China's strategy in Korean peninsula

Richard Santos

Captain
Registered Member
Perhaps but the bottom line is that the tone of previous rhetoric about NOT wanting to sit with North Korea and talk has changed.


Nobody in Trump's White House knows what he is talking about much less what anyone else in the administration is talking about, and still further what the policy actually is.

If anyone is so silly as to feel he is beginning to figure things out, everything he thought he had figured out can be rendered null and void by a tweet from trump's account motivated by a bad piece of Foie gras trump had for dinner after an golf outing at one of his estates last night.

It may be hard to fathom the total disfunction of trump's White House from the relative stability of china.

Foreign policy in the US is the perview of the administration. America at the moment doesn't have any sort of administration as it does a traveling circus that has taken up residence in the White House.
 
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Equation

Lieutenant General
It may be hard to fathom the total disfunction of trump's White House from the relative stability of china.

Nobody in Trump's White House knows what he is talking about much less what anyone else in the administration is talking about, and still further what the policy actually is.

If anyone is so silly as to feel he is beginning to figure things out, everything he thought he had figured out can be rendered null and void by a tweet from trump's account motivated by a bad piece of Foie gras trump had for dinner after an golf outing at one of his estates last night.

Foreign policy in the US is the perview of the administration. America at the moment doesn't have any sort of administration as it does a traveling circus that has taken up residence in the White House.

True, but the consistency of the Trump administration rhetoric are becoming predictable and nothing but all talk and no walk. That makes the diplomatic job a lot easier for both China, Russia, Iran and other opposition government to deal with.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
True, but the consistency of the Trump administration rhetoric are becoming predictable and nothing but all talk and no walk. That makes the diplomatic job a lot easier for both China, Russia, Iran and other opposition government to deal with.

Yes. And what we're seeing is the rest of the world distancing themselves from the USA and Trump.

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U.S. Image Suffers as Publics Around World Question Trump’s Leadership
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plawolf

Lieutenant General
We should not get too smug about all this.

Two erratic, loud-mouth, self-centred, egomaniacal hotheads with their fingers on the nuclear button getting into an apocalyptical screaming and pissing contest is not a good or safe development.

Both of them have spewed out so much hot air nonsense already, both would have ample grounds to think they other is all talk and bluff.

That's a very bad backdrop for those two to be playing nuclear chicken with, if both think the other is bluffing and will back down so long as they raise the stakes high enough.

Hopefully it will all come to nothing, but those two, you just can't safely say so.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
An analysis by the Washington Post for why North Korea likely already made it to being a nuclear power and how the best way going forward would be to deescalate and probably ultimately recognize them as a nuclear power to not mess with. It's a very flattering article on how cunning the north Koreans are that I wouldn't necessarily disagree with (except for how they can accept someone who claims divine right as a legitimate leader).

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The Game Is Over and North Korea Has Won
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Jeffrey Lewis
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August 9, 2017


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The Game Is Over and North Korea Has Won
Donald Trump can whine all he wants, but we're now living in a world where American power is less relevant than ever.
Washington Post reported yesterday that North Korea has a large stockpile of
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that can arm the country’s missiles, including its new intercontinental ballistic missiles that are capable of hitting the United States. That’s another way of saying: game over.

Also: I told you so.

Post’s
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. One, dated July 28, is that the intelligence community — not just the Defense Intelligence Agency, contrary to what you may have heard — “assesses North Korea has produced nuclear weapons for ballistic missile delivery, to include delivery by ICBM-class missiles.” The other assessment, published earlier in July, stated that North Korea had 60 nuclear weapons — higher than the estimates usually given in the press. Put them together, though, and its pretty clear that the window for denuclearizing North Korea, by diplomacy or by force, has closed.

Foreign Policy[/a]immediately after the September 2016 nuclear test titled, “North Korea’s Nuke Program Is Way More Sophisticated Than You Think: This is now a serious nuclear arsenal that threatens the region and, soon, the continental United States.”

FP got this one about right. It is about as subtle as a jackhammer, although even so the message didn’t seem to sink in." data-reactid="42" style="margin-bottom: 1em;">Authors rarely get to pick titles, and almost never like them, but I think the editors at FPgot this one about right. It is about as subtle as a jackhammer, although even so the message didn’t seem to sink in.

Let’s walk through the evidence.



And then there is the issue of North Korea’s nuclear test site. North Korea tests its nuclear weapons in tunnels beneath very large mountains. When my research institute used topography data collected from space to build a 3-D model of the site, we realized that the mountains are so tall that they may be hiding how big the nuclear explosions are. Some of the “disappointments” may not have been disappointments at all, and the successes were bigger than we realized. I think the best interpretation of the available evidence is that North Korea accepted some technical risk early in its program to move more quickly toward missile-deliverable nuclear weapons.



We also must take seriously that North Korea has perhaps stretched its supply of plutonium by integrating some high-enriched uranium into each bomb and developing all-uranium designs. North Korea has an unknown capacity to make highly enriched uranium. We’ve long noticed that the single facility that North Korea has shown off to outsiders seems smaller than North Korea’s newly renovated capacity to mine and mill uranium; we naturally wondered where all that extra uranium is going. (My research institute thinks it might be fun to estimate how much uranium North Korea enriches based on how much it mills, if you know anyone with grant money burning a hole in her pocket.)

Unless the intelligence community knows exactly where North Korea is enriching uranium and how big each facility is, we’re just guessing how many nuclear weapons the country may have. But 60 nuclear weapons doesn’t sound absurdly high.

The thing is, we knew all this already. Sure, sure it isn’t the same when I say it. I mean, I am just some rando living out in California. But now that someone with a tie and real job in Washington has said it, it is news.

The big question is where to go from here. Some of my colleagues still think the United States might persuade North Korea to abandon, or at least freeze, its nuclear and missile programs. I am not so sure. I suspect we might have to settle for trying to reduce tensions so that we live long enough to figure this problem out. But there is only one way to figure out who is right: Talk to the North Koreans.

better than designed, intercepting not most of the missiles aimed at the United States, but every last one of them? Are you willing to be your life on that?" data-reactid="54" style="margin-bottom: 1em;">The other options are basically terrible. There is no credible military option. North Korea has some unknown number of nuclear-armed missiles, maybe 60, including ones that can reach the United States; do you really think U.S. strikes could get all of them? That not a single one would survive to land on Seoul, Tokyo, or New York? Or that U.S. missile defenses would work better than designed, intercepting not most of the missiles aimed at the United States, but every last one of them? Are you willing to be your life on that?

On a good day, maybe we get most of the missiles. We save most of the cities, like Seoul and New York, but lose a few like Tokyo. Two out three ain’t bad, right?

I kid — but not really. Welcome to our new world. Don’t say I didn’t warn you.

Photo credit: KNS/AFP/Getty Images" data-reactid="57" style="margin-bottom: 1em;">Photo credit: KNS/AFP/Getty Images
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Well its says something more that the lemmings on one side of the world blindly support their erratic loudmouth while opposing the other erratic loudmouth in North Korea.

And remember this latest report that's caused all this panic in the US could be like WMDs in Iraq. It's not much different from when a Chinese leader comes to visit the US, reports come out that China committed this or violated that. It's about forcing political pressure to turn into action and not about reporting wrong-doings especially when what they accuse happened in the past and not the present. There are some people in the Washington political establishment, the Pentagon, and intelligence agencies that want military action. I read the same intelligence agency that reported North Korea now has a miniaturized nuke that can fit on their ICBMs is the same intelligence agency that reported Russian interference in the last Presidential election that Trump rejected as untrue. Is it that same intelligence agency that discovered China stole the W-88 nuclear warhead from the US just because some stranger walked into the US embassy in Beijing and dropped off a pencil drawing of a "warhead" that happen to have the same dimensions of the US's W-88 warhead. I think I have a book on "US military war machines" that I got when I was a kid with a picture of the W-88 nuclear warhead in it.
 
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Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Noko said missile will be ready in mid August. Now that is news. this rhetoric is getting out of hand


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SEOUL, South Korea —
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said Thursday that it was drawing up plans to launch four intermediate-range ballistic missiles into waters near Guam in the Western Pacific to teach President Trump a lesson, a day after the president warned of
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against the North if it persisted in threatening the United States.

If the North were to follow through on its threat to launch an “enveloping strike” in the vicinity of Guam, it would be the first time that a North Korean missile landed so close to an American territory. The North’s official Korean Central News Agency reported that, according to the plan, four of the country’s Hwasong-12 intermediate-range ballistic missiles would fly over the three southern Japanese prefectures of Shimane, Hiroshima and Koichi before hitting the ocean about 19 to 25 miles from the coast of Guam.

In addition to serving as a warning to the United States, the proposed missile firings would also be a challenge to Japan. Some of the North Korean missiles launched in recent months have fallen in waters near Japan, but none of them have actually flown over the country. The North has said it launched its previous test missiles at highly lofted angles so that they would not fly over Japan.

North Korea will fine tune its launching plans by the middle of this month and wait for a final order from its leader,
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, the North’s official news agency said, citing Gen. Kim Rak-gyom, commander of the Strategic Force of the Korean People’s Army.
 
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Jiang ZeminFanboy

Senior Member
Registered Member
Kim chill down please.

I hope China will tell Kim(before making a military move) to think twice about USA provocations that could happen if China retaliate against the India. I think China doesn't want to fight 2 or 3 front war, so Kim should think about it and restraint.
 

dingyibvs

Junior Member
Philippine is not Vietnam or Korea, they were not under the sinosphere, they don't have the work ethics that that sinosphere country do. Vietnam, Korea and Japan are all part of it.

Vietnam would never have gotten its Independence without Chinese help, and once they do, they were suppose to be under Chin'a influence, but look how fast they betray China? Its very unlikely they will became pro China again.

The same thing goes for Korea, South Korean nationalism is absolutely crazy right now, their media are very anti China and anti Chinese, they are not yet unified and acting like this, South Korean wipe themselves into a nationalist frenzy and uses fake history and said Chinese stole ancient Korean land which by logic now belong to them, basically they want China to give up part of this territory to North Korea. The situation was getting so heated up few years ago Chinese government had to officially talk to South Korea government to tell them to tone it down. In North Korea itself they are not so pro China either, they run their independent policy and never really taken Chinese's interest into considerations.

Just imagine what a ultra nationalist unified Korea would do? A divided Korea will focus on each other, a united Korea will focus on China. A unified Korea with Chinese help will NOT be pro China just like a united Vietnam with China's help is not pro China, do not suffer the illusion that China can control them.

How's the Sino-Vietnamese relationship now? Look beyond the rhetoric, how is it really? The Vietnamese economy is very much dependent on China's and it's becoming more so by the day. Despite all the nationalist hooplas they've only lost islands to China and their ability to challenge Chinese claims lessen by the day.

What does it mean to be in the sinosphere? It means that no matter how hard you try to leave, you'll be inexorably sucked back in. Vietnam is living proof of it. They cannot help but be under Chinese influence as they have been for 2000 years, no matter how hard they've tried and are still trying.

This is why a unified Korea is not a concern to China. Sure a separated one, preferably with a more stable leadership in the North, isn't a concern either, but a united one is also not of any greater concern. They'll be under the sinosphere, one way or another.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Covert op fail LOL. Discussing specific battle plans in the news = more evidence that the US is out of options
US military plans B-1 Bomber strike on North Korea missile sites
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Clark Mindock
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August 10, 2017


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The US could use B-1B bombers against North Korea: Kim Hong-Ji/Reuters

The plan involves flying a B-1B heavy bomber from Andersen Air Force Base in Guam accompanied by satellites, drones, higher jets, and aerial refuelling warplanes. Training for the mission has been ongoing, and there have been 11 practice runs for a similar mission since May when the training was accelerated.


There are six B-1B bombers positioned in Guam, about 2,100 miles by air to North Korea. The bombers have been heavily used in both Afghanistan and Iraq, and have been updated since then.

The news of the potential operations comes as the relationship between the US and North Korea has become very strained. North Korean leader Kim Jong Un and Mr Trump have engaged in a heated back and forth of threats. Recently, Mr Trump promised “fire and fury” if Mr Kim didn’t stop threatening the United States. In response, Mr Kim’s government signaled they were considering an attack on Guam if Mr Trump didn’t cool his tough talk.

Both countries appear to be more than willing to push the other further and further with the threats, however, in spite of assurance from US Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, who has said that Americans have no reason to worry about an impending war.

Should Mr Trump choose the attack plan that includes the B-1B bomber, they would be targeting approximately two dozen North Korean missile-launch sites, test grounds and other facilities, sources told NBC.

Defense Secretary James Mattis, following the exchange of threats, released a statement saying that the Pentagon was prepared for any escalation to violence including an offensive attack or a defensive, retaliatory attack.

“While our State Department is making every effort to resolve this global threat through diplomatic means,“ the statement said, ”it must be noted that the combined allied militaries now possess the most precise, rehearsed and robust defensive and offensive capabilities on Earth.”
 
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