As I said on the other thread...this does not look like an MLP to me. I do not see it configured with the slots for LCACs.
This looks much more like a heavy lift vessel.
Is there any press release or credible article identifying it as an MLP?
Chinese shipbuilding industry
- Thread starter tphuang
- Start date
This looks much more like a heavy lift vessel.
Is there any press release or credible article identifying it as an MLP?
Well, IMHO, none of those pictures could be used to confirm it as an MLP in the least.
So, just he same, until I see some official announcement that it is a MLP, I will be skeptical.
The MLP is specifically for allowing cargo, equipment, vehicles, material to be transferred from sea going bases or very large military cargo ships (which China does not have) onto the Mobile Landing Platform, for transport to LHDs, LPDs, or to secured beaches via LCAC.
I have not seen the PLAN build but 2-3 LCACs, or practice with more than two at a time.
It just seems unlikely that they would make this leap when they do not have the very underlying structures and vessels, or the experience using them to then go to a MLP and make use of it for what it is intended.
I guess time will tell...but if they do make it an MLP, this is how it will ultimately look:
lcloo
Captain
Unless they mounted a couple of AA guns, this ships is no difference from the civilian half-submersible heavy lift ship.
My particular attention is on the red lifeboat behind the super structure. It is mounted exactly same as large oil tankers which indicate it is designed to civilian specification. One or may two of this red lifeboat also indicate small crew, which may point towards civilian crew.
And there are no other small motorised boats on board similar to those on navy ships.
My particular attention is on the red lifeboat behind the super structure. It is mounted exactly same as large oil tankers which indicate it is designed to civilian specification. One or may two of this red lifeboat also indicate small crew, which may point towards civilian crew.
And there are no other small motorised boats on board similar to those on navy ships.
Last edited:
The Chinese ship as we see it is not yet complete.
Also the USN's MLPs aren't armed either. It is their supporting structures for various landing craft and/or helicopters which separate them from simple civilian semi-submersible heavy lift ships.
I'm also not sure what motorized boats or lifeboats have to do with anything -- CCG cutters have similar lifeboats, and so does the USN's MLPs.
-----
The truth is, at this stage it is ridiculous to try and disprove whether or not this is intended for PLAN as a MLP type ship. Given the MLPs that are being pioneered by USN are basically heavy lift semi submersible ships with additional structures for LCAC support and Ro-Ro at sea installed later, it is as stupid to try and infer whether the ship we see now is an MLP on the basis of additional structures... as they simply may not have been installed.
In other words, we're relying on rumours and waiting for further pictures of confirmation, and lack of evidence at this stage (for this situation, it is lack of support structures for LCACs and the like) is perfectly plausible.
Last edited:
We should also consider the circumstances under which and places where MLP's can be used. That is something "far" away from your nearest base, where you are still able to adequately defend them, and near the place where you want to use small boats for a considerable period of time. The US came up with the concept for use in the Middle East. China doesn't have a concept of long time military operations far from home, except the international anti-piracy one, for good political and strategic reasons.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
The one problem I see with the MLP is the fact that they downsized the ships
3 x LCAC is good but in reality they would need double that lift capacity to ensure fast transfer of materials and a MLP that is larger
Next issue is that both ships under going transfer of cargo are stationary it's not like under way replenishment which is done while on the move, usually it's slow but still they move at 10 to 12 knots with the sea basing concept you have a large stationary target out at sea which could be vulnerable
Let's say military sea lift command is holding 20,000 tons of cargo at 70 tons a pop it would take 3 x LCAC over 100 to and from journeys to off load that cargo, refuelling, loading, unloading, transfer and downtime we would probably looking a few days to complete the operation
Also there is a very few MLP ships 4 maybe 5 units at most
My feeling is MLP will be used to transfer limited equipment in limited operation theatre in conjunction with other assets, a small part of a jigsaw that has it's place in amphibious warfare
3 x LCAC is good but in reality they would need double that lift capacity to ensure fast transfer of materials and a MLP that is larger
Next issue is that both ships under going transfer of cargo are stationary it's not like under way replenishment which is done while on the move, usually it's slow but still they move at 10 to 12 knots with the sea basing concept you have a large stationary target out at sea which could be vulnerable
Let's say military sea lift command is holding 20,000 tons of cargo at 70 tons a pop it would take 3 x LCAC over 100 to and from journeys to off load that cargo, refuelling, loading, unloading, transfer and downtime we would probably looking a few days to complete the operation
Also there is a very few MLP ships 4 maybe 5 units at most
My feeling is MLP will be used to transfer limited equipment in limited operation theatre in conjunction with other assets, a small part of a jigsaw that has it's place in amphibious warfare
Equation
Lieutenant General
LCAC ships just don't have the range and large capacity carrying like the MLP ships. The advantage of having an MLP is that it reduces the cost of transferring troops and equipment in one platform than say 3 or 4 smaller crafts with the same capacity. It also reduce risks by using less crew needed in one platform.
The appearance online in late May of photographs of a semi-submersible ship, painted in a naval grey colour scheme, nearing completion at the Wenchong shipyard in Guangzhou has prompted speculation that China's People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) is about to acquire a mobile landing platform (MLP).
The ship is around 180 m in length, with a beam of around 33 m and an estimated displacement of 5,000 tonnes. As such, it is much smaller than the US Military Sealift Command's Montford Point class of MLPs, which are 240 m long with a beam of 50 m.
Other recent photographs show a logistics support ship under construction for the PLA. This is the second vessel with a roll-on, roll-off (ro-ro) design, bow and stern ramps, and an estimated full load displacement of around 3,500 tonnes.
The first of these emerged in late 2013, and it is likely the second is being built at the same shipyard: Dalian Songliao.
The ship is around 180 m in length, with a beam of around 33 m and an estimated displacement of 5,000 tonnes. As such, it is much smaller than the US Military Sealift Command's Montford Point class of MLPs, which are 240 m long with a beam of 50 m.
Other recent photographs show a logistics support ship under construction for the PLA. This is the second vessel with a roll-on, roll-off (ro-ro) design, bow and stern ramps, and an estimated full load displacement of around 3,500 tonnes.
The first of these emerged in late 2013, and it is likely the second is being built at the same shipyard: Dalian Songliao.
kwaigonegin
Colonel
MLPs were designed and made as another piece of the USN/USMC's Seabase initiative.
Beach assault/landing etc was not considered a critical part of the overall planning anymore not long after WWII but gained a new life during the 1st Gulf War. It is now an important part of the overall strategic planning of any commanders.
If you all recall, during that war the Marines did a fake out with possible beach assault and Saddam concentrate a large portion of the Iraqi army on the beaches facing outwards in anticipation of a beach invasion that never came.
I think Pentagon finally realized the importance of beach assault or even the potential of a beach assault to used them effectively either as a diversionary tactics, flanking maneuvers or even an actual multi-prong assault on the beach head together with overland assault.
It has not been lost to PLAN planners as well the importance of such a critical piece in overall mission planning. Even more so in pac rim. I can almost guarantee you PLAN or even the Chinese military as a whole has a seabase concept not too different than the US.
It is quite obvious with the amount of resources and hardware they've put online recently and in the near future with the MLPs, LCACs, potential PHA, PHDs etc. They are slowly setting the foundation to have an effective joint combat projection from the sea as part of their overall military capabilities.
Beach assault/landing etc was not considered a critical part of the overall planning anymore not long after WWII but gained a new life during the 1st Gulf War. It is now an important part of the overall strategic planning of any commanders.
If you all recall, during that war the Marines did a fake out with possible beach assault and Saddam concentrate a large portion of the Iraqi army on the beaches facing outwards in anticipation of a beach invasion that never came.
I think Pentagon finally realized the importance of beach assault or even the potential of a beach assault to used them effectively either as a diversionary tactics, flanking maneuvers or even an actual multi-prong assault on the beach head together with overland assault.
It has not been lost to PLAN planners as well the importance of such a critical piece in overall mission planning. Even more so in pac rim. I can almost guarantee you PLAN or even the Chinese military as a whole has a seabase concept not too different than the US.
It is quite obvious with the amount of resources and hardware they've put online recently and in the near future with the MLPs, LCACs, potential PHA, PHDs etc. They are slowly setting the foundation to have an effective joint combat projection from the sea as part of their overall military capabilities.
Last edited:
shen
Senior Member
not sure about the 5,000t displacement estimate. compare to 055 dimension length of 160-180 meters, a width of 21-23 meters, and displace between 12,000-14,000 tons. even given the large center cut out, the displacement should be substantially more than 5,000t.