Chinese Economics Thread

[manqiangrexue]

This is, of course, nonsense. I didn't mention the fact that the author was Indian because it was irrelevant to the point that he was writing garbage that a number of Chinese readers apparently found quite gratifying to their sense of superiority, just as Gordon Chang writes garbage that American readers find gratifying to their sense of superiority. There have always been those willing to scorn their own people and flatter the powerful in exchange for their approval. African Americans even have a specific term for them: House Negroes.



I was referring to your garbage about Chinese women being fair-skinned and therefore more attractive and Indian women being darker-skinned and less attractive, and your related comments about body odour.

And before you say it, yes, the association between fair skin and beauty exists in Indian society as well, and it is disgraceful there also. To say that women of one race are more beautiful than another is to reveal the limitation of one's imagination, it says more about the speaker than those spoken of.



I can assure you, there are few in Australia who would wish to live in China. On the other hand, there are many Chinese and Indians (and Kenyans Lebanese, etc.) who live here, and I am fortunate to call some of them friends and always honoured to learn of their cultures. I could imagine that current and recent historical circumstance reflects the innate superiority of Australian and western culture, but then I am not so arrogant and condescending of humanity, and I rejoice in both the material progress of other cultures and their efforts to reclaim and preserve their cultural dignity. If only the same could be said of others.

Uh, no. Your exact words were, "...are now being propagated by China now that she is in a position to look down upon others." That indicates who you thought the author is. Word games will not save you. I suggest you let it rest cus you're not weaseling out of it in any way.

Well, my friend, beauty is obviously in the eye of the beholder; anyone can think anything is beautiful and cannot be wrong, but how many interracial couples do you see in the US with an East Asian woman? How many do you see with an Indian woman? It's absolutely nothing I'm proud of but it's the truth. Western society as a whole, has a big fetish for East Asian women; have you ever heard of an Indian fetish? I haven't. On body odor, LOL, did I make it up? Sexual desire is a huge driving force in this world and choosing to live and invest somewhere or not to do so based on whether or not one finds the local women there attractive is an all-too-common phenomenon.

Well, I imagine there are even fewer Australians who wish to live in India. I'm certain in the US but I've never been to Australia so I can't be 100% sure what goes on over there. Are there more Australians living in China or India? Any numbers? The rest of your post sounds like someone stalling his speech time at the UN; it's a feel-good paragraph that means nothing. There's a place for that kind of stuff, but I'm not interested in politically-correct circle-jerk. Oftentimes, if you want nothing but the cold, hard truth, you'll find that you can't run away from obvious roots like racism.

 

[Ultra]

Yeah, like I'm really going to take advice about recognising racism from someone who goes around 'Liking' blatantly racist posts.

Again, you didn't read my post and jump straight to conclusion like an igorant idiot that you are. Do you know how to read?

This is my original post you were refering to as "blatantly racist":

That sounds incredibly racists you know. But I like your last line because it made me laugh so I giving you a thumbs up.

I pointed out how racist his post was, and I liked it for the LAST LINE which made me laugh for the absurdity of it.

This was in his original post's last line :

Oh, and I don't wanna be off topic from this thread so... Chinese missiles are cool!! LOL

Is that in any way racist?


Honestly Lethe, it is you who is the racist here, jumping to conclusion accusing Chinese and China for something that's completely untrue. You should seriously look yourself in the mirror.


BTW, bonus point - I was actually defending India in that Chinese Ballistic Missile thread (when everyone was just rubbishing India) if you just care to scroll back a few pages.

 

[solarz]

When we talk about economic and political progress, we are really talking about the progress of society. Better living standards and more personal freedoms are both universally desirable things, and the more a society has of those, the more we tend to regard that society as advanced.

For example, Star Trek's Federation utopia is a society with virtually unlimited material wealth and personal freedoms. Resource scarcity does not exist thanks to replicators, and people can do whatever they want, not even shackled by the need to earn a living.

That said, it's important to note that personal freedoms, just like living standards, is an end product of social progress, *NOT* a cause of that progress. This is why the idea that "freedom and democracy" will usher in an era of economic prosperity is so backward. It confuses the end with the means.

While "democracy" is certainly a means, "freedom" is an end. Democracy does not necessarily bring about freedom. Being able to participate in elections is not the definition of freedom. Freedom is the ability to do what one wants, and it is intricately tied to material wealth. A common fallacy from democracy-advocates is the hijacking of the meaning of "freedom", and turning it into a synonym for their preferred political system.

 

[solarz]

When I see posters comparing India and China, I ask myself: what is the purpose of such comparisons?

For India, the purpose is obvious. India uses China as a way to measure its own progress. They have good reasons for doing so. China, as an abstract concept, is a realistic goal for India to strive toward, and as any self improvement coach will tell you, setting a realistic goal is an essential requirement for achieving progress.

The purpose is less obvious with China. China uses the US as a way to measure its own progress. India largely flys under Chinese radar on pretty much everything. Sure, it's the second most populous country in the world, second only to China itself, and is projected to surpass China in population sometime in the next few decades. However, China and India are separated by a formidable geographical barrier, have largely separate spheres of influence, and relatively little cultural exchange. Aside from the 1962 war, China and India have little historical baggage. While some in India feel threatened by China, virtually nobody in China feels threatened by India, with good reason.

I think, from a Chinese point of view, there really isn't any purpose to compare itself with India. This comparison is mainly brought out by western media, who have their own reasons for doing so.

 

[Lethe]

On body odor, LOL, did I make it up?

Yes, you did, because everyone has body odour, and the only reason we find some kinds less malodorous than others is because they resemble our own and/or we have otherwise become desensitised to them via repeated and ongoing exposure. Which is not so different from how our ideas of beauty are formed, in fact.

While some in India feel threatened by China, virtually nobody in China feels threatened by India.

And yet, apparently they do or there would be no Chinese circle-jerk going on about garbage articles like the one referred to here.

 

[manqiangrexue]

Yes, you did, because everyone has body odour, and the only reason we find some kinds less malodorous than others is because they resemble our own and/or we have otherwise become desensitised to them via repeated and ongoing exposure. Which is not so different from how our ideas of beauty are formed, in fact.

It doesn't really matter how our standards of beauty were made; they are as they are. I made it up about Indians usually having an excess amount of body odor in comparison to say East Asians or Caucasians? OK, then. If you're so politically sensitive about race that you can't even admit to the well-known fact that Indians often emit a a strong body odor, then we're not going to make headway here. You're in PC Disney Land and I don't go there. Your point in desensitization is such that if you fell down a latrine and no one rescued you for an hour, you'd be desensitized to it by then but that doesn't mean that it doesn't stink nor does it mean that it's your fault for not liking it because you don't live in one. Hey, I also made it up that African Americans usually have darker skin tone; it's because our eyes see color differently when they look at people who don't resemble ourselves LOL

 

[Lethe]

It doesn't really matter how our standards of beauty were made; they are as they are.

That our ideas of beauty are determined by our cultural exposure points to the fact that they can change and evolve over time, as indeed they are always evolving. Your inability to appreciate beauty in other races speaks to your own limited imagination, nothing more.

 

[solarz]

And yet, apparently they do or there would be no Chinese circle-jerk going on about garbage articles like the one referred to here.

I think if you were to translate that article into Chinese and posted it on a Chinese website, you would get a whole lot of "so what" and "who cares".

SDF is an english language forum, so most of the ethnic Chinese posters here live overseas. The whole China-India comparison gets more of a reaction here because western media keeps bringing it to the forefront.

 

[manqiangrexue]

That our ideas of beauty are determined by our cultural exposure points to the fact that they can change and evolve over time, as indeed they are always evolving. Your inability to appreciate beauty in other races speaks to your own limited imagination, nothing more.

Nope, it went way over your head. It doesn't matter what you like or what I like; we are mere individuals and I never said that I don't appreciate beauty from other races BUT the point is that if most of the men in the world are not attracted to a look that is prevalent in a race, then that country could have trouble getting foreign investment. If, in the future, preferences in aesthetics change, and that trait or combination of traits becomes highly desirable globally, then I expect the investment picture to shift too. But I'm talking about the now, not what's possible in the future.

 

[solarz]

Nope, it went way over your head. It doesn't matter what you like or what I like; we are mere individuals and I never said that I don't appreciate beauty from other races BUT the point is that if most of the men in the world are not attracted to a look that is prevalent in a race, then that country could have trouble getting foreign investment.

I think that's debatable.

Most Chinese men ordinarily do not find black women attractive (and I think the reverse is probably true as well), but China has made investments in Africa a top priority, and this has resulted in a lot of Chinese men marrying African women.

Perceptions of beauty change over time, even in an individual.

For example, in my late teens and early twenties, my taste in women was mostly shaped by the mainstream media, so I really liked blondes and had little interest in asian girls. Then I met my wife, and to my surprise, I found that I began to find asian girls more and more attractive, while my previous interest in blondes began to wane.