav or an aircraft was undergoing EM catapult tests, because rumours saying XYZ is undergoing EM catapult tests does not preclude the possibility (what I would say inevitaiblity) of that aircraft also undergoing steam catapult tests as well.


In fact, all satellite pictures showing aircraft on either catapult does not provide any ability for us to differentiate which is definitively EM and which is steam.
The only definitive way of doing so would be for us to eventually have ground based video showing one or both of the catapults in operation and seeing which one doesn't emit steam and which one does, after an aircraft launch.
 

weig2000

Captain
Cheap, less capable, knock-off, and of course, aero engines (as if they are used on these Chinese drones and are the constraining factor). These are the obligatory charges on Chinese aircraft these days, manned or unmanned. At least the author did not explicitly accuse Chinese of stealing drones technologies.

Relatively speaking, the author of this report is actually quite positive about the success of Chinese drones, if you can bear with the usual grudging and filter out some of the noises that are necessary to make it palatable to the targeted readers of the report (How cash-strapped are Saudi Arabia and United Arab Emirates when it comes to buying these drones?).

That the main argument why the Chinese drones are successful on the international market, is attributed to the unwillingness by the US to export its drones is not very convincing. What the customers need are drones to serve their purposes with good capabilities that do not break their banks. The Chinese drones offer comparable or at least close capabilities to the US counterparts in the same class, but at a fraction of the price. It's a no-brainier for them.

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Published: Dec 1, 2016 6:27 p.m. ET

By JuricaDujmovic Columnist
For cash-strapped countries, Chinese drones are just the ticket
MW-FB007_wing_l_20161129155222_ZH.jpg

A model Wing Loong unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) made by the Aviation Industry Corp. of China stands on display at the Singapore Airshow on Feb. 11, 2014.

Not too long ago, Chinese dollar stores could be found on almost every corner in Croatia, and everyone knew that if you couldn’t afford a quality product, there was bound to be a “good enough” knock-off available in those shops.

The same thing could be said for Chinese drones. Unlike those made in the U.S., Chinese drones are cheap and readily available. For
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, the price of a single U.S.-made MQ-1 Predator, one could buy four Chinese
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units.

Not too long ago, Chinese dollar stores could be found on almost every corner in Croatia, and everyone knew that if you couldn’t afford a quality product, there was bound to be a “good enough” knock-off available in those shops.

The same thing could be said for Chinese drones. Unlike those made in the U.S., Chinese drones are cheap and readily available. For
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, the price of a single U.S.-made MQ-1 Predator, one could buy four Chinese
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
units.

“China is known to have difficulties in developing aero-engine technology, and this is also true for UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle) engines,” Kelvin Wong, an Asia-Pacific defense-technology reporter at IHS, wrote in an email to the
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. “As a result, Chinese UAVs are generally less capable in terms of performance.”
MW-FB090_MQ1_20161130152232_MG.jpg

The General Atomics MQ-1 Predator, made in the U.S., is the most recognizable drone in the world, owing to its role in the war on terror.
So who would buy drones that can’t compete with their U.S. counterparts? Countries like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Nigeria and the United Arab Emirates. With a price tag of $1 million, Wing Loong drones are much cheaper than, say,
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, which makes any losses easier to bear for cash-strapped countries struggling to keep up with the requirements of modern warfare.

So who would buy drones that can’t compete with their U.S. counterparts? Countries like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Nigeria and the United Arab Emirates. With a price tag of $1 million, Wing Loong drones are much cheaper than, say,
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, which makes any losses easier to bear for cash-strapped countries struggling to keep up with the requirements of modern warfare.

But price alone isn’t the only factor in this equation. The main “culprit” for flourishing Chinese international drone sales seems to be the U.S. itself or, more specifically, its rigorous export regulations and restrictions. As a signatory to various export-limiting
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, as well as tight domestic regulations, the U.S. has severely limited export options of its own drone technology to allies and other countries. Those countries in many cases have no other choice but to turn to China, which is more than happy to supply them with perhaps inferior, but much more affordable, drone units.

And China is rapidly advancing in drone technology. A few weeks ago, China’s
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featured many new drones available to the ever-increasing number of interested buyers, as well as an insight into future developments. Those units are some of the most advanced Chinese models to hit the market.

MW-FB091_CH5_dr_20161130152819_ZH.jpg

The Zhuhai 2016 Airshow in China featured the CH-5, which has a flight time of 60 hours and a 4,039-mile range, which rivals the U.S.’s MQ-9 Reaper.
China has shown that in the future it will be more than capable of meeting, or even surpassing, expectations. The show featured the Cloud Shadow, China’s first stealth drone; “marsupial” drones that can be attached to an aircraft and released like bombs; and a video demonstration of coordinated drone swarms. By filling the void made by the U.S., China has positioned itself as a global supplier of drones, a force to be reckoned with.

The availability of stealth drones on the open market is worrisome. Older Chinese models were slow and incapable of reaching higher altitudes, which made them more appropriate for fighting insurgencies and local adversaries. I could easily see how an upgraded model of the Cloud Shadow — along with its long-range weaponry — could be used as an asset not only in local conflicts, but internationally as well.

It will be interesting to see how China’s ever-growing influence on the drone market will affect the global balance of power.The Chinese still haven’t made a big splash yet, simply because their drone market is saturated with client-countries lacking large military budgets. The fact remains that these drones will be more than capable of tipping the scales in various smaller international conflicts, and as history has taught us, these conflicts more often than not fuel larger ones.

What do you think about Chinese drones? Should the U.S. offer its drones on the global market just as China does? Please let me know in the comment section below.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Quality is not really relevant when it comes it drones. Instead what's more important is will it do the job of watching my target and destroy it if I wanted it to. So it's irrelevant on the quality unless you believe a Chinese drone only last as long as a few sorties before it can't be used anymore. But then why would anyone buy it even at one-forth the cost if that were the case?
 

Quickie

Colonel
I am skeptical about the "2 conductor lines -> EMALS" explanation. They could be just the edges of the covers of the tracks. The covers are metal and will meet the concrete trenchs, so two visible lines are no surprise. BTW, any part of launcher will be hidden except the top covers, so the lines can only be cover edges than something related to conductors.

The double lines would not be the conductors itselves but the part of the structure holding the conductors that can be seen on the surface.

On second thought, the narrower catapult is most likely not the EMALS type..
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Check the pics of the prototype EMAL from before. It is the thicker one
 
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