Chinese Engine Development

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
actually, Liming is normally considered to have been the more incompetent one. Xi'an achieved design and production certification much faster with WS-9. We have rarely heard any issue with WS-9 engine. And remember, XAE is also involved in WS-10 production.

WS-15 has in the past year entered the phase of going through with design certification and high altitude testing based on the same article.

Never heard of WS-14. WS-13E has entered production i think.

You are being unfair to Liming . WS 9 is license copy of Rolls Royce Spey engine . It is much lower TWR than WS10. The production line is set up with British assistance.
Xian did improve the performance of WS 9 to their credit

Vincent just posted an article in CDF China just light up new civilian Turbofan with thrust of 10000 kgf.
They need to have a flourishing Civilian Turbofan industry in order to have a robust military Turbofan . Because then they will encourage sub system supplier and specialization and induce private company to enter this engine business.
This is the weakness of Chinese turbofan industry
I hope with sustain investment in civilian Aerospace this goal will be achieved in due time
 
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Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Revision it is 1000kgf?
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I am not sure if this is google translation because the english sentence is hard to understand
Recently Chinese media reports, Chinese Academy of Engineering, Institute of Physics, heat independently developed 1000 kg thrust turbofan engine has R & D center for the first time in Langfang 100% design speed to achieve the design thrust engine vibration throughout the testing process , pressure, exhaust temperature, chamber temperature and other indicators of normal, overall performance and reliability has been verified preliminary assessment, completed milestones. [/ span]
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(WS500 engine is developed by China Aviation Industry Group, a small turbofan engine, thrust the order of 500KGF. The thrust of the order of the engine can be powered UAV, after modifications can be used as a small business machine power, but also the development of small ground-fired cogeneration, based on the core machine WS500 engine thrust can be developed to cover 500KGF 800KGF turbojet and turbofan engines

It is learned that the turbofan engine is China's first with completely independent intellectual property rights of 1000 kg thrust turbofan engine rating, integrated mixed flow - a combination of a centrifugal compressor and a number of key technologies, with a high flame left border width, fuel consumption low, simple structure, indicators have reached the international advanced level. Next, the research team will continue to complete the endurance test and the altitude test station for small civilian administrative machine turbofan engine model development and improvement of technical reserves.

Military commentators said the peak, there are many military fans comment thread after news came out, most of that small a ton thrust turbofan engine has little significance. The main argument is people's eyes are currently fourth generation fighter F-20 and F-31 attracted, and they hope to achieve turbofan engine 15 fitted out, and the performance on par with comparable US F22 engine, so that the F-20 and F-31 fighter aircraft to reach the fourth generation standard in the true sense.

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YJ 62 mounted turbofan engine, with a range of up to 600 km

Peak said that the exposure of a small turbofan engine has two bright spots. The first is the participation of the National Academy of Sciences traced the first aero engine development program. And this small turbofan engine made it clear that there is no reference to any foreign models purely independent design and pursue design criteria high. this shows that China's aviation engine has been officially confirmed by the Chinese as a national key development strategy, its core technology will eventually be applied to future projects among high-thrust engine, which is also for the United States and Russia and other major powers feel the traditional military aviation where competitive pressures.

The second is a small turbofan engine applications is very wide and very important. China's business jet market is very hot, but the market has occupied Bombardier and other international brands. If China small turbofan engines to be successful, then the future will have domestic business jet a strong competitive advantage. also a small turbofan engines can also play an important role in the military field, especially small turbofan engine is entirely possible to do more than push very, very high, if used in cruise missiles, unmanned aerial vehicles, on trainers , the outlook is still very good.

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It is well known Chinese UAV technology has been put on a par with the United States, and similar models high cost makes Chinese pterosaur UAV and Rainbow series is extremely competitive. However, China is still using these UAVs piston engine (rainbow domestic use five turboprop -9 news photos have been confirmed as rumors, leading to Chinese police hit one UAV payload on the US model and difficult match. If the success of a small turbofan engine, then China at high altitude We will achieve greater success police hit one UAV and UCAV project on the long voyage.
 
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tphuang

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Does that mean we'll soon see WS-13 engines on the JF-17?
I think it definitely becomes an option, but we will have to see if the customers are comfortable with it. It certainly removes hurdles for export to certain nations.
You are being unfair to Liming . WS 9 is license copy of Rolls Royce Spey engine . It is much lower TWR than WS10. The production line is set up with British assistance.
Xian did improve the performance of WS 9 to their credit
If you were browsing Chinese aeroengine forums between 2007 to 2010, there were a lot of threads on how much problems SAC was having (that was not common in other major aeroengine producers).

Just looking from the outside, XAE got the contract to produce both WS-15 and WS-20, which are the 2 largest aeroengine projects for PLAAF for this new generation. Whereas Liming didn't get anything major. That seems to indicate PLAAF was more impressed with XAE's work than Liming. Interesting thing of note is that Taihang series can be produced by other factories now, so it would be interesting to see if they decide to set up production lines in other factories outside of Shenyang.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
I think it definitely becomes an option, but we will have to see if the customers are comfortable with it. It certainly removes hurdles for export to certain nations.

If you were browsing Chinese aeroengine forums between 2007 to 2010, there were a lot of threads on how much problems SAC was having (that was not common in other major aeroengine producers).

Just looking from the outside, XAE got the contract to produce both WS-15 and WS-20, which are the 2 largest aeroengine projects for PLAAF for this new generation. Whereas Liming didn't get anything major. That seems to indicate PLAAF was more impressed with XAE's work than Liming. Interesting thing of note is that Taihang series can be produced by other factories now, so it would be interesting to see if they decide to set up production lines in other factories outside of Shenyang.

Are you sure WS 20 contract is awarded to Xian? Because my understanding WS 20 is based on WS 10 hot section which is Shenyang product
Shenyang WS-20
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WS-20
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National origin People's Republic of China
Manufacturer
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Major applications
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Developed from
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The WS-20 (Wo Shan-20/涡扇-20) is a high-bypass turbofan being developed to power the
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strategic airlifter, based on the core of the low-bypass turbofan
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.
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With a thrust range of 12,000–14,000 kilograms-force (120,000–140,000 N; 26,000–31,000 lbf), the WS-20 has been flying on an
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test aircraft since 2014,
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and is projected to enter production in 2016.
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Where WS 15 is based on SF-A hot section which is Xian product. Anyway it doesn't really matter which unit is doing what because they merge the engine unit into one company now
The WS 10 development was long winding and full of twist an turn because that reflect the low industrial base of China in the 80's And it is their first attempt at designing an indigenous design with TWR of 8 a generational leap. Though the hot section is a copy of CFM 56.

All in all it was a heroic attempt and I won't be so dismissive of Liming. It is like Don Quixote fighting windmill

Now after so many years they do produce a reliable and keep improving it with succeeding model

People should not compare to it Japan because they don't suffer from embargo whatever technology they need they can license it from western country.If you want to compare India is the china's peer in 80's as far as technology is . And we know what happened to Kaveri
 
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tphuang

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Are you sure WS 20 contract is awarded to Xian? Because my understanding WS 20 is based on WS 10 hot section which is Shenyang product
Shenyang WS-20
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
WS-20
Type
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National origin People's Republic of China
Manufacturer
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Major applications
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Developed from
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

The WS-20 (Wo Shan-20/涡扇-20) is a high-bypass turbofan being developed to power the
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
strategic airlifter, based on the core of the low-bypass turbofan
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


With a thrust range of 12,000–14,000 kilograms-force (120,000–140,000 N; 26,000–31,000 lbf), the WS-20 has been flying on an
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
test aircraft since 2014,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
and is projected to enter production in 2016.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Where WS 15 is based on SF-A hot section which is Xian product. Anyway it doesn't really matter which unit is doing what because they merge the engine unit into one company now
The WS 10 development was long winding and full of twist an turn because that reflect the low industrial base of China in the 80's And it is their first attempt at designing an indigenous design with TWR of 8 a generational leap. Though the hot section is a copy of CFM 56.

All in all it was a heroic attempt and I won't be so dismissive of Liming. It is like Don Quixote fighting windmill

Now after so many years they do produce a reliable and keep improving it with succeeding model

People should not compare to it Japan because they don't suffer from embargo whatever technology they need they can license it from western country.If you want to compare India is the china's peer in 80's as far as technology is . And we know what happened to Kaveri
my understanding is that both WS-15 and WS-20 production was awarded to XAE. Note though, i think SAERI (Shenyang aeroengine research institute) is developing it, so that could be where the confusion comes in. We will find out soon enough. But either way, there shouldn't be any worries about XAE's lead role in WS-15.
 

Blackstone

Brigadier
I think it (WS-13 for JF-17) definitely becomes an option, but we will have to see if the customers are comfortable with it. It certainly removes hurdles for export to certain nations.
But Feng, do you seriously believe the WS-13 really is ready for mass production, with performance and service life rivaling or exceeding RD-93 engines?
 
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