Chinese forces capable of rapid deployment - now and within ten years?

J

Jon K

New Member
G'day, Sorry if this is already mentioned in some post I've missed...and naturally this is humble IMHO so please feel free to argue...

With current level of technology, transportation and political realities (ie. Russia is weak and is not going to be much stronger any time soon) China is all but secure from a direct land invasion. On the other hand Chinese political interests may (or may not) lead into situation in which Chinese leadership will want to project power into countries nearby (Vietnam, Myanmar, Burma, Nepal, Mongolia -Stans, Taiwan, North Korea etc.). Even contingencies in which there is will to project Chinese power as afar as to Africa, South America and Middle East cannot be ruled out. Whether or not it would be wise to intervene is entirely different question. The only scenarios in which a traditional land invasion against China can be imagined is a situation where USA and Russia are allied.

Thus the direction for future development of ground forces (Marines and Airborne forces included) could be quite clear; forces which can be maintained without need to totally mobilize economy, forces which can be deployed over long distances in short time, forces which can be supplied over long distances and forces which can intervene in various levels of conflict ranging from disaster aid to a full scale war. These kind of forces would offer China a powerful political tool and more options to handle various crises. In addition, well trained forces capable of handling various level of crises might be useful in combatting malcontents.

ROC has been probably discussed to death, but is there currently Chinese forces which could conceivably deploy, for example, powerfully intervene in Myanmar or Tadzikistan if a sudden need would arouse? Has there been discussions in using PLAAF Airborne troops or PLAN Marines for international operations? Are some new Army brigades specifically meant to be used as rapid deployment forces?
 
V

Vlad Plasmius

Junior Member
China already has RRUs, rapid reaction units, that can be deployed in a few days. However, as far as their ability to extend beyond China's immediate area and to Africa or the Middle East, they currently are lacking there.

However, that's what I think Gwadar port is for. I'm not sure when, but I expect China to move at least one 071, possible some Zubrs if they buy 'em, and an aircraft carrier at or near that port.

This is probably the purpose of Gwadar, to serve as a military arm to Africa and the Middle East. I'm also curious if anyone knows if the port they're talking about building in Sudan would support military operations.
 
K

Kilo636

Banned Idiot
That is why China carry out Peace mission 2006. With first time utilizing airborne and practice with Russian who has many years of experience of airborne tatics.

Presently I don see China having the need to project as far as South America.With most of China natural resources required from Middle East and Africa. China present tatic is to possess a strong and powerful airborne within which can be deployed even faster than naval deployment. Although there is no substitute for the heavy equipment that naval can bring in. China predicted a limited and quick war for such intervention.

China has recent deployed a new type of airborne armour vehicle and comfirm has dedicated airborne units. Most importantly is the purchase of 30 IL-76 and 8 IL-78 military transport plane from Russian. Together with its exisiting fleet. China will have a formitable airborne fleet,not to mention its Y-8 and Y-9 fleet. How many armour vehicle,troops can they ferry in one go?

Fly through Pakistan and they can quickly reach Middle East..
 
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V

Vlad Plasmius

Junior Member
It might raise some noise, but I doubt anyone's going to care. I think China has every intention of deploying its navy there. It'll raise noise with India, but maybe not as much with other countries.
 
K

Kilo636

Banned Idiot
Vlad Plasmius said:
It might raise some noise, but I doubt anyone's going to care. I think China has every intention of deploying its navy there. It'll raise noise with India, but maybe not as much with other countries.
Click to expand...

I think Uncle Sam will raise more noise than India... Japan will be another one that make a big fuss of this deployment. That is why China set up airborne unit which can be quickly deploy but at the same time stay within China own territory so that no other countries are going to say anything about it?
 
Gollevainen

Gollevainen

Colonel
VIP Professional
Registered Member
With airmobile units we must remember that their use is somewhat limited.

As lightly amoured and motorized, as such they are not ideal use for "peace forcing" or "police" operations unless there is very small risk to go against anyhting with even the slightest resamble of army. This was showed true in the various outbreakings during the Soviet union collapce, where russians used quite similar concept, tough more heavily armed airbrone units than in china to try to cease various uprisings. The saddest example was the first Chetchen war.

Air mobile units where forced to fight as a normal mechanized infantry and as they were ill-equipted for it, they recieved heavy penalty.

But using Air mobile units against poorly armed opponents, peoples uprising without any real assests of modern armed forces is equally ill-suited for Soviet/Chinese style Air mobile units. They are not equiped for these sort of operations which are more of normal police grwoud-control and UN peace keeping style missions. Airbrone units are not peace keepers, they are just too expensive to be used as such.

So where do you need Air mobile units? Well the soviet doctrines (Which china seems sadly to follow) mented them being units that are dropped behind enemy lines to cause havoc on low-protected targets like supply lines and ect. There was never any real hope for those units to be able to break free, back to the friendly lines unless the lines where moving to positive direction. (which was excepted to happen however).
But even during the Soviet days the massive airdrops (which are neccerical if you plan to field large vehicles in needed quantivities) were soon realized to be completely outdated. Western airdefence wouldn't have any proplems to shoot down the slow and vunarable transport planes.
Thus soviet started to developt the idea of helicopter assaulting (alongside with the experience from Vietnam). However helicopters have far limited radius so the overall idea of mehcanized airbrone units beguns to fade.

China is only now moving to that direction in which the soviet union found not workable. This I find rather alarming. Soviets had the benefit of huge helicopter armada with C130 size Mi-26s and only slightly smaller Mi-6 that where able to transport the BMD series AIFVs. China hardly has adequate medium size helicopter fleet so it needs to rely on Il-76 and Y-8 to transport its air mobile units...
 
S

Scratch

Captain
As I have understood this topic in the first place it wasn't that much about airborne troops being actually droped on a hot battle field.
But more like units that can deploy rather fast (though air-transports). Meaning the way is rahter safe and there's a secured staging area. (A bit like the NRF, EU battle groups, US 2nd ACR-light [now different unit])
And I think such units are of use today.
It's perhaps more a question if China sees a necessaty to have such capabilites. In a wake of low to medium scale military conflicts around it's boarders or rather close beyond them these units could do quiet well, I think.
And to have air-mobile troops to a certain extent for fast maneuvers may proof quiet helpfull.
 
K

Kilo636

Banned Idiot
Gollevainen said:
With airmobile units we must remember that their use is somewhat limited.

As lightly amoured and motorized, as such they are not ideal use for "peace forcing" or "police" operations unless there is very small risk to go against anyhting with even the slightest resamble of army. This was showed true in the various outbreakings during the Soviet union collapce, where russians used quite similar concept, tough more heavily armed airbrone units than in china to try to cease various uprisings. The saddest example was the first Chetchen war.

Air mobile units where forced to fight as a normal mechanized infantry and as they were ill-equipted for it, they recieved heavy penalty.

But using Air mobile units against poorly armed opponents, peoples uprising without any real assests of modern armed forces is equally ill-suited for Soviet/Chinese style Air mobile units. They are not equiped for these sort of operations which are more of normal police grwoud-control and UN peace keeping style missions. Airbrone units are not peace keepers, they are just too expensive to be used as such.

So where do you need Air mobile units? Well the soviet doctrines (Which china seems sadly to follow) mented them being units that are dropped behind enemy lines to cause havoc on low-protected targets like supply lines and ect. There was never any real hope for those units to be able to break free, back to the friendly lines unless the lines where moving to positive direction. (which was excepted to happen however).
But even during the Soviet days the massive airdrops (which are neccerical if you plan to field large vehicles in needed quantivities) were soon realized to be completely outdated. Western airdefence wouldn't have any proplems to shoot down the slow and vunarable transport planes.
Thus soviet started to developt the idea of helicopter assaulting (alongside with the experience from Vietnam). However helicopters have far limited radius so the overall idea of mehcanized airbrone units beguns to fade.

China is only now moving to that direction in which the soviet union found not workable. This I find rather alarming. Soviets had the benefit of huge helicopter armada with C130 size Mi-26s and only slightly smaller Mi-6 that where able to transport the BMD series AIFVs. China hardly has adequate medium size helicopter fleet so it needs to rely on Il-76 and Y-8 to transport its air mobile units...
Click to expand...

Using helicopter to transport armour vehicle is even more dangerous. THey are heavily loaded and fly very slow and is a big target for ground defense. Using Y-8 and IL-76 to airdrop armour unit is more pratical cause military transport plane is fast and possess greater range,they can pratically drop further away from air defense unit. Althought it will also mean less lethal in attack!

Regarding about Russia in Chechen. Airborne tatic is not to blame for the defeat! The Russia that time is still recovering from Soviet collaspe. Soldier moral all time low. Leadership is horrible(The armour march to Gronzy is sucidal)... 18 yrs old young recruit was throw into battlefield against veteran Chechen fighter!All this held a high percentage for faliure of Russian in Chechen!
How do u expect a victory?
 
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