USAalltheway
Banned Idiot
If one were to really examine all the facts and statistics, it would be a no-brainer to conclude that China's military is still antiquated and ineffective. I do not say this because I am from USA (i am American Chinese), but because this is what I conclude from a number of credible sources I read from. Also, I used to work at US DoD analyzing China's military capability (nothing much I was pretty low in the food chain). Anyway, I have been following this forum for a while and I don't understand why you people (Chinese nationalists most of you) spend so much time trying to glorify this increase in China's military potential. Of course China's military potential is increasing- the only way for China to go is up given the sorry state to China's military a couple years ago.
The Chinese navy surely is buying some new ASMs from Russia that will pose a somewhat greater threat to any US CBG but these new technologies have yet to be absorbed effectively and are still nowhere near enough to cope with the massively greater amount of firepower even a single US CBG can put into play against the entire Chine Navy. Imagine the firepower 5, or even three CBGs could use against the still fledging PLAN. The elderly frigates and destroyers would all be massacred and even the newer ships and subs would nearly all be destroyed at little or no cost to the USN. NO Russian built destroyers and submarines will be able to dent a US CBG, despite what the Russians advertise. Los Angeles class subs, Arleigh Burke destroyers, Ticonderoga class cruisers, and the centerpiece Nimitz class carriers form a virtually impenetrable ring of firepower. Not to mention state of the art intelligence gathering mechanisms and electronic warfare. No navy in the world comes close. Period.
THe PLAAF is in even more incapable than the PLAN. Tom Clancy writes in his book Fighter Wing, "if there ever is a 4th generation of fighter aces, it will probably be at the expense of the PLAAF." About half the PLAAF is still outdated, with J-7s in use that are the equivalent of the 1960s MiG-21s. There is virtually no training (except maybe in the more advanced Su-27 and Su-30 squadrons) in the PLAAF; pilots get less than 200 hours of training annualy. As the general sentiment goes in the USAF, "USAF pilots train in the thousand of hours of flight time they get, PLAAF pilots fight to survive in their hundred hours of 'training'." Even the PLAAF's more advanced fighters J-10 and J-11 are no match for the well trained US pilots of F-15C or F-18E/F, let alone coming 5th generation F-22. The only credible threat to USAF over Taiwan or mainland China is S-300 and other Russian-made SAM systems.
None of this mentions China's army, which is easily the weakest of the three branches of China's military. Sure its massive, but is is outdated, has no force projection capability, and its supply system is unable to sustain even a small expeditionary force to fight outside of the mainland in, say, Taiwan. The majority of the tansk are still of the T-55 and T-60 vintage. Even the latest type-99 is still of the faulty T-72 vintage and is still at least a half step behind Abrams, technically and in terms of training. Especially in terms of training. Most of China's massive army would qualifiy as more of a militia than a real army.
In fact none of China's military forces have training even remotely comparable to US and Western training methods.
Sure on paper the gains made in China's military look great- with all the new toys they are gitting, soon they will be a match for any of the great powers, maybe even the United States some day. But I find this to be much exaggerated; the Western media has a flair for seeing their enemies 10-feet tall (think of the USSR and Saddam Hussein). Even in a decade or two China's military may only be comparable to the US, by no means will be nearly as capable.
The perfect example- look back to the first Gulf War. Iraq's military before the war was estimated the 4th most capable in the world, comparable to the USSR's military. It had state of the art T-72s, T-80s, MiG-29s, some of the best artillery, and a seasoned and battle-hardened core (from the Iran-Iraq war). 30,000 US casualties were estimated in the coming fight for Kuwait. What really happened? Less than 200 US deaths and tens of thousands of dead Iraqis, and even worse Iraqi material losses. China's military today is comparable to Iraq's military then- incapable and made out to be much more than it is.
Try to contradict that.
The Chinese navy surely is buying some new ASMs from Russia that will pose a somewhat greater threat to any US CBG but these new technologies have yet to be absorbed effectively and are still nowhere near enough to cope with the massively greater amount of firepower even a single US CBG can put into play against the entire Chine Navy. Imagine the firepower 5, or even three CBGs could use against the still fledging PLAN. The elderly frigates and destroyers would all be massacred and even the newer ships and subs would nearly all be destroyed at little or no cost to the USN. NO Russian built destroyers and submarines will be able to dent a US CBG, despite what the Russians advertise. Los Angeles class subs, Arleigh Burke destroyers, Ticonderoga class cruisers, and the centerpiece Nimitz class carriers form a virtually impenetrable ring of firepower. Not to mention state of the art intelligence gathering mechanisms and electronic warfare. No navy in the world comes close. Period.
THe PLAAF is in even more incapable than the PLAN. Tom Clancy writes in his book Fighter Wing, "if there ever is a 4th generation of fighter aces, it will probably be at the expense of the PLAAF." About half the PLAAF is still outdated, with J-7s in use that are the equivalent of the 1960s MiG-21s. There is virtually no training (except maybe in the more advanced Su-27 and Su-30 squadrons) in the PLAAF; pilots get less than 200 hours of training annualy. As the general sentiment goes in the USAF, "USAF pilots train in the thousand of hours of flight time they get, PLAAF pilots fight to survive in their hundred hours of 'training'." Even the PLAAF's more advanced fighters J-10 and J-11 are no match for the well trained US pilots of F-15C or F-18E/F, let alone coming 5th generation F-22. The only credible threat to USAF over Taiwan or mainland China is S-300 and other Russian-made SAM systems.
None of this mentions China's army, which is easily the weakest of the three branches of China's military. Sure its massive, but is is outdated, has no force projection capability, and its supply system is unable to sustain even a small expeditionary force to fight outside of the mainland in, say, Taiwan. The majority of the tansk are still of the T-55 and T-60 vintage. Even the latest type-99 is still of the faulty T-72 vintage and is still at least a half step behind Abrams, technically and in terms of training. Especially in terms of training. Most of China's massive army would qualifiy as more of a militia than a real army.
In fact none of China's military forces have training even remotely comparable to US and Western training methods.
Sure on paper the gains made in China's military look great- with all the new toys they are gitting, soon they will be a match for any of the great powers, maybe even the United States some day. But I find this to be much exaggerated; the Western media has a flair for seeing their enemies 10-feet tall (think of the USSR and Saddam Hussein). Even in a decade or two China's military may only be comparable to the US, by no means will be nearly as capable.
The perfect example- look back to the first Gulf War. Iraq's military before the war was estimated the 4th most capable in the world, comparable to the USSR's military. It had state of the art T-72s, T-80s, MiG-29s, some of the best artillery, and a seasoned and battle-hardened core (from the Iran-Iraq war). 30,000 US casualties were estimated in the coming fight for Kuwait. What really happened? Less than 200 US deaths and tens of thousands of dead Iraqis, and even worse Iraqi material losses. China's military today is comparable to Iraq's military then- incapable and made out to be much more than it is.
Try to contradict that.
