Chinese Engine Development

Discussion in 'Air Force' started by jackbh, Sep 14, 2005.

  1. localizer
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    localizer Junior Member
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    It you consider F414 is on Tejas and Gripen then this can def be used for jf-17.
     
  2. schrage musik
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    schrage musik New Member
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    are you kidding me, this is the dream engine for the JF-17. It is similar in size to the RD-93 and F-414 so its definitely something that can go on this fighter.

    If you look at what this engine can bring to the JF-17:
    1. Minimum 20% more thrust. From 81/83/86/88 kN in the RD-93 to 100 (later 110 kN) reheat.
    2. Significantly higher dry thrust (likely more than 20% increase here as well)
    3. Engine is certain to be designed for supercruise with a lower bypass ratio and higher exhaust velocity. JF-17 could supercruise like a Gripen E
    4. More electrical power for sensors and cooling systems.
    5. TVC will mean the JF-17 will likely be able to out-turn jets like the Rafale and Eurofighter in WVR combat and hold its own against a Su-30MKI. It will also confer upon the JF-17 significantly improved maneuvrability at high altitudes.

    So yes. Its the ultimate engine for a JF-17
     
  3. Hendrik_2000
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    Hendrik_2000 Brigadier

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    Interesting the company that developed this engine is little know Chengfa according to samsara from PDF> it supposed to be public company or maybe SOE
    http://www.fast.avic.com/index.php?lang=en
    They use to make GT component
    Chenfa aero.jpg

    ntroduction of Sichuan Chengfa Aero Science & Technology Co., Ltd
    2013-10-23 17:27:29


    Sichuan Chengfa Aero Science & Technology Co., Ltd brief as “FAST” was founded in 1999. Trough re-organization from related aero engine components manufacturing plants of Chengdu Engine Group. FAST is a public company which was listed on Shanghai Stock Exchange in 2001. Its main business covers manufacturing parts and components of all types of Aero Engine and Gas Turbine for domestic and worldwide customers. In 2011, CEGC and FAST merged together which introduced more capabilities into FAST.

    As key global supply base, FAST has been focusing on providing high-tech aviation products and gas turbine components as well as corresponding services.Till today, Over 30 years’ foreign business experiences and reputation, FAST has established long term and stable bushiness relationship with many international customers such as GE, RR, Pratt & Whitney, Honeywell, Siemens, SNECMA, ITP, HITACHI etc.

    FAST now has over 4500 workforce and there are over 8 different professional manufacturing plants in FAST campus for foreign business. The foreign business sale in 2012 is $156M up 14% from 2011.

    FAST could provide main typical products vary from casings and ring type parts, airfoils and blades, fabricated honeycombs and honeycomb seals as well as many kinds of combustion components. Other than that, FAST supply contains precision equipment, parts and components for industries related to chemistry, textile, petrol and central air conditioner.

    Relying on powerful capabilities of precision manufacturing, reliable quality system, creative R&D activities, FAST is striving for developing the diversity of the other industry business.

    首页
     
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  4. taxiya
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    taxiya Major
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    It is Cheng (成都) Fa (发动机) , full name is Cheng Du Engine Group co. A full subsidiary of AECC, the other more famous subsidiaries being XAEC (WP-X's and WS-15?) in Xi'an and SLAE in Shenyang (WS-10). Another equally less known is the one in Guizhou AECC south which is making the WS-19 which will make it more noticeable later. The reason that Cheng Fa is less known is probably because it has never owned (developed and built) a certified engine type. But they were deeply involved in many types. One example is the rumoured Chinese twitted and maintained AL-31 for J-10. There is one episode in 大国工匠 telling a story of a Cheng Fa senior technician's improvement work on maintaining a XXX type engine.

    Another reason of less known is that AECC itself is newly established by breaking away from AVIC, let along its small subsidiaries with no famous products. Also, these units usually have numbers (6xx) rather than a name.

    Or if you meant that "Sichuan Chengfa Aero Science & Technology Co., Ltd brief as “FAST” " is less known? It is 中国航发(AECC)航空科技股份有限公司, another branch of AECC.

    P.S. Any company whose name has "中国" in it is SOE by law, or "中国" is legally reserved for SOE only.
     
    #5034 taxiya, Apr 16, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
  5. SinoSoldier
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    SinoSoldier Colonel

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    Rumor from CJDBY states that the WS-15 is about to commence test flights aboard a testbed (not the J-20). Could someone provide a brief translation?

    1.png
     
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  6. Totoro
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    Totoro Captain
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    I am not sure when WS10 was first tested on IL76, but as the airframe itself was sold to China in 2004 (used airframe, ex ruaf) it couldn't have been before that. But at the same time it is sometimes said first WS10 tests on flanker testbeds started perhaps as early as 2002. So it doesn't really say much... We do know that J11B put into service in 2007 still had al31, with further batch switiching to WS10 in 2009.
    So... it may be that we're looking at 5-7 years of flight testing before an operational unit receives J20 with WS15.
     
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  7. Hendrik_2000
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    Hendrik_2000 Brigadier

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    Via JSCh now the main stream media pick up the news
    Top new turbofan engine to power China's carrier-based stealth fighters: military specialist
    By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/4/17 18:09:37
    http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1146297.shtml
    [​IMG]
    A Chinese FC-31 fighter jet performs at the 10th China International Aviation and Aerospace Exhibition in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province, on November 12, 2014. Photo: Cui Meng/GT

    The young members of a team of Chinese aero engine designers will be given an award for successfully designing and prototype testing of a new top-class turbofan engine that will help Chinese fighter jets take on their advanced foreign counterparts, as Chinese experts said on Wednesday the new engine is likely to be installed on China's new carrier-based stealth fighter jets.

    With 124 members who are 35 years old or younger, the 193-person development team at the Gas Turbine Research Institute under the state-owned Aero Engine Corporation of China (AECC) will receive a provincial award during China's Youth Day on May 4, according to a statement released by the government of Chengdu, capital of Southwest China's Sichuan Province, on its WeChat account on Monday.

    Without giving the designation of the engine, the statement said it is a piece of military equipment that will rival advanced foreign fighter jets and represents China's highest technical level in aero engines. It is one of several major aero engine projects of the country, the statement said.

    It took the development team only a year to design the engine, and just six months to finish testing the first prototype, and the manufacturing cycle has been reduced by two thirds, the statement said.

    With the new engine, China's future advanced fighter jets will finally solve the "heart problem," Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, told the Global Times on Wednesday. "This is great, great news," he said. The aero engine is often dubbed "heart of aircraft" as it provides the power the aircraft needs.

    Military observers said China has made astounding progress in the development of advanced military aircraft, highlighted by the J-20 stealth fighter jet. The industry, however, has been hampered by domestically made engines that previously had sub-optimal thrust and life span.

    Advanced turbofan engines are difficult to develop, especially the manufacturing of fan blades, which must be built to resist very high temperatures and pressure, Wei noted.

    The upcoming award is an indication that China has made breakthroughs not only in designing, but also manufacturing, Wei said.

    Despite the fast pace of development, Wei said the new engine still needs a considerable amount of testing under different situations, before it is confirmed reliable and enters mass production.

    This turbofan engine is likely to be used on China's stealth fighter jets in the future, Weihutang, a column affiliated with China Central Television (CCTV), reported on Tuesday.

    Wei said the engine could be related to China's medium-sized twin-engine stealth aircraft FC-31, which could become China's next generation aircraft carrier-based fighter jet.
     
  8. ZeEa5KPul
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    ZeEa5KPul Junior Member
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    Then again it may not be. The Ilyushin is used as a high-altitude testbed. China no longer uses it for that - it has ground-testing facilities that achieve the same purpose - so your timing is off. Further throwing off your timing are the great advances China has made in its aerospace technology (among which we must include testing and verification methods and procedures) in the past decade.

    A better way to estimate this would be to see how long it took for the F-119 and F-135 to go from first test-flight aboard a fighter to mass production.
     
  9. gelgoog
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    gelgoog Senior Member
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    Even with the ground testing facilities there is no full replacement for actual flight tests.
     
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  10. ZeEa5KPul
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    ZeEa5KPul Junior Member
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    That's not my point. My point is that Totoro is starting his clock at the wrong time. There are at least two kinds of test flights: flights aboard and Il-76 and flights aboard a fighter like a Flanker. The former type of flight test can be replaced with a ground-test in a suitable facility, the latter cannot. So using the WS-10's Il-76 flight as a starting point is not helpful here since there isn't likely to be an Il-76 test for the WS-15 - that test is replaced by a ground test and we don't know when that test happened, so we can't know when to "start the clock" (if the comparison with WS-10 is even helpful, which I doubt).
     
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